# Life expectancy?



## Ratologist (Nov 24, 2016)

I keep hearing that pet store rats live 1-2 years and breeder rats live 2-3. Is this accurate? Any idea how much of their expected life span has to do with genetics and how much is environment? I'd love to hear stories of rats that have lived a particularly long time (past 2 years, for sure) and what circumstances came together to help them live that long. I'd also be interested in know where people got their rats and how long they ended up living. 

I'm concerned that circumstances outside of our control (genetics and unhealthy environment) have already contributed to a shorter life span for our little ladies, and I'm trying to gather info to help them live as long as possible. I also kind of want to know what to expect, as difficult as it is to face the facts.


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## Ladylazerstar702 (Sep 15, 2016)

I've never personally had a rat pass from old age. However, my first introduction to rats was my neighbor and best friend who had an elderly hairless lady. The girl was 2 1/3 years old. She didn't pass naturally, she was covered in tumors and could barely move anymore so they had decided to put her to sleep. She had an incredibly strong will to live and I truly believe she could have made it at least 4-6 months longer if they hadn't made that choice, but in the end it was best for her. She was from a pet store, and being hairless she " shouldn't " have lived that long in the first place. These life span predictions are just averages and don't necessarily bring into consideration ALL pets. You could try asking the breeder, if they came from one how long that line lives for.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Life expectancy is never in stone for either petstore/BYB rats or breeders. Even if a rat lives a long time, is it relatively healthy into old age or sickly and you have to constantly medicate or remove tumors etc? A breeder has to work on the life expectancy so its also not an automatic as there are a lot of lesser breeders out of there more worried about color, coat type, the perfect ear set then health/life expectancy. I have had "breeder" rats that have only lived shorter lives with many issues and my last boy from the group (HAD to be neutered as he all the males I took in (as rescues) were hormonally aggressive). This boy has no respiratory issues, not lumps and bumps, does have HED, and he's going to be 3 years old in January. The other boys died much earlier of lumps bumps and respiratory...same lines, same breeder.
I have 2 rescue girls left from a group of 5. One died very young. then the next 2 died around 2 years old. Of the last 2, who are both 3 year olds, one is not in good shape, has a tumor and respiratory, and her sister is in fantastic shape except for HED and has no issues. 
The only thing you can do is give the rat's natural lifespan as good a chance as possible with a low fat/protein/sugar/salt diet, lots of exercise, fresh water and mental stimulation. Vet trips/antibiotics as soon as they get sick, etc. This is how you will get longevity out of your babies.


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## Ratologist (Nov 24, 2016)

Our rats *did* come from a breeder, but not one that I would consider responsible. We didn't know that, of course, when we made an appointment, and once we were there we found it impossible to leave without a pair. I have had some communication with the breeder about the state of her house and the health of her rats, but she stopped replying after one exchange. She claims to breed for longevity, but, given the state of things, I find that hard to believe. 

Given those circumstances (really bad air quality, crowded/stressful conditions), I'm wondering what we can legitimately hope for. One week after they came home with us, we were at the vet. Both had upper respiratory infections. I'm wondering what people have done that they think may have led to longer life for their rats. We are quite conscious of air quality and nutrition, drafts and temperature, exercise and free range time...but, of course, there's always more to learn. And the information that's out there is sometimes contradictory. (Just started reading about Green Mush last week, for example...) And, I guess, I wonder if it's just too much to hope for a life span beyond two years if they started out so stressed.


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## Ratologist (Nov 24, 2016)

Lilspaz68, thanks for your reply. I was interrupted several times while composing my previous post. So, I was more responding to the suggestion to ask the breeder, not to your post. It sounds like we're on the right track. And it's also, as I suspected: somewhat unpredictable. 

I'm still interested in other stories. So, keep posting! Thanks everyone!


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## moonkissed (Dec 26, 2011)

The average life span for pet rats is 2-3 years. Some live shorter, some live longer. 

Pet store vs breeder for life span may not be any different. Life span can have so many factors involved. I don't even really judge by life span at all. What really matters is the quality of life. If a rat lives to 2 and their entire life is fully, active, healthy and they die a peaceful quick death..yay! But if a rat lives to be three but from 1-3 they are constantly sick, just chronic suffering all the time. And the last 6 months they just slowly get worse and worse until they finally pass or have to be put down.. that would not make me happy just because they lived longer.

So you can't really judge on the life span alone. 

