# Good Vibes Needed for Cecil, Melvin, Waldo & Yara on Wed.



## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Wednesday is going to be a very nerve-wracking day even for me, since I have many rats being dropped off at the vets. Cecil and his tricky tumour removal, and the 3 babies with terrible eye issues that we should hopefully get an answer to their issues and what is going to be next for them.

Yara 










Waldo










Melvin










and sweet old, compromised Cecil...


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## BigBen (Nov 22, 2011)

Good luck, and God bless. Especial prayers for Cecil, the poor little guy. And may they all be granted healing and recovery. And one just for you, too, so you don't get too frazzled!


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## binkyhoo (Sep 28, 2008)

Hi lilspaz. You are awsome to take in these rats. 

I would like to know about the sore eyes. I never seen that before. Is it cage neglect? Ammonia? How does that happen? Is it an infection? Any one can answer, so I mean. 

You are a great rattie person. And vibes for Cecils tumor removal.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

binkyhoo said:


> Hi lilspaz. You are awsome to take in these rats.
> 
> I would like to know about the sore eyes. I never seen that before. Is it cage neglect? Ammonia? How does that happen? Is it an infection? Any one can answer, so I mean.
> 
> You are a great rattie person. And vibes for Cecils tumor removal.


With our little nakie babies, I honestly don't have a clue yet as to what is going on. They arrived late Thursday night, and each baby has a mucked up eye, whether it be infection, something genetic (they are related and they were bred by a BYB), or my own favorite...hairless rats have no protection for their eyes, no eyelashes to keep things out of them like a regular rat. Some nakies are prone to getting things stuck under their 3rd eyelid (my own Lilith had to keep going back to the vet to be gassed down and then her eyes flushed and things removed from them). I think these little babies got things stuck under their eyelids but unlike Lilith who had a concientious owner who took them to a vet and the irritant was removed, there's just got worse and worse until the eye's ulcerated and died. Now I have 2 infected eyes out of the 5 eyes involved. I was suspicious about this when I first got the babies in and it seemed like every eye was different, like it was at a different stage of progression.

Not included in this group of pics is wee Norbert...his eye is the least affected, and my vet only had enough room for 2 babies and Cecil on his first day back over the holiday break. I couldn't decide who was worse and even little Yara went from dead eye but no real issues to a swollen, leaking mess in a couple of days.

This is Norbert and you can see his eye is messed up but not as badly as the others









and this is Yara on the 22nd where the eye is hard and dead but no really swelling


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Poor little guys- I really hate that hairless rats are so popular..even though I want one. People just don't have the resources to care for those eyes!

That tumor.. it's awful. He looks happy though!

They are very sweet looking loves though. Lots of good thoughts for them all.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Kinsey said:


> Poor little guys- I really hate that hairless rats are so popular..even though I want one. People just don't have the resources to care for those eyes!
> 
> That tumor.. it's awful. He looks happy though!
> 
> They are very sweet looking loves though. Lots of good thoughts for them all.


Cecil arrived about 3 weeks ago, frail, bony, a very bad URI, with that tumour. The good thing is that monster is almost completely attached by skin, with only a very tiny amout of thickening where it is attached the body. It should be an easy removal even if a HUGE incision, my worry is his respiratory and body condition with the anesthesia...I am going to be totally pacing tomorrow.  He's 23 months old, but if I can get that thing off of him, he could have many months more, and he sure does have a will to live


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I'll be pulling for him. I think he'll be okay- it looks like it will be a fast surgery, since it is hardly attached at all.


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## 1a1a (May 6, 2011)

Thinking positive thoughts for your vet trip mischief, may they all stay strong and wake up again.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

The rats have been examined and/or treated.

Waldo - I thought only one eye was affected but it is both.
He had a LOT of debris removed from under his 3rd eyelids and both eyes have ulcers, but he might regain his sight.

Melvin - both eyes affected. Lots of debris, ulcers and right eye ruptured, will be sent home with eye meds and next week it will have to be removed.

Yara - left eye, lots of debris, eyeball *may* be ruptured, cannot tell just yet.

Cecil - maybe 50% chance of surviving surgery, they wanted me to be sure before they went ahead, and I gave it to them the go-ahead. I am totally pacing in my head now.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

CECIL MADE IT!!! 

