# Blue/green tails???



## Ashleysmum (Sep 13, 2006)

Okay stupid question...all three of my rats have greenish blue tails. I suspect its colour rubbing off of one of there toys but thought I should ask just in case there is some kind of weird disease they could have.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

coloured wood toys make pretty tie-dyed rats for us.


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## Scarekrow (Mar 13, 2007)

XD That's awesome! It's probably not the best thing in the world for them, but that's still really funny.

What type of toys do you give them?


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## rainbowstar (Aug 14, 2007)

my ratties tail is discoloured greenish in a spot that's about 1 inch, she was swinging it side to sode the other day as if she injured it but i don't know...any ideas? i don't giver her any sorta stuff that is green or coloured that might have done it...


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## ration1802 (Sep 25, 2007)

I don't suppose you can get some pics, can you?


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

It's possible its bruised. Does it seem tender?


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## rainbowstar (Aug 14, 2007)

no i don't have access to a camera right now..it was tender and she was licking in a couple days ago and didn't want me to touch it to examine it, but now she seems fine with me touching it, but its just such a strange colour.


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## sunbirdx (Dec 1, 2007)

Just one thought,
It sounds like dye, but one thing to keep in mind is that if your rat has myco (and who's doesn't) and they are suffering a flare-up, tails, toes and ears can turn purplish-blue (think suffocation).

You should post pics though, that would be too funny.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

sunbirdx said:


> Just one thought,
> It sounds like dye, but one thing to keep in mind is that if your rat has myco (and who's doesn't) and they are suffering a flare-up, tails, toes and ears can turn purplish-blue (think suffocation).
> 
> You should post pics though, that would be too funny.


Cyanosis (the blue in the nail beds, feet and extremities) is usually caused by CHF not a URI flareup, unless its pulmonary abscesses which can fill up the lungs so that there is not enough room to get enough oxygen to the blood.


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## sunbirdx (Dec 1, 2007)

Sorry, what is CHF an abbreviation for, and is not pulmonary abscess and pneumonia sequelae to myco?


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## rat_ratscal (Sep 23, 2007)

so that's what the "blood" underneath ozzy's tail was :roll:


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

sunbirdx said:


> Sorry, what is CHF an abbreviation for, and is not pulmonary abscess and pneumonia sequelae to myco?


CHF is Congestive Heart Failure

http://ratguide.com/health/cardiovascular/congestive_heart_failure.php

_A noticeable sign with CHF is cyanosis (a blue tinge due to poor oxygenation) of scrotum, toes and tip of tail. This is often a late sign._

I just lost a young rat to this (13 months old), I didn't even have time to try treating him for long before it advanced too far. 

Myco is a tricky topic I have found. The fact that all our rats have myco anyways, but most people don't know that when the immune system is stressed, it allows Myco to rear its ugly head, letting in an opportunistic infection. I would say some URI's are myco-related and some aren't. Myco is constantly bombarding the immune system and by the time a rat is 18 months old, the immune system is a bit worn down and this is when you are more likely to see URI's and other myco-related infections. Myco also is not always respiratory but also can cause genital and urinary tract incfections as well.

http://ratguide.com/health/bacteria/mycoplasma_mycoplasmosis.php

And after reading that I found out that with murine myco, those rats who are going to develop pulmonary abscesses/lesions already have them at a young age. 

_Murine Mycoplasmosis is a slowly developing, chronic disease process. Research indicates that while M. pulmonis has been shown to colonize ciliated epithelium of the upper and lower respiratory tracts in rat kittens, the small microscopic lesions may not be detected until the rat reaches 2 to 6 months of age, and the obstructive lung disease that results may not show until the rat is 12-18 months_


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## sunbirdx (Dec 1, 2007)

Such a horrible disease....


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## rainbowstar (Aug 14, 2007)

well she seems fine and the spot is clearing up..so hopefully it was just a bruise...i'll keep you guys posted...thanks so much!!!!!!!!


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

i always thought of myco like asthma for rats, but from that it seems more like HIV, would this be a fair comparison?

there are different strains of myco too? i mean, i know there are different ones where one rat will have a certain one from one store and a different one at another store but are fine until they meet, but the effects are still the same. i didn't know there was strains that caused different illnesses as well. mind you, i thought it was like ratty asthma too...


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Ahh and twitch there's also CAR Bacillus that people think is severe myco...

There's different strains of myco..some are very weak and never influence the rat's health and there are deadly ones, plus one area of rats may be "immune" to their particular strain but a rat from another area may succumb. Myco is such a rotten thing. 

Sorry for the hijack Ashleysmum, glad to hear your girl is okay now


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## sunbirdx (Dec 1, 2007)

It sort of is like ratty asthma, but progressive. Rats are born without it and acquire it from their mom, sometimes en utero. Rats can be born Myco free, but they are typically born via cesarian section, kept sterile and bottle fed.

Myco is a bacteria, and there are more and less virulent strains. Unfortunately bacteria can exchange genetic material, so there are likely new strains developing all the time. The disease is progressive, and usually starts with little affect but gradually overtime the rat succumbs to secondary infections, pulmonary abscesses, pneumonia etc ect.

