# i'm sorry Iedani



## twitch

i'm going to have to take Iedani into the vet's tomorrow to be put down. she is too dangerous to keep any longer. i finally ironed out EXACTLY why she is biting and there is no solution to this problem. 

as some of you may have known i have been having biting issues with Iedani. i've had for 9 months and she has always been nippy but when she was in my bedroom the only one she had a chance to bite was me or other rat savy people i invited up. now she lives in the living room of my apartment (the only space in the apartment that i can keep them) and my young son lives with me. it doesn't matter how often you tell a kid not put their fingers in the cage they do eventually. and she bites really hard (draws blood 9 times out of 10) and that's with me not jerking back in unmitigated fear like a child would. 

i had different theories on why she could be biting and tested each. when i first got her i thought it was just that she wasn't properly handled. after forced socailization she was a BIT better. didn't bite as frequently at least and was't afraid when outside of the cage (stopped biting out of the cage entirely). so that was at least PART of the problem. 

for a while after that i was stumped as to why she still bit, though now randomly. sometimes you could put your hand in and be fine others she'd have her pound of flesh. then i thought maybe she just wanted more room. afterall when she was out with all that space she was fine. so i expanded the cage. no change.

then violet came and she got friendly when there were less rats in the cage during my three cage circulations. so i thought maybe she just doesn't like to have so many rats in with her and that was making her generally cranky which she would take out on me. i moved her for a time to another cage (its small and something only really suited for one rat) but she was away from the other rats. for the first little while she was fine then she started biting again. so i put in twix (they hang out the most together) and gave her more toys thinking maybe she was bored or lonely. no change.

after the move i expanded the cage again. still not helping. at first i thought well, mayb ethe cage expansion will work but she just has to settle from the move. its been a month now and she still bites. 

so i've gone through the reasons for biting. she's not afraid, she's not confusing me for food, and she's not playing rough. this only leaves that she's territorial. when she's out of the cage, her space, she's a very sweet rat. gives kisses, chases feathers, takes naps on my lap or shoulder. but inside the cage and she's out for blood, sometimes. but that makes her all the more dangerous, you can't tell if she's coming near you for affection or if she's coming for the attack. there's no clear difference in her body language between the two. 

i've dealt with this biting issue for 9 months and i know she's 15 months old now. she probably won't live for very much longer anyway as rats only normally live 2-3 years anyhow ut my son is moving in this weekend and i have to protect him. its a really hard decision. i view my pets as family. Iedani is my daughter too. so to protect my son i have to hurt my daughter. but what other choice do i have? 

with iedani biting once she decides that the space is hers she isn't adoptable. its hard enough finding homes for well adjusted rats let alone dangerous specail needs rats. its hard anywhere but especailly out where i live. i had to find homes for 24 babies nearly 2 years ago now and they were cute babies not bitey adults. 

there's so much in me saying "DON'T! she's healthy and happy" but then the other part says "she's not safe to be around." its one thing for her to bite me. but another thing entirely to bite my young son or one of his friends who won't understand and be afraid afterwards. 

i really really don't want to do this but i can see no other option. i'll be taking her in tomorrow afternoon. i'm going to beg my vet for an alternative but i'm not hopeful. 

so this is goodbye for Iedani. i'm so sorry.


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## Stephanie

oh twitch i am so sorry i know exactly how you feel. I almost had to put my iriquois down because he bit my hubby alot (still does every now and then0 and i was not going to risk one of my children being biten. I am so sorry that you have to come to this decision i know i wasn't strong enough to.


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## Night

Have you spayed her? Maybe you can find a rescue to take her. Aggressive rats shouldn't be euthanized, in my opinion. Especially when they're happy and healthy.


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## Poppyseed

I really think you should take her to a rescue D: Even if they don't adopt her out, she could live her life out with them. Please don't kill her, I would take her if I were nearby but sadly I'm not.


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## Dimitrius

I hope you're able to find a suitable alternative.