There can be some difference between good breeding vs bad breeding (mills, BYBs). 
Alot of very important key factors start before the rat is even born! Genetic health- are they more prone to health issues, tumors, heart problems, etc... and temperament as well which can lead to stress issues, which in turn leads to health issues!
Also healthy moms are so important! Starting with a mom that is the proper age, weight, health, so she can properly pass on good nutrition for her litter. And also a mom with good temperament, a wonderful lick the rat study proves that less anxious moms make better temperament babies. 
And then the mom has good nutrition and passes that on to the babies. The babies all get to eat properly and grow at good rates for development. 

This all builds a good foundation for their entire lifes! This makes stronger, healthier rats. They should be less prone to health issues and if they get sick they are better equipped to fight it off.
With good breeding you know that the rats were bred at proper times and in proper health and with good temperament. They are being fed good food. The babies are not taken away too early and not being exposed to bad care/environments. They also shouldn't be breeding sick rats or rats with a history of health issues.
But ALOT of the time with mills, BYB, etc... moms are bred super young and often. They are often kept in cramped crowded environments. And are almost always taken away way too young from their moms. They likely don't know the history or care. If a rat is healthy enough to be sold thats great, but most health issues may not pop up until they are older.

But besides that good husbandry is going to be maybe the biggest role in keeping healthy rats. 
Healthy diet is incredibly important! Keeping your rats a nice healthy weight, staying away from carcinogens, keeping their diets well balanced, low fat/sugars. 
Keeping their cage very well clean and maintained. Ammonia issues play a huge role in their respiratory health. Use a good bedding, well ventilated cage, and keep it clean!
Make sure their environment is good- no smoking, air fresheners, candles, etc.... 

I like to think of it like this... 
Rat A came from a mill.
Rat B came from a good breeder.

Both are still able to get sick. But rat A is going to have a higher chance at getting sick, getting sick easier and the worst is that it will be harder to recover if they do and it is more likely to return. You may have to work harder on keeping up on their care to make up for it. 

Don't think that getting a rat from a bad source is hopeless or that getting a rat from a breeder makes them in a magic bubble of safety! And do know that not all breeders are the same. Just because someone pairs two rats together on purpose doesn't mean they are doing anything right. I always suggest looking at the ages they breed, the ages they separate and rehome. Do they have specific lines that they focus on (non rainbow litters- so focus on soemthing specific). That they have bred for generations. That means they should know the history of their lines. New varieties are going to be harder to say still.

I wrote a page on my website that only discusses Myco/URIs and tumors and how breeding vs care matters. If anyone wants to read it!
http://www.onceuponamischief.com/health-of-my-rats


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## Ratologist (Nov 24, 2016)

Thanks so much for all the good info and for taking the time to write such a thorough post!


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## thepumpkinrat (Oct 30, 2016)

This doesn't answer your question, but I actually saw someone on a rat facebook group post a picture the other day of their four year old rat! He was actually in pretty good health despite his age.


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

A rat's life expectancy is probably 50% to 60% genetics and 50% environment. In the environment part you have: quality of food, quality of vet care, how clean the cage is, the love you give them, how much fun they have, how much excercise they get (wheel and outside cage play time). Rats from REPUTABLE breeders will ON AVERAGE live longer and healthier life, everything else equal. I really have to stress the REPUTABLE word as not all rat breeders are created equal, far from it. At the very least, avoid pet store rats as they ALL come from horribly filthy and cruel places called rat mills- they are bred over and over without any consideration for health or temperament and only get handled very abusively making them often afraid of humans. Sure there are a few exceptions- but on average, that is how things are.


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## Nieve5552 (May 20, 2014)

I live in New Zealand, where there are no feeder breeding of rats as we have zero snakes, either in the wild or as pets. There are no pets here that need to be fed feeder rats, so zero feeder breeding and no large scale rat mills (excluding the ones for research purposes of course, but they wouldnt be sold as pets) which is great. In the pet shops here rats arent always readily available, even though they arent hugely popular as pets, so I imagine the shops only get litters from a couple odd breeders only when they can get some. 

I get monthly update emails from the rat rescue group here, and they have some sanctuary rats that they keep as they are too old or have special needs, so cant be adopted out. Quite frequently I see that these sanctuary rats pass close to or past the 3 year mark, and I attribute it to good genes that are not tainted from feeder breeding (selective breeding for fast growth and large size with no regard for long term health). 

My first pair of rats from this rescue recently passed away from age related health problems http://www.ratforum.com/showthread.php?340449-Goodbye-Chamois-and-Wolf-my-first-little-ratties-( at 2 yrs and 8 months, which I think is not too bad. 
Im hoping to do some statistical analysis and compare the lifespans of the NZ rescue rats to rats from other countries when I have some time. Hopefully the rescue will have a record of their past sanctuary rats, and I may be able to get some more data from the public through their FB page


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## Ratologist (Nov 24, 2016)

Wow! That is super interesting! I'd love to know what you find out!


