# Spaying pregnant does



## ladylady (Apr 5, 2007)

I never even new about this till I read about it on another site. Could I have everyones opinion on it?


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## OhBugger. (Apr 6, 2007)

well, wouldn't that be rattie abortion sort of?
I mean, If you do that, the rat doesn't have a say in whether she wants kittens or not.
I just don't like the idea of killing un-born rat babies much.
Doesn't seem too pleasant.


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

that would be an abortion spay and i would think in certain circumstances it would be prefered over letting the female have her babies. if for instance you don't have the time or money for possible complications during delivery and rehomeing afterwards. or if you know something isn't right and that the litter is going to be a danger to the health of the female. say if the female became pregnant at 5 weeks old. though i'm not sure if even a spay is possible until 8 weeks anyway... mind you before going ahead and doing an abortion spay i would research the heck out of the risks of it. there is a lot more blood down there during that time and they are SO tiny of an animal. i'd want to know how other abortion spays went in the past emotionally on the rats that went through it too. so i would do it in the right circumstances but i research research research before making that decision.


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## Rodere (Feb 26, 2007)

The female doesn't usually have much choice in the matter anyway. They can't always get away from the male. It's just part of nature, whether they want babies or not. I've seen them mating at the petstore. They often run and try to get away. I've never seen one hold still and raise her tail or anything.

If you can't afford to take care of babies, or don't think you can rehome them, think or know the babies will be unhealthy, or are worried that the female will have problems with the birth then you should do it.

If you purposefully let a female mate and then have her spayed.. that is a bit wrong.


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## 2manyrats (Apr 10, 2007)

I like abortion. I'm all for less unwanted children out there, whether they be human or rats.

However, I'd only get it done on a rat if it was very obvious something had gone wrong/would endanger the mother's health, or the mother was just *wayyy* too young. Otherwise, there are usually people/rescues/shelters who will take the kittens, or someone who has a hungry snake (no live feeding, of course).


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## IceLore (May 13, 2007)

If I got a rat in that was pregnant and I had the funds to spay her, I would. It's hard enough to rehome rats in general, so why would I want to try and do it for a possible 18 more? For every kitten that comes into the world, thats one more home needed for a rat that is already here. 

In a perfect world I wouldn't do it, and it's hard to think about, but I think if anyone thinks about the numbers, and dealing with unwanted kitten themselves, then they would see the right in it.


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## OnlyOno (Apr 4, 2007)

agreed. why make more animals when millons are put to sleep each year for no better reason than no one wanted them?

on a random note i have a blood tube (test tube used to collect blood) with a puppy fetus in it. the puppy is maybe half an inch long and you can see toes and a tail, little olive eyes and a heart in it. a lady bought a cocker spaniel mix puppy from the shelter and she was already pregnant. the mother was barely a puppy herself, and the lady could not afford to keep the puppies (which of course, would be a lot more for dogs than rats, but you get the idea). it was decided to spay the puppy, and she had 6 or 7 puppies. me and another technician took one each, and the doctor kept 3 or 4 himself. 1 or 2 of them disintegrated while we were trying to get them out of the uterus.  kind of a neat reminder of my time with the clinic.


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## mnic001 (May 9, 2007)

That's a wild thing to have. 

It seems like a rattie abortion is a good option if you can't take care of the babies yourself.


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## 2manyrats (Apr 10, 2007)

Why not feed them to a snake if you're going to abort them? They die either way. It may seem awful to think about, but snakes have to eat too. And for every snake owner who feeds kittens that aren't bred by feeder-breeder factories, that's less business that feeds the dismal situations of rats in pet stores.

Oh, and I advocate euthanization, not live feeding.


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

giving them to a pet shop after delivery to be sold as pinkie food is of course another option but why risk complications in your pet just to give all the babies away as food when the petstore already has plenty. a couple unwanted accidental pet rat litters isn't going to make a dent a feeder-breeder business but it could kill your rat. its not like it doesn't happen--take jade for example. if i had a vet that i trusted for a spay and had the money for two spays at the time and had even thought of an abortion spay i probably would have had spider and snicketts done when i realized they were pregnant (after researching the risks of course). spider had 11 babies and snicketts 13 and though i was able to home everyone and there were no major complications it very easily could have gone very differently. i was lucky.


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## 2manyrats (Apr 10, 2007)

Having babies is always a risk, as is getting an e-spay. You have to weigh the risks. If the mom is more than a year old, then her pelvic bones will have fused, so having babies is a bad choice. A spay is less risky. If the mom is healthy and under a year (or has had a litter before and under 1.5 years) it's probably more risky to have a spay. Of course, if you want the girl to be spayed out of concern for tumors later in life, then spaying is a good choice.


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## cupids_cuties (Jan 7, 2007)

i dont like the idea of actually removing the uterus w/ live rats growing in it. its just weird. if they could be terminated first it would be diff...but i just really dont agree w/ the notion of taking them out alive and letting them die slowly...


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

that would be something to look into. how long would it take for the fetuses to die when removed with the uterus? it would probably depend on how far along they are. and what is the age of viablity for a rat baby? maybe if you were concerned about the delivery but know the pregnancy is going fine you could have a spay done after the age of viability. this is of course assuming you still have the room and money for the babies. but it is another option.


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## lizzydeztic (Mar 15, 2007)

it's scary to think of but if i unknowingly purchased a pregnant rat i would probably do this. it's sad, but i really wouldn't trust the babies to anyone. and i mean ANYONE unless i personally knew them and even then i don't think i have enough friends or people on this lovely forum that would want a few babies. it's just too risky, i don't like to hear of animal suffering and in terms of pet rats there is just too much suffering going on at the moment. we unknowingly adopted a pregnant dog once and my mother wouldn't hear of having the babies aborted. she was extremely unhealthy when we got her, and most of the babies are now dead after 7 years due to poor pet owners or health issues like diabetes or epilepsy. there's only one baby left and she lives with us, she suffers with terrible epilepsy =( i could honestly say i wouldn't have aborted the pups. sad, i know. but i can't insure that they will all be taken care of.

it sickens to me hear about so many people breeding cats. i HATE it. cats are one of the biggest stray problems here. the humane society is packed when the poor babies.



sorry for my rambling guys. lol. another thing i hate, there's only one veterinary school in wisconsin and i have no means of moving to enroll.


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## OnlyOno (Apr 4, 2007)

burned on the vet school thing. i'm pretty sure i won't get in right away to colorado state's vet school, esp since it's like 2nd in the nation. but i HAVE to, cuz i can't afford anything more than in-state tuition. blargh.

on the death thing of "aborted" fetuses - took the puppies that were probably less than a month old (i don't remember exact age) almost 1/2 hour for their hearts to stop beating, although brain-death may have been sooner for lack of oxygen. i can only hope that it was painless, but i couldn't stand dropping them into formaldehyde if they were still alive.  i hope you don't all think i'm a sick person after that.


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## lizzydeztic (Mar 15, 2007)

^^ that would be tough to deal with =(


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## Destrega2002 (May 10, 2007)

Issues like these make me kind of glad I got male rats, course if it wasn't for female rats I wouldn't have male rats... whenever I buy new rats, they're going to be male, I can tolerate the items they lug under their tail. Of course, I have no comment as to whether or not I support human abortion (I'm a dude, and can never win in an abortion argument) but I do support the rat thing.


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