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## twitch

the thing is she's NOT agressive. she's territorial. and she's random when she decides that she's going to bite. if it were mere agressoin, or at least constant then i might have been able to do something. if it were just agression there would be a better reason for it other then she's just overprotective of her space at times. and if she was consistantly biting then that's something i could have trained her to stop. but she's not like that. i've tried everything i can think of to get her to stop or even just to stop enough that shes not drawing blood anymore. but she won't even say sorry for biting when displined like the others will. she'll just keep biting me. 

iwould love to be able to take her to a rescue but she won't be adoptable and they have no room for more permenant rats. the only rat no-kill rescue that i can access already has over 50 rats that can be homed. they have no room for someone like Iedani. 

but like i said i'm going to beg the vet for other options. maybe she knows of another rescue or a rehab technique i don't know about. something. i don't want to kill her. it tears me apart that this is my only option but i can't have her biting children. i don't want her biting me but i cna deal with that. if she bites my kid then its terrible and my son will probably get a little wary of rats but i can deal with that as well. if she bites one of his friends? that could be a lawsuit from the parents and Iedani would be put down then anyway. away from me and out of my control. but still, i really don't want to kill her either. i just don't have anything else i can do. 

Night- she is not spayed and the cost of the operation is too much for me to be able to afford and still have money left over if someone else gets sick and needs treatment. i have a vet fund and i try to keep it up as high as i can but its been depleted rather serverely recently between 2 tumor removals and medications. but even i had her spayed that won't stop the problem. this isn't a hormone aggression problem. if it was she would be consistant in her biting and show at least signs that she is about to bite instead of lick. shes not like that. 

to everyone else- thank you for understanding how hard a decision this is and keeping hope that i will find a better alternative. i really appreicate that you understand how hard this is.


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## Poppyseed

I understand how hard it is, but did you ask these rescues if they could take her in or are you just assuming? I know it seems like a dumb question but I think you should at least ask if you havn't.

She sounds like a tough case, and I know you've done everything you could to help her and it hasn't worked, I'm not faulting you for trying. I just think she needs to be rehomed to someone willing to take on a very challenging rat, preferably someone without kids. Some people tend to be better with biters than others, not saying that you didn't do nearly everything in the book to aid her but some people understand their mind set better. I know my boyfriend Chris happens to be excellent with bitter animals in the past.

Like I said, I wish I lived near you so I could take her D: I'm sorry you are even having to consider this decision. But don't you think even if it is a kill shelter they will give her a greater chance of surviving than you just going to put her under?

I'm sorry for your tough decisions, just trying to help you save her.


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## twitch

a kill shelter will have her put down as soon as they realize she bites and bites hard. and that's only if i don't tell them that out right, in which case they won't accept her. i haven't contacted any shelter directly but a friend of mine was in recent contact with the only rat shelter in the province. that's how i know he has over 50 rats currently in his care. she was contacting him about a rat she knew of, a very happy licky one but with a poor owner who wanted to get rid of it. he was hesitant about taking in another rat at all but his heart is often too big for his own good. he would probably take Iedani but its not fair to him or his rescue. she will never be able to be adopted and he will have to take care of her forever. he will either come to the same conclusion i have or she will take space and money from rats that can be rehomed. its not fair to him or the rescue that way. but i know it not fair to Iedani for me to have her put under because of who she is. but maybe if i arrange a trade with him? or donate money for her regulary... i'll give him a call before i take her in to see if we can work anything out.

but that leaves me in a moral delima. she won't be adopted, not with the biting issue. so she will take up space and money for other rats that could be adopted even if i took a rat in trade to free space for her. where another rat would eventually leave to another home she'll always be there, always taking up that space. and will i always have enough money to be donating to them all the time. and because she bites and the rescue has so many rats how much put time could she have? i'm wary when taking her out but she does come out. and i only have the 8 to share time with and some days its difficult finding time for everyone plue the kid and school nad house work and everything else. imagine having to do all that and have over 50 rats!? he has such a big heart i don't think he would say no to any rat but that doesn't mean its fair to take advantage of. sure Iedani would be alive and with someone who absolutely adores rats but she will take a space that should be for the adoptable. but she'll be alive and that's better then dead. 

i'll contact the rescue in any case but i'm not sure i'm doing the right thing there either. *bangs head on desk* why can not there not be just a book on what to do. clearly stated for everything that could happen in life. one massive instruction book.... *sighs* it would be so much easier... life should work that way dangit!