The best thing we can do is keep their wee immune systems boosted, keep their diet balanced, and keep their cages clean.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

sunbirdx said:


> It sort of is like ratty asthma, but progressive. Rats are born without it and acquire it from their mom, sometimes en utero. Rats can be born Myco free, but they are typically born via cesarian section, kept sterile and bottle fed.
> 
> Myco is a bacteria, and there are more and less virulent strains. Unfortunately bacteria can exchange genetic material, so there are likely new strains developing all the time. The disease is progressive, and usually starts with little affect but gradually overtime the rat succumbs to secondary infections, pulmonary abscesses, pneumonia etc ect.
> 
> The best thing we can do is keep their wee immune systems boosted, keep their diet balanced, and keep their cages clean.


The reference to asthma is wrong, what about genital myco? there's no respiratory system down there! :roll:


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## sunbirdx (Dec 1, 2007)

I wouldn't say it was wrong (rather I would suggest you say incomplete) as asthma is a chronic respiratory illness that causes inflammation of the airways, much like myco. They are very different in origin, treatment and end result but it isn't a bad analogy. You can even think of keeping respiratory flare ups down in the same way you would with an asthmatic ie. avoidance of irritants. Yes, I neglected to mention genital myco. I think the typical sign presented is respiratory, but it is good to keep the genital infections in mind.


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## DFW_Rat_Luvr (Aug 29, 2007)

do you possibly mean CONgenital? myco is an affectation of the respiratory system, and since there is no respiratory system in the genitals obviously, I am beyond confused.


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## sunbirdx (Dec 1, 2007)

Mycoplasma can cause genital infections. It is much less common and really not what most think about when thinking of myco. Myco isn't congenital, as there is not genetic component to it's spread.

This is what the ratguide says about the genital component:
In genital infections, the organism may be a cause of pyometra or purulent endometritis (inflammation of the lining of the uterus), salpingitis (inflammation of fallopian tubes), and perioophoritis (inflammation of ovaries). The signs may range from clinically inapparent symptoms to abdominal distention or signs of blood-tinged uterine discharge. Hematuria (blood tinged urine) from a concurrent urinary tract infection may also be present. 
Where chronic uterine infections are attributed to Mycoplasma, decreased litter sizes may also result.


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

is all the information your getting for this just on ratguide or are there others sources i can read as well. there's seems to be a lot about myco i was not aware of and i would like to learn more. 

it also seems much more like HIV then asthma the more information i'm receiving here. where its progressive and weakens the immune system, and the causes of death is not directly from the myco but rather from opportunistic infections that would have been fought off had it the myco not deteriorated the immune system. though the asthma analogy still stands fairly well with respiratory related myco it would seem as asthma can be progressive as well depending on how the attacks are treated and other factors.


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## BlueSkyy (Sep 27, 2007)

is there such a thing as rattie asthma? if there is, i think Napoleon has it. he hasn't stopped sneezing/sniffling since the day i got him, but he still shows no signs of any illness. (if you want to know the background/symtoms, it's in a post i made a while back - i don't want to hijack the thread!)


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

BlueSkyy said:


> is there such a thing as rattie asthma? if there is, i think Napoleon has it. he hasn't stopped sneezing/sniffling since the day i got him, but he still shows no signs of any illness. (if you want to know the background/symtoms, it's in a post i made a while back - i don't want to hijack the thread!)


This poor thread has been hijacked completely...good thing is the girl with the pretty tail is okay now. 

Rats can have allergies and rhinitis as well as respiratory infections. Is there any porphyrin that sticks around, (eyes or nose), no changes in activity levels or appetite? 

Rats that have narrow skulls often have sinus issues...one of the reason's breeders try for wider heads.


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## DFW_Rat_Luvr (Aug 29, 2007)

[quote="lilspaz68"Rats that have narrow skulls often have sinus issues...one of the reason's breeders try for wider heads. [/quote]

Now THAT is interesting!


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

twitch said:


> is all the information your getting for this just on ratguide or are there others sources i can read as well. there's seems to be a lot about myco i was not aware of and i would like to learn more.
> 
> it also seems much more like HIV then asthma the more information i'm receiving here. where its progressive and weakens the immune system, and the causes of death is not directly from the myco but rather from opportunistic infections that would have been fought off had it the myco not deteriorated the immune system. though the asthma analogy still stands fairly well with respiratory related myco it would seem as asthma can be progressive as well depending on how the attacks are treated and other factors.


Twitch, 

I use the ratguide because it has some of the most recent information. Other sites will put up info and never modify it, where I know that the ratguide updates theirs when they can. I have worked with the ratguide "team" to put up my own case histories on there. 

but there are other sources as well...

RMCA article (This article isn't bad, but some RMCA articles I don't always agree with)
http://www.rmca.org/Articles/myco.htm

this one is written by a vet (ignore the treatments, they seem to be out of date)
http://www.veterinarypartner.com/Content.plx?P=A&S=0&C=0&A=1437

I can find more, but someone is PM'g me about their rat and I need to go, so if its not enough, let me know


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

that should be plenty to get me started. thanks for helping me out


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