# RIP Nicky



## 1a1a

Nicky came into my life 8 months ago with another rat, Paris. Where Paris rampages about, owning the floor, Nicky was content to bumble around and in her later months, sit quietly on my lap or in any convenient hiding place. There is more I could say but I am having trouble articulating what was awesome about her in a concise manner... I am moved to make a post here in search of support from my fellow rat owners because her demise upset me considerably..

4 days ago, Nicky lost interest in food and water, the vet began her on antibiotics but by day two, she could barely move. I felt that putting her to sleep was the only right choice to make but retrospectively, wish it had been done a different way. The method my vet employs is the injection to the heart technique which I've since learnt is quite frowned upon by the rat owning community, at least, if done while the animal is awake...on learning this, all I could think of was Nicky's frail, unresisting body in my hands and the wholesale manner in which I betrayed her trust. I keep having flashbacks to the moment the vet lifted her partially up off of my hands by the scruff of her neck (so undignified) so he could access her chest and the sight of the needle going in... I had been under the impression that rat euthanasia was more like dog and cat euthanasia, not so violent and fast, the rat I had to put to sleep as a child slowly drifted off in my hands over a period of 10 or 15 minutes, Nicky was gone in 1. Did she feel safe in my hands? Distressed, was she out cold? Was her end preferable to the death from starvation or asphyxiation she would have faced otherwise, I'm no longer 100% certain. I thought I'd toughened up about the short life span of rats (I've had several over the years) but this one's passing has left me very melancholy and remorseful (I could have fed her more interesting food, given her better toys, more free time).

I did chat to the vet's nurse today who reckon he skips the gas part because that distresses the animal and he's good enough at getting it right the first time to not need to worry about having to undertake multiple attempts and I guess, at the end of the day, there is no right or painless way to take an animal's life, the body is keen to persevere.

At the end of the day, Nicky was a fine rat that I am grateful to have spent time with and she is already being missed. Thank you for reading, please feel free to share your thoughts.


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## lilspaz68

1a1a said:


> How come no one has anything to say?


Wow I never saw this. I am very sorry, but your vet is wrong. Dogs and cats get an injection right into the vein. Your rat gets a needle right into its heart, incredibly painful!

You need to take a stand and tell this vet, he either needs to gas them down or give them a sedative until they are unconscious then he can do his heart stick.

My own vet does a sedative to make them sleepy, then gas then the heart stick. Others do an IP (intraperioneal or into the abdomen) and they drift off after 20 mins, but for me it would be agony and too long for me to endure (not them).

IF this vet refuses, find another vet who realizes these tiny creatures deserve a painless sendoff and will respect their lives more than he does. You know those people who die within1 minute of being shot? Do they not feel the agony that entire minute? So would your rat.

((hugs))


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## ratastic

I'm so sorry for your loss.


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## 1a1a

I wish I hadn't trusted the vet (I've been driving out of my way to see this guy because he specialises, I beginning to think that he knows his rat medicine but he treats pets the same as he would treat a lab rat, the quickest, most efficient and precise route to getting the job done. Very recently, with my faith not yet completely shattered, I took the two new girls who will eventually keep the surviving rat company in for antibiotics and he adminstered the dosage using a long thing metal tube inserted the whole way down the throat, I was Mortified! So was the second girl who cried and cried and peed and cried until I said "maybe stop now, I'll try mixing the meds in with food" - which, I might add, in combination with a little dropper administration, worked a treat). :-(


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## lilspaz68

Oh he sounds incredibily uncaring, yes don't go to him anymore if you can help it 

What long metal tube-y thing would you use for meds? Were they oral meds? Vets don't normally give oral meds but injectable and send you home with oral. So something is soooo not right here!


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## 1a1a

I think the vet called it a gaboche. I mentioned the meds experience on another forum and someone referred to the process as intubation. Armed with this new word I searched the web for more info and pictures, seems like the metal tube is normally used to regulate breathing in anesthetized laboratory rats although it can be used to deliver meds orally (gastric intubation), so, we're talking common practice outside of pet medicine. Effective maybe, but not nice, type in slightly the wrong thing on google images and be deluged with imagery of how man treats his lab rats and mice. Sigh


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## lilspaz68

1a1a said:


> I think the vet called it a gaboche. I mentioned the meds experience on another forum and someone referred to the process as intubation. Armed with this new word I searched the web for more info and pictures, seems like the metal tube is normally used to regulate breathing in anesthetized laboratory rats although it can be used to deliver meds orally (gastric intubation), so, we're talking common practice outside of pet medicine. Effective maybe, but not nice, type in slightly the wrong thing on google images and be deluged with imagery of how man treats his lab rats and mice. Sigh


You DO not treat pets like this ever!!! I am so sorry you and your rats had to experience this person


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## smesyna

Yes, there is a reason they are gassed before intubation... Plus with a struggling rat he could have seriously injured your pet, it takes a lot of skill as it is to do it on an unconscious rat :-\

I'm so sorry you had to experience this, and I wish you luck finding a better vet.


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## 1a1a

There are certainly things about this vet that I question but somehow, I don't quite know how yet (if anyone has any suggestions I'm open to them), I'd rather compel him to be more gentle and considerate than jump ship... When I' m gone, other rats will still be going there. 

I conjecture that he feels confident enough with intubation that he can get away with doing it to a fit and conscious rat.....even if he is good, I'm sure there are other ways to do it which won't stress the rat out, I'd like to change his thinking... And as for poor Nicky, she was as weak as an anesthetized rat...but still a helluva lot more cognitive I'd reckon, I dunno about others but I only buy into this euthansia thing because they say it will be quick and painless. Well, quick, yes....

Incidentally, LilSpaz, another time I had to put a rat down, they must have done an IP cos she took about 20 minutes to go, it wasn't so bad, I sat with her on my lap at the vets (a different vets) and stroked her, maybe it tripped her out a bit (at least, I prefer to think that), she started looking left and right and continued to do that, even when she couldn't hold her head up any more, then she was gone. Definitely less traumatic for me as the owner (maybe for her too I hope).

PS I have couple of back up vets sussed out from a list of reputable locals if I can't convince my current one to think first


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## lilspaz68

Lets give you an idea of a real vet 1a1a...rats are NEVER intubated, during surgery, awake...never. Its too dangerous for them. For surgeries they use a mask with oxygen and usually isoflurane. Jump ship my dear.

Don't worry about aki's tumour it was removed successfully in the pic below


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## smesyna

Educating him would be nice, but it doesn't sound like he's open to learning  I agree with lilspaz, leave and don't look back...


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## Kinsey

Seconding that, get out of there.

I've never heard of intubation used on a rat let alone a concious one! I've seen it done on horses and it is NOT nice, and they are big enough for it to be able to be done without undue stress or pain. (Mineral oil was given to a horse on the verge of death, he is fine now.)


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