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## Poppyseed

Her biteing behaviour just sounds so abnormal and bizarre, almost sociopathic in a way... Good luck, the trade and sponser idea sounds good.


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## twitch

i know. i seem to end up with the weird ones. i had a another rat a while ago that i would have sworn was autistic. any little change and she was a royal grump. even if the room was off by only a few degrees and she'd be cranky. cage changing day was absolutely horrible on her.


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## Kimmiekins

Please don't put her down! If she's territorial just in her cage (cage aggressive, which does occasionally happen), then she's doing okay, and can maybe be rehabilitated by a good rat rescue, or at least become a permanent resident. (Not shelters, I'm talking rat rescues here.) I can understand not wanting to put your son in danger, so I can understand not wanting to have her there, but please see if a rescue can help. Maybe one that isn't so close, but a transport could be set up. Rat rescues are in it for exactly these types of problems.

I have a grumpy singleton that went psycho on other rats, causing injuries. We separated him for the safety of the others. It was like a bomb went off inside him, and he was ANGRY, biting us and not allowing us to handle him. He was cage aggressive for awhile, but with lots of time and patience, that went away. He's now one of the sweetest rats ever, he can be held and loved on, and hasn't bit in over 5 months. He cuddles and nuzzles, something he didn't even do before!

Where do you live? Maybe we can find a rat rescue that can help.


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## reachthestars

I will say, as someone who has experianced her biting, she gives NO WARNING whatsoever. One moment she's perfectly content and then CHOMP. She doesn't even bite quickly, it's a long drawn out to the bone type crunch that she won't release. Last time she got me I bled for 30 minutes even with pressure applied. 

Twitch you have to do what is right for you, and what you feel you can live with. I *know* the work, love and effort you've put into this girl. I also see the scar on my hand and know you cannot put your son at risk having her around (so I'll take him ).


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## Kimmiekins

I'm not saying anything negative, just that there may be someone out there willing to help her girl! Not saying she hasn't tried. I just hate to hear of a rat put down for a behavior problem. Some people (rescues or otherwise) don't even mind keeping a rat that would need gloves warn for handling, let them live their lives as long as they are happy and healthy. That's what I was thinking.

Sorry for suggesting a rescue. I guess if she's that bad, then you need to do what feels right to you. Was just trying to help you and her... Sorry for saying anything. :? Thought if the rat went to a rescue, it would be a win-win situation.


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## Stephanie

Kimmiekins said:


> Was just trying to help you and her... Sorry for saying anything. :? Thought if the rat went to a rescue, it would be a win-win situation.


But you forgot one very important factor kimmiekins ther is a small child involved and the welfare of the child ALWAYS comes first to a parent. it killed me when I had to give my riff raff back to the rescue I got him from but he was stalking (yes stalking i.e. chasing and trying to hunt) my son and daughter. I know you were thinking of the rat and that is great of you but when it comes to having kids around an aggressive rat it is always best to put the kid first and the rat second.


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## Kimmiekins

I understand that, as I already said, I DO understand that the child comes first, so I DO understand that a biting rat can not be kept in the house. What I was saying is instead of putting the rat DOWN, if a rescue (or someone) took the rat, then it IS a win-win situation. The child is safe, and the rat doesn't need to die.

So instead of - Rat to sleep, child safe.
I was saying - Rat to rescue (or experienced rat owner willing to work with the rat), child safe.

