# Tail amputation or euthanasia???



## Skylos (Jun 25, 2012)

My rat Skylos is about 20 months old, male, and otherwise healthy except for the occasional myco flareup. He had a small bump on his tail that wasn't bothering him or a big deal, and it stayed as it was for months. Then it got a bit bigger and formed a scab, the scab was either chewed or came off, and so I put him on anti-biotics to prevent infection. It got infected anyway so I took him to the vet, and they said carry on with the antibiotics (baytril) and also dress the wound. It just got worse, and bigger. 

I took him to the vet again and they took a swab which was sent to the lab and cultured so we could find out what the infection was and better target the antibiotics. Unfortunately, his next symptoms occured over the recent double bank holiday and the vet was closed for 5 consecutive days, as was the lab we were waiting for results from. This was a lump on one side of his groin area (possibly a swollen lymph node, possibly a tumour) and swollen feet. The foot swelling carried on until they were four times their normal size, and this totally interfered with his mobility - he couldn't walk like this. 

When the vet opened I called but my vet was on personal leave, and the vet I spoke to was not very helpful. Also, the lab result showed no growth that would explain the tail. I asked for different antibiotics and also for pain meds and anti inflamatories - trimethoprim-sulfa, prednisone, and strong pain meds - which were prescribed. The swelling reduced in his feet allowing some mobility again, but also some sores appeared on them with a small amount of hard-ish greeny yellow pus, and the joint is still a bit swollen and stiff. The lump in his groin remained exactly the same and the tail continued to get worse. 

I took him in again when I noticed that there was a line of infection spreading down his tail, with a green pusy looking line further down his tail too. The vet took samples from the lump (she found lymphatic tissue and white blood cells) from his feet, and from his tail (she saw what she expected but also some uniformly abnormal cells that she did not recognize). Maybe cancerous? Now the tail is turning black at the end (quite far from the now huge lump, but a couple of inches of it are turning black from the tip up. The vet isn't happy to amputate the tail because the prognosis isn't good enough with the other problems he has, but we don't know what is causing that or whether it is even related. 

What on earth should I do now? Is there something someone has heard of that could explain all these symptoms? I've given all medication as instructed and it isn't helping, and I don't know why. Now I am meant to be going away for 10 days (in two days time) and I can't leave him knowing that he could deteriorate while I'm gone. The tail is disgusting and smells and is just getting bigger and worse, but the vet is right to be concerned about his ability to go through surgery, recover, and adapt, with other problems that may or may not be connected. They have advised euthanasia. Advice? Words of wisdom? 

I uploaded the pictures here: http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] ... 286091344/

There are some from 1st june, 11th June, and today, so you can see the progression as well as how it looks now (AWFUL!).


Thank you.


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## Raturday (May 26, 2012)

Poor Skylos  I personally would try amputating the tail, but that's just me. I've never seen anything like this before, so not sure what it could possibly be. Sorry I can't be of more assistance, but I hope everything goes okay, whatever you decide.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

TBH your vet should've mentioned amputation as soon as they saw it. Its obviously not a regular infection at all. Are they asking if you want an amputation or are you going to suggest it?


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## Skylos (Jun 25, 2012)

They are saying that they are not happy to do an amputation because of the other symptoms (the feet and lymph node) so the prognosis is not good enough in her opinion. But she is happy to consult and get another opinion if that is what i want. What makes you say it isn't a regular infection? I'd like to know as my vet didn't get to that conclusion until it was unresponsive to two rounds of different anti-biotics, and I want to learn as much as I can for myself to better take care of my boys, given I so often have found vets lacking. Thanks


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## 1a1a (May 6, 2011)

Can't help with the medical stuff, just wanted to say, poor little guy, I hope this gets resolved for him soon (either through recovery, or euthanisation). Def sounds like some nasty infection.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

** WARNING - DISTURBING PICS BELOW **

Its more likely to be a cancerous mass...infection is quite obvious, masses are solid and that thing is just warping his tissues, and spreading.  If it was an infection, the culture you took would've show that...did they mention bacterial cells?

I had a tiny baby girl recently...and she had cancer. We took samples and sent them off to the lab for cytology...turned out to be a spindle cell tumour, a very nasty very fast spreading malignancy. I also had her necropsied after she died and there was swelling and involvement of the lymph glands which meant it had already spread too much 

When a women is checked for breast cancer they also take biopsies from her lymph nodes to see if it has spread that far...not a good sign in animals when it has. Your boy could have hemangiosarcoma, which can show up all over the place, could be spindle cell, etc...too many can seem like that 

http://ratguide.com/health/neoplasia/sarcoma.php


I have also see systemic infection as well...the rat kept popping up abscesses all over his body, and it kept eating the muscle but there was pus/bacteria present every time.

This is a picture of a benign tumour being removed from my rat

Pre-removal









Post-removal









Here is an infection of the muscle tissue, there is pus and necrotizing flesh but its definitely bacterial. The vet had to debride the affected tissue before it would heal.
It was an infected bite wound on Gilbert's shoulder, I was flushing him with saline at this point, but the tissue kept dying so I took him to the vet.










I have been through multiple surgeries, hind leg amputtions with my rats, minor tail amputations, and I am definitely one who says "try it!" but you need a vet who has the same attitude and you need to have a possible good outcome, of which I don't see any here. The "whatever" has spread. You could remove the tissue right down to the spine but it won't stop this and then you have a rat in pain and recovering from surgery. My guess is he would likely not make it through the surgery at all.


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