He's up and eating a bit of porridge, but they are only cautiously optimistic.


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## CarolineRose (Nov 18, 2011)

Wonderful! I was crossing my fingers for your baby. Can't wait to here how Waldo, Melvin, and Yara are doing, poor little dears.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I'm glad everyone is doing well, poor Cecil.

Hopefully the eye removal goes well.


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## Rat lover (Dec 28, 2011)

Thank goodness and god bless you for taking them to the vet.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

We are all home, and very glad to be here :mrgreen: 

Just a pic each of the babies who had their eyes flushed, and guck removed. Yara and Waldo go back for a re-check, and Melvin goes in for the enucleation next Thursday. I also added in Norbert to have his guck removed as well 

Yara









Waldo 









and Melvin's good eye









Cecil is looking very good for what he went through 

I just took a few pics so he could rest...the incision etc, doesn't change a lot in the first couple of days, so I'll wait til tomorrow for more extensive pics



















Still lifting up his body for the hanging tumour LOL









Glad to be home.


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## CarolineRose (Nov 18, 2011)

Cecil looks fantastic, like night and day! Bless him. And your little guys with the eye problems look amazing as well, will they be closing the eye pockets as well? Sorry if this sounds odd, but with my dog who had glaucoma and lost an eye, they removed it completely and completely sewed it shut so no more debris could get into the pocket.


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## BigBen (Nov 22, 2011)

Cecil looks great, _especially _for a guy who just got out of the hospital. And the others who got treated look sooo much better than in the earlier pics. Congratulations, and I hope the treatment works as well for the others when their turn comes. Blessings.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

CarolineRose said:


> Cecil looks fantastic, like night and day! Bless him. And your little guys with the eye problems look amazing as well, will they be closing the eye pockets as well? Sorry if this sounds odd, but with my dog who had glaucoma and lost an eye, they removed it completely and completely sewed it shut so no more debris could get into the pocket.


My vet closes the eye socket as well...I have been through 5 enucleations already LOL


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Aww, poor Cecil, he looks much better though. I'm sure you have thought of this, but that probably hurts (he looks like it does), is he on metacam?

They're all so adorable. I want one of those little hairless lovelies.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Kinsey said:


> Aww, poor Cecil, he looks much better though. I'm sure you have thought of this, but that probably hurts (he looks like it does), is he on metacam?
> 
> They're all so adorable. I want one of those little hairless lovelies.


Cecil is on baytril and zithromax for his URI, and metacam. He's doing pretty good this morning, and was debating hopping up to the top of his decker LOL
He decided against it...good boy!!!

[img=http://i61.photobucket.com/albums/h75/rattiluv/Hamilton%204%20Boys%20-%20Dec%202011/dec29Cecilmorningaftersurgery.jpg[/img]

Happy to be back with his whole family









The little nakie eyes look so much better today, and they all got their drops in both eyes.  They are very good about the eye drops, and don't really struggle like some rats...I think they realize I am trying to help them, and that everything I have done has made them feel a LOT better.
Waldo and Yara have a recheck next Thurs, Melvin has a recheck on his "good" eye and surgical removal of his ruptured one, and Norbert will go in to have his eyes cleaned out.


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## shinzo-chan (Apr 2, 2008)

Aw I'm so glad they're all ok! I'm a little late, but I was reading through this post and as soon as I got to the recovery pics I started grinning my head off. They all made it!  *happiness* I was wondering how you came by them though, I know you said they were from a BYB but do you run some sort of rescue? Or did you just someone see what condition they were in and just baught them to get them out of there? It must cost you a BOMB in vet bills to have them all sorted O.O

I dont know if this helps with wondering where the eye problem came from, but I had a mouse that was born with one eye that just didn't develop (he was the runt), and so he just grew up with one eye. He lived for ages though - he actually out lived the other five!  Then again, it wouldn't be too likely that ALL of them just had under-developed eyes :S Probably a case of neglect as you said. Poor ratties  At least theyre safe and happy now with someone who will love them for the rest of their ratty lives


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## A.ngelF.eathers (Jul 6, 2011)

They all look sosososoo much better.