Which is no different, is it? Puts the child in no further danger, does it? Just that a happy, healthy rat stays alive. A win-win situation. Not putting a child in danger, or putting the rat first, child second!

Sheesh. I'm sorry I replied. I merely suggested seeing if someone wanted to help the rat, instead of ending it's life. She obviously cares for the rat, and I thought maybe if someone could help the rat, that would make her feel better about the whole thing, while keeping her child safe.

Never mind. Obviously I'm coming off differently then I mean to be, or something.


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## Stephanie

but what other child will be put in danger? I have gotten aggressive rats from rescues or animal shelters and they say that they are rehabilitated but they aren't that is why i am weary of adoption these days. How many chances does a dog get to bite? Here it is three after three bites they are put to sleep. So how many chances should a rat get? that is up to the owner and only the owner!


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## Night

Personally, I think that if an animal's adopted or brought into your home, you have to deal with ALL of it's quirks and issues. You don't put it to sleep or get rid of it when it starts causing problems. Rats aren't all going to be sweet and nice - some take REAL work. Moreover, considering the fact that she's apparently not aggressive, but is just territorial, she needs to be spayed. That will help take the edge off of her bitting. But, since money is apparently an issue, I guess it's better just to get rid of the animal, huh? 

I see my animals as my children. If they need something, they get it - no matter what. I try until there are NO more options. 

It's easy for people to see animals as disposable objects, sadly.


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## twitch

Night said:


> Personally, I think that if an animal's adopted or brought into your home, you have to deal with ALL of it's quirks and issues. You don't put it to sleep or get rid of it when it starts causing problems. Rats aren't all going to be sweet and nice - some take REAL work. Moreover, considering the fact that she's apparently not aggressive, but is just territorial, she needs to be spayed. That will help take the edge off of her bitting. But, since money is apparently an issue, I guess it's better just to get rid of the animal, huh?
> 
> I see my animals as my children. If they need something, they get it - no matter what. I try until there are NO more options.
> 
> It's easy for people to see animals as disposable objects, sadly.


what the F**K NIGHT!? do you think that option is easily come by?? do you think i just thought, hey, she bites, too much effort to deal with, might as well kill her!!??? for crying out load night think about you freaking words!! I view my pets as much my children as my human child too. but with human children we speak the same language and can have talks. with human adults that get this way they're locked up for hurting other people but that's not an option for rats who we don't speak the same language and jails aren't possbile. i DON'T want to kill her. i HAVE worked with her. but there's NOTHING more that i can do. a spay (and cheap at that) in my area is clsoe to $300 before taxes and that's if nothgin goes wrong or she needs extra meds. i just had 2 tumor removals and spent money on medications for foster. on top of that i've moved out and have not been able to replenish my vet fund like i used to be able to do. 

*takes a deep breath* but you know what, defending myself to you is useless. you already have a preconcived notion of me and you obvisously refuse to see things from any other point of view then your elitist one. so i will ask you kindly to refrain from replying to my posts. i know this is a forum with free speech and all that but if all you're going to say is hurtful spiteful things i would greatly appreicate it if you would just bite your tongue. if you want to speak poorly of me then talk to one of your friends about it but don't force your hurtful and hateful remarks to me directly anymore. its not something i feel i need to deal with with you. so, once again, please refrain from any further responses to me.


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## Sara_C

Stephanie if a rat rescue is aware that a rat is aggressive/unpredictable i hardly think they will adopt it out to a family with children. They probably won't adopt it out at all.


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## Night

I just think you're being little bit selfish. From what you've said, she's fantastic out of the cage - a great little rat! So, deal with her eccentricities - this really isn't much of a problem at all. If she's territorial in her cage, just work around it. Not as though you can't take her out of it.