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

I mentioned quality of foods and excercise, but I wanted to be a little more specific on that. By quality of food I meant a quality rat pellet (Oxbow is the best in my opinion) BUT also lots of fresh veggies, greens, little bit of fruits, little bit of seeds and nuts...just a rat pellet or rat pellet + just a little bit of veggies once or twice a week is NOT enough. Yes, a rat pellet has all the vitamins/minerals (supposedly as Oxbow wouldn't disclose the exact vitamins/minerals content), BUT remember that all those vitamins/minerals are ARTIFICIAL and not of the quality required for human consumption- some of those artificial vitamins/minerals have even been linked to degenerative diseases. 

Make sure that your rats are lean and stay lean throughout their life- weigh them at least twice a month. Overweight rats will definitely live a shorter life and have more health issues. 

Do a quick health exam of your rats twice a month so you can catch health problems early. 

I would also have amoxicillin and Baytril on hands AT ALL TIMES in case your vet is away or the next available appointment is days away; a rat can go downhill really fast and die from a respiratory infection within 24 hours or less.


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

Gribouilli said:


> A rat's life expectancy is probably 50% to 60% genetics and 50% environment. In the environment part you have: quality of food, quality of vet care, how clean the cage is, the love you give them, how much fun they have, how much excercise they get (wheel and outside cage play time). Rats from REPUTABLE breeders will ON AVERAGE live longer and healthier life, everything else equal. I really have to stress the REPUTABLE word as not all rat breeders are created equal, far from it. At the very least, avoid pet store rats as they ALL come from horribly filthy and cruel places called rat mills- they are bred over and over without any consideration for health or temperament and only get handled very abusively making them often afraid of humans. Sure there are a few exceptions- but on average, that is how things are.


A rat's life expectancy is probably 50% to 60% genetics and 40 to 50% environment.

I mentioned in my previous post the quality of foods you feed your rats and exercise, but I wanted to be a little more specific on that. By quality of food I meant a quality rat pellet (Oxbow is the best in my opinion) BUT also lots of fresh veggies, greens, little bit of fruits, little bit of seeds and nuts...just a rat pellet or rat pellet + just a little bit of veggies once or twice a week is NOT enough. Yes, a rat pellet has all the vitamins/minerals (supposedly as Oxbow wouldn't disclose the exact vitamins/minerals content), BUT remember that all those vitamins/minerals are ARTIFICIAL and not of the quality required for human consumption- some of those artificial vitamins/minerals have even been linked to degenerative diseases. Make sure that your rats are lean and stay lean throughout their life- weigh them at least twice a month. Overweight rats will definitely live a shorter life and have more health issues. Do a quick health exam of your rats twice a month so you can catch health problems early. I would also have amoxicillin and Baytril on hands AT ALL TIMES in case your vet is away or the next available appointment is days away; a rat can go downhill really fast and die from a respiratory infection within 24 hours or less.


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## Ratologist (Nov 24, 2016)

How do you keep antibiotics on hand? Do you get them from your vet? Order online?


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

Ratologist said:


> How do you keep antibiotics on hand? Do you get them from your vet? Order online?


I order the rat antibiotics online without a prescription. I always have amoxicillin, Baytril, and doxycycline on hands- doxy isn't really necessary if you have the other two though. So far I have been lucky and used them only a couple times. I have many rats and will keep having them...I know that soon or later, having the antibiotics on hands will save one of my rats...I have a great vet but he might be away or I might have to wait days to get an appointment...or a rat might get lethargic during the night and the roads are covered in snow...you never know. Rats can go from great to lethargic and dead within 24 hours or less. I can't recall how many times I read a thread about a rat who died from a respiratory infection because the person had to wait a few days before getting a vet appointment


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## ILoveMyMonsters (May 25, 2012)

Rats average between 2-3 years across the board typically. My hairless and feeder bin rats tended to die sooner and/or have more health issues, but that is just my experience. I had rats die as young as 14 months (renal failure on an fZ-type hairless rat), and my oldest died at 3.5 years old. He, "Tanto," was a rat I acquired through an animal shelter when was between 12-18 months old. He and his companions had been abandoned in a box near to a dumpster. I don't know anything before that as far as his history or breeding. He developed hyperthyroidism and Intervebitular Disk Disease, but it took a heart attack at 3.5 to finally take him down. He was active and stubborn as all **** pretty much until the end. All of mine were fed Oxbow food, got generous vet care, and I kept them active. I've never had a breeder rat so I can't really speak for them.


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