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## CarolineRose (Nov 18, 2011)

Agreed. You can see a twinkle in Cecil's eyes like he's smiling for you.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

They look great!


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

shinzo-chan said:


> Aw I'm so glad they're all ok! I'm a little late, but I was reading through this post and as soon as I got to the recovery pics I started grinning my head off. They all made it!  *happiness* I was wondering how you came by them though, I know you said they were from a BYB but do you run some sort of rescue? Or did you just someone see what condition they were in and just baught them to get them out of there? It must cost you a BOMB in vet bills to have them all sorted O.O


I run more of a hospice rescue, my specialty is sick, old, injured and needy ratters. There was an ad up for Special needs rats (the 3 boys) from someone who had had multiple litters of hairless rats. I emailed asking if they could describe the eyes as there are several things that it could be and only a few things are dangerous. for eg. cataracts even early onset with babies aren't necessarily dangerous to them and they can live long lives with the condition.

Once I saw the babies I realized that it likely was a progressive thing and could be the debris under the eyelids like my other girl Lilith was prone to.

My vet actually totally rocks, supports my efforts and really really cut my prices on my bill yesterday.


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## binkyhoo (Sep 28, 2008)

Yea! For you and the group. You are their rattie angel. I know you and they still have a bit of road ahead. More get well wishes for your little patients. 

And your vet sounds great.


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## CarolineRose (Nov 18, 2011)

I wish I had a vet like that... mine charges me almost sixty dollars just to look at one of my rats. I tried to call him a few weeks ago to make sure their medication was still alright to use (I forgot to put it back in the fridge for a couple hours, oops) and he answered my question with a straight yes answer, I'm serious that's all he told me, and he then explained that he'd be adding a phone consultation charge to my bill when I brought my cats in for their checkup... I feel rather ripped off (it was only $20 but I still feel ripped off)


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Geeze...my vet lets me make phone consultations all the time!


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Really? A charge to talk to you for a whole err...1/2 second? Ewwww. I send emails, call and ask if they can ask questions when my vet is between appointments, etc.

This is how thin Cecil is without his "friend"...now we need to will some meat on those little bones










He's also shy about his incision, even though I reassure him he's a handsome handsome boy. 









Cecil and his brothers, Malcolm and Finley got a surprise package tonight. 

Auntie Jo and Nic, sent them a bunch of deckers since I was running dangerously low for my more disabled loves.

checking out the warm Cozy Corner pile...









then I tossed one down and he crawled right in and hasn't left yet. 

Ahhhh...mine.


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## CarolineRose (Nov 18, 2011)

Awe he's looking so much better today! I give him two weeks before he's plumped up from extra treats ♥ The incision also looks like it's already starting to heal, you've got a tough cookie on your hands  And I just thought I'd add the fact that you're one amazing person lilspaz, I don't think I could handle half of what you do for these little guys


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

CarolineRose said:


> Awe he's looking so much better today! I give him two weeks before he's plumped up from extra treats ♥ The incision also looks like it's already starting to heal, you've got a tough cookie on your hands  And I just thought I'd add the fact that you're one amazing person lilspaz, I don't think I could handle half of what you do for these little guys


It's my labour of love.  Now I am off to put drops in Nakie eyes, and then clean a cage before work LOL


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

This morning I was a bit late on Cecil's metacam (Shelagh...remember Nakie eyes are last, Cecil's metacam is first), and he started picking, so there's a bit of blood. He's not really picking at it hard and the metacam should take care of it soon, but I'll make sure he's stopped by the time I go to work.




























thinking about hopping up on the low hammock I use to prevent falls from the shelf above.










I watched him lightly hop up to the double decker...I was wondering how long before he managed that! Usually he's joined by 2 beige brothes cuddling up to him, while Oscar patrols the cage for intruders who might hurt his family. LOL


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Ahh yes just like I thought


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## CarolineRose (Nov 18, 2011)

I only wish there was a way to tell our pets that the stitches are for their own good and not to nibble. Then again people know this and still choose to pick at stitches and scabs, my we are certainly an odd species


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

CarolineRose said:


> I only wish there was a way to tell our pets that the stitches are for their own good and not to nibble. Then again people know this and still choose to pick at stitches and scabs, my we are certainly an odd species


He has glue, not actual stitches, but incisions often gap out a bit at days 2-3, then start the real healing on day 4.  Sooo pleased at how well he is doing!