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## twitch

selfish!?!??? how the heck am i being sefish??? what about this situation is me being selfish?? 

yeha gloves would work for me fine but what about my son and his friends? they're young children. no matter how much you tell them don't, they're still going to. i mean its even one thing if my son is bit. i'm his mother and can deal with it. i know exactly what happened and all that. but if its one of his friends. their parents coudl sue me and have iedani seized jsut like a biting dog (even if the dog was only biting to protect babies) and have her destoryed and they may not do it the right way. moreover she will be terrified from being ripped from all things familiar. they could take al my animals from me. could have socail services down my back for keeping a dangerous animal around children. my human son could be taken from me. and the least of the worries on that end would be the fine that i doubt i could afford to pay. i don't want my child bitten, i don't want to be bitten but i could deal with both. the big issue here is if she bites someone else. she would still be killed and many other repercussions would follow. 

this is certainly no easy decision. i LOVE iedani too. to protect my son and his friends i have to kill my daughter. 

i did contact the rescue and am waiting for a reply back but i am honestly not holding much hope. and i'm still debating the moral issues. she will be alive, yes. but she will never leave the rescue and the owner, though big hearted to a fault, certainly won't have all that much time to be with her anyway with trying to tend and find homes for 50+ rats as it is. she will be left, for the most part, in a cage. what quality of life is that? then there's the fact that she would be taking up space and using up money that could be better spent on a rat that could actually be saved and rehomed. pawning iedani off on a rescue effects many more lives then just her own. but i contacted them anyway and i will discuss all this with them in any case. though i really don't think its right to do either. 

i have no good option here. i really don't. keep her and risk losing all my children. give her up and question her quailty of life and know she's preventing other rats that can be homed from getting the help they need or kill her and end a healthy rat's life. 

i've worked with her for 9 months and NOTHING has gotten her to stop. she's unpredicatable and dangerous. in the end i will probably have her put down but that's not a dicison that is easily made either. I DON'T WANT TO KILL HER. but i have to look at the better good too. i've given her as best a life as i could during the 9 months i have had her. and i've tried everything to get her to stop. exhausted every aveune to make sure exacty what her biting issue is. this is not an issue that can be fixed and i can no longer really risk managing it. there are more options avilable to humans with the same type of issues as iedani. sadly there isn't with rats as we just don't know how to communicate right with them. 

so explain to me again how i've been selfish?


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## Night

"and i've tried everything to get her to stop. exhausted every aveune to make sure exacty what her biting issue is. this is not an issue that can be fixed and i can no longer really risk managing it. "

Spay her.

If you spay her and that doesn't change anything, THEN you've exhausted all options. You haven't at this point.


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## twitch

night seroiusly, STFU. you're being an idiot and i'm not replying to you anymore


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## Night

Okay


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## Stephanie

no sara I have had it happen to me more than once I have had to deal with the horrible guilt of giving them back becuase my kids and them didn't get along and my children are extremely well trained with my rats. 
Adopting adult aggressive rats is a very hard thing to do and as far as night "So, deal with her eccentricities - this really isn't much of a problem at all." Biting to the point of scarring is NOT acceptable around children of any age and when it is a territorial thing like the cage spaying is not garunteed to help especially at an older aged rat. An eccentricity would be a problem that could be solved or dealt with. A rat biting a child is not something that can be fixed in this case Twitch has tried all she can and it is her decision alone!


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## reachthestars

Night, spays in our area are incredibly expensive, and not many vets are willing to do the surgery. I know if Twitch had unlimited funds she would, but she's a university student living on her own with a young son, who's had two tumor removals done on other rats in a short amount of time. There simply isn't the money for a spay. 

Her son is an average 4 year old, curious, loves his pets, and will try to play with them through the bars when mommy isn't looking. He's a boy blessed with a real love for animals, and doesn't get that sometimes they can hurt him. 

I'll say again that Angel's Heart Rat Rescue is a fabulous little sanctuary for rats, and the owner is blessed with a large heart, but he has many rats in his care already and another one (unadoptable at that) would add more to his burden. He has younger children as well, so if she is sent to him there are still children at risk.

