# What to do if my rats don't like me...



## pbskl

Hey all! Six weeks ago I bought two beautiful fancy rats, Selma and Patty, at the relatively young age of two months. They have brought my girlfriend and I hours and hours of enjoyment and are beloved members of the household, but their sociability has been getting worse and worse since we've owned them and I think it might be too late because they truly seem to dislike and resent us now! It's very frustrating, and a little hurtful. I'll try and describe what's been going on as best I can...

When we first got them they were certainly timid but also curious. We frequently stood outside the cage and talked to them and gave them treats. Selma would hang out underneath our hoodies for extended periods of time, or even sit on our arm, sit still, and let us pet her. Patty was less social but would approach our hands if we put them in the cage, nibble, crawl up a little ways, etc. A few times she'd crawl into a hoodie sleeve, sit still and let us pet her through the fabric which was so rewarding! We would build trust with Selma by letting her crawl into a hoodie sleeve but keeping our arm hovered above the cage so she could go back at any time. It seemed like we were making progress but then we had a series of mishaps -- it seemed like every time we were getting somewhere we'd screw it up! We have a glass aquarium with a wire cage topper, and sometimes when we'd put them back they'd be really eager to get back home so they'd hop out on to the cage and the sudden weight would topple it and they'd fall or get caught. One night Selma escaped a little playpen we had built and crawled under the couch for two hours, resisting our best attempts to get her to return to us peacefully before we finally had to crawl under and grab her. We always tried to get them to come out of the cage to us on their own but as they got worse we would sometimes get impatient because we were accustomed to Selma being more social in the past and would grab them... and now it seems like they only want to use us for food and treats and otherwise have nothing to do with us.

Selma doesn't want us to touch her any more, at all. One thing that seemed like a good idea was to put the cage on our bed, take off the top, and watch a movie so they could come out of their own volition and crawl on us, etc. Selma will come out, but if we make any motion towards her she will immediately scurry off. If we give her a treat and try to pet her while she chews, something that used to be quite successful, she'll scamper off and eat elsewhere. She will crawl on us, but if we make any motion toward her, or even look at her sometimes, she will hide. She seems to actively dislike us, and will only come near us if we have food and then promptly run away. Patty refuses to even come out of the cage! She will hide underneath her box the whole time Selma is out exploring. If we put a hand in the cage, sometimes she'll come out and lick and nibble it real quick to see if there's a treat to be had -- if there is, she'll take it and run to her box, if not she'll just withdraw back into the box. We can't even get NEAR her! 

It's hard to describe over the internet like this, but they both have this demeanor of resentment toward us -- they truly seem to see us as enemies to be feared and hated who happen to have food now. It's really sad and I don't know what to do... Please help! I want to be friends with my adorable rats and I'm beginning to think it's too late, that I have permanently lost their trust.


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## Kinsey

You can earn back the trust, but you need to get them out of the cage. The movie idea is excellent, I have done this with difficult rats, they get tired and fall asleep, and tend to become far friendlier. However, you shouldn't bring the cage out. That gives a place to evade the idea of discomfort, and they will use it if at all possible to avoid the thing they are unsure of. Take both out of the cage, clear your bed, spread a blanket on it, and put them up there. Sit on the bed and proceed with movie. When doing this, it's helpful to keep the movie volume low, they tend to be unnerved by it..I like to read, but sometimes the best thing is to just sit there quietly and interact with them, especially at first, then try the movie, so they do not become scared from the noise. Hold baby food in your lap and put it on your fingers. They cannot run away with baby food, so will need to stay and lick your fingers to get it all off. They will become more comfortable with you that way.

Also when you do this, you are the only place to hide, on that open, exposed bed. There's no cage, or hidey box. They will be fighting the hide instinct (coming to you) and the dislike of you. Ultimatly, the desire to hide should win, especially if you have food, and they will come to you of thier own free will.

I think they will tame up. You do need a different cage, though. Aquariums just don't make the best cages, they can be really rough on the respiratory system, because air has trouble circulating, and if things are falling and hurting or scaring them, then it sounds like a problem.


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## pbskl

Ok, thanks for the suggestions! I will definitely try that tonight! How should I go about removing from the cage, seeing as they really don't want anything to do with me? I've found starting playtime on a bad note by grabbing them tends to make them pretty antisocial, but I don't see how else I can get them out right now... 

As for my cage, it's unfortunately all I can afford right now in the winter when business is slow. Basically it's a wire half-cage you can attach to the top of an aquarium to double the height and offer them more room and stuff to play on. It is completely safe and stable as long as I secure it correctly, but sometimes I'll undo a latch so I can get in there better and I'll forget to reattach it once I've got them out, so if they leap on to it in excitement when I'm putting them back it'll shift and occasionally topple it. I know it's not even close to ideal, but it does offer them some wire to climb on, ramps, platforms, etc. and they seem to enjoy it. I am concerned about the respiratory hazards but they usually hang out on the platforms above the glass where air circulation is good, so for now it'll work. Once business at my restaurant picks up in the spring and I start making good money again I'll definitely invest in something nicer though.


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## begoodtoanimals

Avoid grabbing them as this will only confirm to them how scary you are. Instead put a hideout like a carton box in their cage that you can easily pick up if they are in there and take them out, (closed) box and all. Remove the box once they are out of their cage in their safe free range area.Avoid mishaps so prepare well. if they are ready to go back into their cage, offe them the box again to put them back.
Rats have a strong memory, which has made them so successful in the wild, so it will take time. You have to view the world through their eyes.
Please keep us updated. it is always fun to read about progress.


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## Kinsey

I've always just grabbed mine, antisocial or not, gently around the middle, and pulled them out. I don't have the patience to coax them out of the hidey box. The one's I've worked with have become used to the concept of being picked up, and tolerated it, despite being nervous.

I'd look on craigslist, too, for another cage. They can be remarkably cheap there. Garage sales, too, but it's a bit cold for that around here. I've had some luck with thrift stores. If you cannot find one, it sounds like it can wait, but the sooner the better.


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## Lil_Rattie

Hey there you can always look on KIJIJ. I ended up getting a gorgeous gym/play cage for my rattie boys. It's 4 feet tall on wheels. They have a lot to do! I know that cages can often affect how they react with humans. If they are frustrated. I have learned a thing or two while research and reading. Making it as positive as it can be can really be beneficial for your ratties.

My one rat is very very docile. The other is still little skittish but he is coming around. Like the other have posted don't grab. It'll only startle them. I have always been very soft, gentle and talk in a very soothingly voice as I pick them up. I move them gently until I can put my entire palm underneath their bellies and bring them to my chest. 

I hope this helps 

Oh and KIJIJJ you can always bid little lower (wink)

I got a 250-300 dollar cage for 80 dollars. She wanted 100. But I asked if she would be kind to do 80, after all they weren't intentionally going to be kept. She was MORE then willing to help me out.

Good LUCK!


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