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## Kiko (Sep 18, 2009)

I've been reading about Cecil through Facebook, a lot of people were rooting for him. I am so glad he made it through!


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Kiko said:


> I've been reading about Cecil through Facebook, a lot of people were rooting for him. I am so glad he made it through!


ON facebook? Can you tell me where? I heard Amanda (his former owner who ended up in a bind) posted about him but I couldn't find where. Amanda is very happy our little man made it, as I am sure you can tell 

I am a FB idiot, and haven't figured out how to post pics, so that's why it didn't go up there LOLOLOL


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

His incision looks really good, and he looks so much happier! Yay!


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

2 updates now...

Yara's eye looks a lot better to me, probably not useable, but not as painful or scary as before. More like Eli's eye when it was shrinking up on its own.

She's a very sweet girl, likes people, easy to handle,and licky on top of it all 


































And to show you how truly tiny she is...


























and...

Still a bit hunched at times, when he forgets.

Loki is still making a lot of noises so he was put on the zithromax "treat" like Cecil is, and hoping it does as much good as it did him.  Tommy is a nice nice boy, still a little shy with me, but he's relaxed a LOT.

Oscar is getting worse. He is hormonal, and territorial, rubbing on everything. He will leave the morning Ensure to patrol the cage and huff at the rats below, and last night tried his damndest to bite me. He is too old for a neuter, so I am just going to be careful and wait for time to cool his jets LOL. I think he's still the most tense of all of the boys, not letting go of his Protector duties just yet, which is understandable. When he's nice and calm I love to pat and cuddle him.

I am a bit worried over Cecil. He's lost weight, quite a bit of it since the night of the surgery. He was 280 g, and now weighs in at 253 grams.  I have learned NEVER to take him away from his brothers, he wilts like a flower and stresses easily.

He loves Ensure and he loves baby cereal, so I shall just keep offering that and try tempting him with other foods in between. He had some egg yesterday and a bit of short bread cookie was snatched and eaten. LOL

I think he's happy to groom bits he hasn't seen in awhile


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## BigBen (Nov 22, 2011)

lilspaz68 said:


>


Well, he may be losing weight, but he looks fabulous, and he's obviously very happy. Look at that beautiful smile!


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

You could try soaking dog or cat food in water for him, too, or giving wet cat food.

My group seems to prefer lab blocks to be soaked in water so they are mushy. When Rosebud was ill, they had a constant supply of mush-blocks and the normal ones weren't touched at all.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Thank you all for your well wishes!

Today Cecil seems so much brighter and alert and happier overall. He's also gained about 4 grams









He's walking normally and really approaching me and exploring more than just crawling under the blankets to sleep 










I think part of it is I keep offering him food...LOL




























I think we hit the 4-5 day post-op turning point for Cecil


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## binkyhoo (Sep 28, 2008)

Go Cecil Go. His pain should be lessening now? Put on a bit of weight you little ratter!


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

His fur looks so rough, and too big for him. :3 He's adorable.

I'm so glad to hear he's gaining weight.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Hi fur is going to take awhile, they all have somewhat harsh fur, but Cecil's very long fur has serious thinning patches (his neck, his head and his back) and I think this was from the tumour...


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## BigBen (Nov 22, 2011)

Up on his hind legs like that, in the last picture, he looks like a feisty old prizefighter. Go Cecil!


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## Rat lover (Dec 28, 2011)

I'm so glad to hear he has gained weight. Feel better Cecil!


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## Twister (Dec 28, 2011)

I have been following your thread and thinking about your wee Ratties and am so very pleased that they are recovering so well! Cecil is such a trooper as are the others. You are a truly sweet person to care for them. They are lucky to have you.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Thank you TWister 

Another quick update on Yara...I needed to share the improvement on her eye...

This was her on Dec. 30th










and this is our little butterfly last night...



















WOOT!!!

The older boys finally got their pic updates as well 

Waldo the day before his eye had all the dried horrible debris removed









Waldo's "bad eye" now









Melvin's eyes, the left still needs to be removed on Thursday. But remember this boy was blind in both eyes...