This is in the end her decision, and one that is not made with a light heart. I've seen the effort put into this girl, I've helped myself (and have the scars to prove it) but after 9 months of consistant work she is no better. some rats have inbalances in their brain chemistry, perhaps this is an issue with her as well?


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## Kimmiekins

A GOOD rescue will NOT just leave her to rot in a cage. A GOOD rescue will take her out daily - with gloves if need be - and give her the SAME life she would live if she were not territorial.

If the rescue you contacted is already over-run, then no, they probably won't take her. There are rescues all around the world! Appeal to them.

Cage aggression is more common then you'd like to think among caged animals, and it's something that can often be overcome. If it's something that can't be - after sputering and working with the animal fails - then you take the precautions necessary. Gloves, or some other means. In the scheme of things, it is a VERY small problem for a rescue.

I asked where you lived, but never got an answer. Heck, I'll take her if possible! I just don't see that putting her to sleep is the only option, when there are LOTS of people out there that are willing - HAPPY - to take on a cage aggressive rat, and give her a good life, be it rehabilitation, or letting her live her life out being handled by gloves when in the cage.

What is so wrong with someone trying to help her? I don't get it. It won't make a difference to the safety of your child if she is put down, or goes to another person or rescue. No one is saying that you should put your child in danger, if you feel that you are. If she's out of your house, then your child is NOT a factor anymore. So why not give her a chance of life?

That's all I'm not getting here. You contact a rescue you say you're sure won't take her, you talk about taking her to a shelter (which, yeah, mostly likely, they WOULD put her down), you talk about how you think it's morally wrong for her to be left in a cage with no interaction at a rescue (which, again, a GOOD rescue WILL NOT DO)... You seem to think that the only solution is to be PTS. But WHY? When there ARE places that are there to help rats like this!

I can say that most rescues WILL take rats in like this and DO want to help them, because I'm looking to start one myself in the next 6 months or so and have every intention to take in rats with worse problems (like my Chester, the rat I spoke of earlier). I've seen rescues take in animals with many more problems then cage aggression. Rescues are in it for this very reason - to HELP rats. Not to have a quick turnover. Rescues know full well - and accept it when they start - that not every rat that comes in will be adopted out. They pledge to care for those rats for the rest of their lives. They won't stick them in a dark corner and give them no interaction. A good rescue will not take any rat in with the mindset that it will be adopted right out. A good rescue has the mindset that every rat that comes in might not leave, and they are fine with that.

Stephanie, it sounds like you've not found a good rescue, if they stick you with rats with severe problems (ESPECIALLY given that you do have children, and are not matching owners and rats well) and don't let you know. Nearly all of my boys are rescues, and each has their own problems (I have two rescues - happen to be from the same mother - that bite through bars from time to time and sometimes when hands are in-cage... My partner and I bear some scars of our own, but we know not to put fingers near those two). That's something you chance with rescues (just like you would with pet store rats, and maybe with some breeder rats). But if they adopted out rats with severe problems without letting you know, that's not a good rescue. Don't let that reflect on other rescues.

Have you posted at Goosemoose? At least give it a try before you put her to sleep.

Of COURSE it is the final decision of the owner. But why, why, why would you rather kill a rat then give it a chance? I can't understand that. That is all I am asking... Why? When people are out there that will help, want to help, why put her down?

Worse comes to worst, she goes to a rescue and does eventually get put to sleep. Which is what you'd have done, so what's the problem? Why not give her the chance?

I'm really am not trying to be an a$$, I'm not trying to be a b*tch, I'm not attacking you as a person, I just don't understand. I don't need to, as you do have the final decision, but I just don't see why you would rather kill her then give her a chance to live her life out. Your child is safe either way, so it's not the issue.

I'm serious about trying to get a rattie train from you to me (are you in New Brunswick?) and keeping her for the rest of her life, if no one closer will. PM me if you decide to take me up on the offer.

That said, I'm done with this thread. I wish you Iedani and the best, with whatever you decide. I know you'll do what's best for your situation, whatever it may be, and I certainly have no hard feelings towards you for it. Sorry if I said anything that comes off harsh, I really am trying to help.


