# Aspen vs Cracked Walnut shells for bedding? (will shells hurt her? see description)



## Felix (Oct 25, 2015)

Hello friends  I have a young rat who I'm nearly positive has a URI. I took her to the vet, basically told them "she has a URI" and just got her on antibiotics last night. I really hope she pulls through, she's such a cutie and my entire family loves her, and she's my first rat (though I knew quite a bit about rats from different sources before I got her.

Anyways, for Penelope's cage she has aspen as her bedding and currently is in a tiny cage that we'll be changing to a bigger one when she gets a little bigger (she's only 40 grams right now!). Aspen is generally regarded as good bedding but because she is sneezing every 5 seconds (but this is when she's out of her bedding too) I figured I would try giving crushed walnuts a go. I ordered two 10qt packs and they should be in next week.

So here's the deal:

I have 

10 quarts of aspen
20 quarts of crushed walnut seed
a cage!
antibotics
and a super cute lil white & brown rat named Penelope (Penny).
1) So my question is: How should I lay out the cage? Can aspen be causing problems? I want to have her litterbox trained and I'm not sure how to go about that but I know that litter should be a different material for her bedding. So out of my materials what should I make for her bedding and what should I make for her litter? I really don't want the crushed walnuts to go to waste. I'm worried they could hurt her to be walking on though.

Basically out of my materials what should I use as litter and what should I use as bedding? If you guys think a different material would be better for use as bedding/litter please tell me and I'll definitely look into it, I don't have much money though. I'm hoping I can use those walnuts in some way though (either as bedding which would be preferred IF it's good bedding or as litter).

2) Does anyone have experience with young rats having a URI? Did you get him/her on antibiotics and did he/she live? I'm really hoping this baby pulls through, we love her to pieces.

Thanks, cheers!


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## FrufflesDaRat (Oct 7, 2015)

I am NOT an expert, I am just throwing in my 2 cents. Maybe your rat has an allergy?(to the aspen) Maybe a fleece bedding would be a good option? Many rat owners use fleece! For your litterbox I heard the crushed walnut shells may be a good choice Also I hope you plan on giving Penelope a friend. Based on your research you probably know what being alone does to rats. Good luck!


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## Felix (Oct 25, 2015)

Thank you and yeah, I'm working on getting another. I know everyone recommends two or more but I'm really not supposed to have more than one--is it literally *impossible *("animal abuse") to keep just one rat? The entire family gives him attention.. two families, actually.


Also thank you for your reply, anyone else want to pitch in input too though? And I just bought cracked walnut shell so I'd like to use those rather than fleece, I'm just worried they'll hurt her to walk on.


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## FrufflesDaRat (Oct 7, 2015)

I hope someone else posts here, I am constantly learning from a few of the members here. As for loneliness just imagine if you were isolated from all humans and all you had was a dog and you were a social butterfly. I think they might hurt but maybe someone else would post and say otherwise?


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## Kelsbels (Aug 12, 2015)

Hey Felix, just chiming in here since you've been working on getting a buddy for your rat. You could inform your family that rats need to be kept in pairs, because it's very easily for one to get bored/lonely/depressed. It can lead to aggression, barbering, lethargy, and lots of health problems. In the end it could cost you more in vet bills for one lonely rat than two rats.

As for walnut shells I'm unfamiliar with it, do you have a brand in mind?


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## Felix (Oct 25, 2015)

Kelsbels said:


> Hey Felix, just chiming in here since you've been working on getting a buddy for your rat. You could inform your family that rats need to be kept in pairs, because it's very easily for one to get bored/lonely/depressed. It can lead to aggression, barbering, lethargy, and lots of health problems. In the end it could cost you more in vet bills for one lonely rat than two rats.
> 
> As for walnut shells I'm unfamiliar with it, do you have a brand in mind?


 Thanks mate. And yes, the brand is Zilla. It is actually marketed as reptile bedding but I've seen lots of people across these forums say they use walnut shells as bedding and love it-- I'm just kinda worried because I don't see them mentioned with as high regards in most rat guides (they're still mentioned to be pretty good).

My only concern with the walnut shells really is that they'll be uncomfortable for the rats to be walking on.

What material should I use for litter if I use walnut shells for bedding? (Or should I use the shells for litter and something else for bedding..)