When they arrived Dec 22nd









Right before the vet visit









Now










His good "bad" eye


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Wow, wonderful improvements! 

Out of curiosity, when you have nakies do you flush their eyes every day? What do you use to clean the eyes?

I would love to have a hairless at some point in time, but the eye issues are daunting.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Kinsey said:


> Wow, wonderful improvements!
> 
> Out of curiosity, when you have nakies do you flush their eyes every day? What do you use to clean the eyes?
> 
> I would love to have a hairless at some point in time, but the eye issues are daunting.


When I get one who is prone to eye issues, I just flush their eyes with a natural tears solution, once a day


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Ok. I was thinking it was something like that. I was flushing Rosebud's eye when she was sick, so I should be able to handle a hairless if at some point I get one.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Well this is Part 2 of the Nakie's saga...today Yara and Waldo go in for re-checks, Norbert gets seen for the first time and his eye cleaned out, and Melvin has to have that ruptured left eye removed...poor baby 

I'll be off in about 45 mins and then a day of waiting and trying hard to concentrate on work things begins LOL


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Oh dear, concentrating in those situations is always tough..let us know how it goes, I'm rooting for them all.


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## Twister (Dec 28, 2011)

(((((((HUGS)))))))) to your wee ones!! Hope the day goes by quick for you!!


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Its been a bit of a whirlwind the last couple of days so I had no time to update...


Here's your Cecil update and then I'll do up another one for the Nakies...

Here he is last night, bright, active and quick!!


























He loves to groom which means that sparse harsh coat is just going to have to shine one day 









and especially loves to groom his belly...he actually has changed his grooming pattern...its normally lick paws, groom over head, turn to side groom flanks, etc, then belly and finally the tail (a lot of rats stop before the tail )...Cecil's is head grooming, then belly...then he might go on to the rest or he starts all over again


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Melvin's fine but I won't be...sigh, got some not so good news. These 4 are so genetically predisposed to these eye issues, that they are going to need special care for life, are considered Special Needs and not adoptable. They found more debris under their eyes since last week, and they examined it and found it to be mostly material. 
Basically they have to be in as lint free cage environment as possible. 

Melvin is doing very well after his surgery










1) no fleece, cotton, flannel, etc...I can put them on lint free cloths, or high thread count sheets, or tightly woven 50%cotton/50% polyester blends *ouch*
2) no litter...so no Yesterdays News, and as most of us know, nakies are Elmination Machines which means changing their cages as often as I can.
3) flushing eyes daily
4) their laundry will have to be washed separately from anyone elses
5) worst of all...Yara is going to have to be taken from Sage :sad-p: I am going to have to her spayed (ovariectomy) and get her in with Norby.
6) there will still be occasional visits to the vet for eye flushes like with Lilith...

My poor poor babies  I am going to have to do a lot of things JUST for them.

BUT if I don't, or don't do this well enough, they could ALL lose their eyes.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

In that situation I would almost just remove all the eyes anyway, just because the stress of the surgery and recovery might be less than them going in for flushing all the time.

Poor sweeties. Is Cecil still gaining weight? He looks good.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Kinsey said:


> In that situation I would almost just remove all the eyes anyway, just because the stress of the surgery and recovery might be less than them going in for flushing all the time.
> 
> Poor sweeties. Is Cecil still gaining weight? He looks good.


Removing all the eyes will be a last resort, going in every few months to be lightly gassed and have their eyes flushed out (15 mins tops with the vet) is better than surgery at this point. We are just beginning this road, so I will have to see how it turns out first.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I wish you luck- that's going to be a lot of work.


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## BigBen (Nov 22, 2011)

lilspaz68 said:


> Melvin's fine but I won't be...sigh, got some not so good news. These 4 are so genetically predisposed to these eye issues, that they are going to need special care for life, are considered Special Needs and not adoptable. They found more debris under their eyes since last week, and they examined it and found it to be mostly material.
> Basically they have to be in as lint free cage environment as possible. . . .
> 
> 1) no fleece, cotton, flannel, etc...I can put them on lint free cloths, or high thread count sheets, or tightly woven 50%cotton/50% polyester blends *ouch*
> ...


Wow! You are a saint for taking all this on. God bless you--as I am sure the ratties do, daily.


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