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## Poppyseed

Aww Kimmie, good luck setting up a train if that's what Twitch decides to do. I also hope someone else can adopt her and give her a chance in a child less home.


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## Sara_C

Stephanie i appreciate how hard this situation is for Twitch - i was just saying that a rescue wouldn't rehome a rat that is known to bite to a house with children. Or at least a good rescue wouldn't. I understand that biting children is not acceptable, at all. At no point did i say that Iedani was simply 'eccentric'. It sounds like she has some serious problems, and there's no way she should put children at risk. However, having her PTS doesn't seem to be the only option, either.


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## lilspaz68

Have you ever thought of putting screen around her cage and a lock on the door so curious children had no access to her?

We had a biter situation just recently on another forum, there were 5 people willing to take this girl in and work with her. There are people who like the "problem children" rats...me included.

I know you don't really want to have her pts, but since you are now busy running your rescue, and have your own resident rats maybe someone who has a bit more time to work with her, might like to try?

Let the rescue decide if she is unadoptable or not, you might be pleasantly surprised.

Advertise she needs a new home on rat forums, tell them she is cage aggressive but is an absolute doll outside of it. Maybe she'll end up in a huuuge cage or a free-range rat. There's no shame on passing on a problem rat, as long as you are upfront about it. there's a ton of freaks like me out there who like Ratty Challenges or like to wear gloves all the time LOL.


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## twitch

first off--KImmiekins--i'm sorry for not replying to you earlier in your previous posts. i was going to wait to hear back from the rescue (the only one my province at all) before i posted again at all but after i read night's post i was so enraged. it seemed like she didn't read any of my previous posts thoroughly and only got that i WANTED to kill my rat (which i don't). reading back on some of my replies to her i'm a little ashamed of my behaviour. i SHOULD have gotten up from the computer and done something else for a while before posting back. i'm afriad i came off as a tad immature in telling her just to leave me alone and shut up. i understand that when considering putting an otherwise healthy rat down other people are not going to be happy with that decision. heck, I'M not happy with that option. but in all fairness night's wording was quite harsh. but i'll not get into that any further. its beside the point. but by the time i was done replying to her i had totally forgotten about your post. i appreciate your concern and i'm grateful for your offer but i'm in canada, new brunswick. the border would not be an easy thing cross with a rat (i have tried before and what it comes down to is the whim of the guard at the time). i'm at my parent's place right now, my son got sick while there, so we won't be moving in as soon as i we had originally planned. at least not until he is better. which gives me some time to look around for a home that could be suitable for Iedani. and i have been looking. like i've said a few times, i don't want to put Iedani down. she'll have at least until my son is better for me to find her a place. 

now, for the general update. the rescue has contacted me back. after a lengthy discussion on Iedani's issue and morals and long term picture and the fact that he has so many right now on top of everything it was decided that Iedani could not be accepted. please don't view this rescue (it is a rescue, to clear eariler confusions i was using the words rescue and shelter pretty much interchangably) as a bad one. he is very good and accepts that the rats in his care will not be adopted out imediately or that there would be a high turnover rate. he even takes in rats that he knows on accepting that they will probably never be able to leave and will cost signifcant ammounts of money and time for the rest of their lives. he has quite a few of them already in among the 50. the problem is that he has over 50. right now he just realy doesn't have room for another permanent rat. he also agrees that she would not be adoptable. he couldn't think of anything else that could be done to rehab her and she wuld just be a matter of dealing with her. where she is so unpredictable it wuld make it unethical to adopt her out to anyone without excessive experience in trouble rats. however he did say he would spread the word to rat savvy people that he knows (ones without children) to see if any of them would be willing to take her on. we're both a bit hesitant because she is so unpredictable but we figured we'd ultimately leave that decision up to anyone who would be interested in taking her. he also understands the time constraint but he knows quite a few people too. so i'm going to keep my fingers crossed. if anyone is interested we will make sure that they fully understnad and appricate Iedani's temperment. 