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## mimsy (Jun 8, 2014)

If I used the walnut shells, I'd use them for litter. My preference for litter tho is wood pellets. 

I have a cage of girls and then a cage of boys. The girls have aspen in their cage. The boys use fleece. Aspen has almost little smell and usually doesn't cause any issues in rats, however that doesn't mean it can't happen. You could have a very sensitive rat. you can always try just fleece and see if that makes any difference.

What antibiotics did your vet give you? If it's not working, you want to let the vet know so they can get her on something else.


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## Kelsbels (Aug 12, 2015)

So I tried looking around online for you about the ground walnut shells and it seems like everyone has this question (however I didn't dig deep enough). This is all speculative: what I'd be concerned with is if the pieces are sharp. Rats love to chew and if the walnut bits are hard and sharp it might hurt them, not to mention their feet. I read that you've already ordered some bags, I would say try feeling it if it's nice to the touch it should be okay. If it's sharp uncomfortable I would say that will be your rat's experience with it as bedding. Also keep in mind that it will need to be dust free so it doesn't aggravate your rat's breathing.

Another option might be Hemp bedding https://www.omlet.co.uk/shop/chicken_keeping/poultry_bedding/9198/aubiose_bedding_-_20kg/ I've been looking into bedding material myself for when I get rats, and was interested in trying this.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

I use walnut shells.... But for reptiles. I should say I "have used" them. They are very heavy.. Not really dusty. They aren't "sharp".. I actually had desert snakes digging in them with no problems. That said, I stopped using them because they came with some bug friends attached... Not sure if they were some kind of tiny beetle or what, but about a month after opening the bag and placing in my tank, I had little crawling friends... Lots of them. They didn't harm the reptiles, and it was speculated (by reptile folks) that they eat the walnut hulls. They mysteriously went away about 2 months later but I decided to switch to another type of bedding to avoid them in the future and because the bedding reduced humidity too much. 

If you use them, I'd use them as litter. If you think your rat is allergic, I agree with others that trying either fleece or a pelleted bedding would be good... There is a paper pellet cat litter made by Petco that works really good (similar to yesterdays news). I also use (for litter and underneath my aspen) pine horse pellets. These are cheap, low dust, and absorb lots of urine. 

Even if you give the walnut hulls a go this time around, I wouldn't use them as a staple bedding or litter choice. They are very expensive (IMO) and with as often as you have to change litter out with rats, they are probably even more so than I remember. 

If your rat isn't allergic to aspen, you could also consider sani-chips... Made by harlan teklad (sold under the native earth name on pet360 and petfooddirect). They are dust free and sanitized... My only issue with them is that they are so light weight they get kicked out of cages easily. I use them for my burrowing snakes now and love them.

I agree with the others about getting your rat a friend. I have had lone rats 2 times (due to unexpected cage-mate deaths) and in both cases, the surviving lone male showed signs of depression... not moving around as much, trying to dig to escape the cage, etc. Feeding and caring for 2 rats isn't much more work than 1... But I'd get whatever issue your current rat has cleared up before you get him a friend (and even then, you'd need to do quarantine before introducing them).


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## Felix (Oct 25, 2015)

That's exactly what I'm trying to do (fix Penny's problem before getting her a friend). I plan on getting another female soon, hoping her problem clears up with the antibiotics and bedding. Change. Right now I have her in a paper-based bedding.Which pellet bedding from Petco were you recommending? (A link would be appreciated). Thanks!(Also, honestly she isn't showing any signs of depression. She gets lots of attention from everyone else and was taken at a young age so outside of instinct she doesn't really even know what it's like to live with other rats).


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## Love My Rats (Sep 3, 2015)

what abot paper bedding like what I use , I use Kaytee Clean and Cozy and it's dust free , it's great stuff


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

I think they changed the name / brand that I used to get... It was the petco brand. It looked like this product, but was a different logo. You can ask an employee which one used to be the petco brand before they changed the name. It is like yesterdays' news, but works better for odor control. I also use pine horse stall pellets.. Which are cheap ($5 for 40lbs) and I've never had issues with them, but if your rat reacts to aspen, they might react to pine as well. 

The paper pellets I used from petco have no scent added to them and are less dusty than carefresh... I never had any dust issues with them. 

I hope you get things cleared up with your rat!


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