i would also like to address the issue made about my concern with the quality of life she would have at a rescue. i know a rescue is there to offer help for situtaions like iedani. and i know they would not put her ina dark corner in an iadeuacte cage for the rest of her life with no interaction. my concern was with the ammount of interaction she would get. he is only one and there is only so much time in a day. add to that that he has over 50 rat currently in his care. mathmatically you can already see that not everyone is getting one on one time each day for the minumim hour requirement. then you have to realise that not all these rats are going to be healthy. some will need more care and attention then others. then there's the ones that can have a good home if only they lkearn not be afraid. in order for them to learn that they need a lot of attention as well. but then you also have too look and see that even with all that tim taken there already more time will be taken for the man to be with his human family and rasie and tend to his human children. this greatly limits the ammunt of time he would be able to spend for a rat that has no real hope of getting a home and is dangerous to handle. he is a good rescue adn he really carse for the animals he takes in. he understands that not every rat that comes in is going to be homed. but we all also have to keep in mind the situation he'll be in and the simple fact that there really only so many hours in a day.


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## lilspaz68

I just PM'd you.


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## twitch

talk about luck! i've found a home for Iedani. in fact she's already over there. i had an exam this morning (the easist thing i've ever done! man i love that prof! he's SO lazy... *grins*) and while i was waiting to be let i got talking to this guy from class. i had brought Spider to class a while ago and he was asking on how she was. well one thing lead to another and i found out he lives in town, not too too fr from where i live now too, has a couple of rats in this huge arse cage (a ferretnation actually) and used to work in a cat rescue for a couple years until he moved to go to school. i told him about Iedani and he said he'd love to give her a try and if he has to he has the gloves to protect his hands when taking her out anyway. he seemed quite excited to be getting her. after the exam was over i went to his place to make sure all was in order. his two girls are actually getting on in age (one is nearly two the other past 3) and though Iedani is 15 months she's still a young'n compared to these guys. his girls were very friendly and their cage was decked to the max with toys and hammocks and tubes. Iedani mught have to get used to bright colors (everything was a flourscent of something) but she should have a good home with him. we then went to my place and he took Iedani home. we exchanged numbers and he told me to call any time. its just him adn his rats in his apartment so there's no chance of little kid fingers getting hurt. he promised to keep me updated on Iedani's progress with intros with his girls. but really, talk about luck eh? its things like this that sometimes gets me to wonder if there's a higher power out there... if corvis hadn't been sick and i hadn't taken Spider to class that day and we didn't just happen to meet up while waiting for an exam... whoohoo!!


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## Kimmiekins

Yay, so glad to hear it! What luck. A happy ending


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## Poppyseed

WOW! Talk about LUCK and happy endings! I'm so excited that she gets a new home with a child less owner!!! SO HAPPY for all of you!

See, told you someone would take her in ^_~ Some people love the challenge.


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## lilspaz68

This is wonderful news for all involved!!! 

Thank god rats don't see colour very well at all, so those neon's won't bother her too much.


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## twitch

hmm i don't know how the owner stands all that color... it was making me dizzy looking at some of it. i think the worst part of it was it ALL clashed. he had so much in there and it was all so BRIGHT.. hahaha... but it looks like she's going to get a good daddy even if his taste in decoration is just...well... i don't even thing "gay eye for the straight guy" would be able to help him here. he seems happy with the colors though and that's what matters


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## Poppyseed

EYE RAEP CAGE D:::!!!!!111one

lol, yeah rats see in low saturations so it should be all nearly grey to them, maybe a little less grey than most things they can see possibly?


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## Spider

Where do you live? Theres probably someone on the Forum within range who would take her in. What about the humane society?
Spider


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## twitch

she already foud another home. a couple posts up i talk about it. it was really just pure luck


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## Holly

Wow, was this thread a roller coaster! I'm so glad that there is a happy ending!


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