# My rats are dying? Help?



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Hello, I recently adopted four young rats from a pet store. I had an uneasy feeling about it because I have had health issues from other animals in the past from that store. Anyway, two days after I adopted Denny, he died from a respiratory infection. He started sneezing a lot, had a runny nose and brown stuff. Now one day after the death, Pikachu is sneezing and acting less hyper than usual with a runny nose. The other two seem fine, just slight sneezing. I do not have them in the same room as my adult rats that I adopted somewhere else, because I have a feeling it is contagious and I don't want them infected. Moreover, I would have adopted from someone else such as a quality breeder or at least a healthy pet store but many places or people do not raise pet quality rats in my area (anymore). I was aware these were feeder rats, so maybe its my fault. I called the store today and spoke to the manager. He said the sales person that sold them to me should have said they had respiratory infections. I asked all the right questions, even asked if they were healthy before I adopted them. I asked if they had mites and any illnesses(I checked the fur and eyes). Two sales people said no, but I guess they have to do whatever to sell. I even inquired about the mass recall of rodents a few weeks ago. Apparently, many stores in my area and a neighboring area had a E. Coli outbreak. Ugh now my heart is broken. Should I separate the other two from Pikachu? They are both sneezing too,just not as bad. Did I mention the pet store said I could trade them in but chances are the new ones will be sick too, then he hung up on me. I am so agitated. =((


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

I would personally leave them together, what ever it is they probably had too, plus it would put more stress on Pikachu.

Sounds like this is either a Major URI infection, which is from bad husbandry (from the store) Or a virus like Sendai or SDA, both of which would increase the likely hood of getting and dying from a respitory issue like a URI.

Make sure to wash your hands and change clothes completely (maybe take a shower) and/or wait a few hours between groups. you do not want to risk this spreading especially if it's a virus.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Yes, I am pretty worried about it being contagious to my other animals or even myself. Luckily, I do not have their cage in the room where I keep my Guinea Pigs and my Two adult rats. I am just at a loss of words.


----------



## Possum Rat (Dec 30, 2012)

is it possible to get them get them to a vet & get an antibiotic? That is your best bet


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

I would not be able to get them to a vet this weekend. I do not have a car.. The earliest I would be able to would be Tuesday. The only vet in my area that attends to pocket pets too is in Mary Ester, which is an hour away.


----------



## unlikelyfather (Sep 11, 2012)

At the point at which your rats are dying, you really should not wait for a few days. It could be the literal difference between life and death for them, and as a responsible pet owner it's very important that you do the best you can. Is there anyone you could ask for a ride, maybe by offering to pay for gas?


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

The only person with a car is my aunt but she is on dialysis, and I doubt she would feel up to driving that far. The second person is my father but he lives in Alabama and I am in Florida. I have never walked to another city before, and I am kinda scared to because of the cold and creepers but I am thinking about it.


----------



## Possum Rat (Dec 30, 2012)

I would not suggest walking to a town that is an hour away. I mean that is dangerous these days.
Do what ever you can for your rats and maybe try to ask a neighbor you know.
My best to you in your situation.


----------



## mistymornings18 (Aug 13, 2012)

Your best bet is to take the to the vet and i understand the difficultly of that right now. 
Give them steam treatments in the bathroom, if you know the weights you can give them Children's sudafed to relieve some of the stress on their systems or baby tylenol which helps with inflammation. 
Get them in as soon as possible. 
Good luck, and hope all your rats get better. So sorry for your loss though


----------



## unlikelyfather (Sep 11, 2012)

Dark chocolate or unsweetened baker's chocolate are also good ideas. Make sure to keep an eye on the ratties if you steam treat them, because if they're suffering from pneumonia instead of a URI it'll make the symptoms worse and you should stop immediately. If you have any friends with a car or older cousins, you could try asking them. Good luck and my thoughts are with you.


----------



## RatzRUs (Feb 5, 2012)

I'm just going be blunt. They need a vet ASAP no exceptions. Yes,those tricks people are telling you to do will help,but remember it is not a cure


----------



## Jaguar (Nov 15, 2009)

mistymornings18 said:


> Your best bet is to take the to the vet and i understand the difficultly of that right now.
> ...or baby tylenol which helps with inflammation.


Tylenol (acetaminophen) does not help with inflammation, you want Ibuprofen (Advil, Motrin, etc.) for that.



RatzRUs said:


> I'm just going be blunt. They need a vet ASAP no exceptions. Yes,those tricks people are telling you to do will help,but remember it is not a cure


That point has been made multiple times already. Sometimes it's not possible to just up and run to an emergency vet. We have to work around that, and the tips people are giving may help enough for her rats to hold on until she CAN get them to a vet.

How are they doing today?


----------



## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

One of the main things with ill rats is roughly keep them hydrated, ideally eating and at the right temperature, if they are hot to the touch they need to be kept in a cool envirotment to help them breath clearly, if they are cold they need to be brought up to a normal body temp.. You can pinch the skin on the back of there neck to check hydration, if it's slow going back to normal they need more fluids, tempting them with fruit juice is often helpful as is milk and I think Gatorade over there. If they are eating keep them supplied with tasty easily digestible food, this will keep there energy up tp fight infection, if they look really ill then baby food ans similar is great (always have an emergency tin in ) . If they start feeling cool to the touch out anhot water bottle or what pad under half of there cage to help maintain there temperature, at this stage it's bad so it makes it more urgent.

Out of interest do any of them have bulging yes probably swollen neck glands or faces. This would mean it was likely to be Sdav and I know a feel experienced rat owners over here (including the UK rat health expert) advise a bit of brandy in there water and actually don't believe that blanket antibiotics help much. Admittedly that is in rats who have been generallybred to be resistant to Mycoplasma infections. Any way lots worth a read of http://www.nfrs.org/sdav.html for reference and http://www.nfrs.org/sendai.html too


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

I know little about the SDA and Sendai virus other then from what I've read (I've been lucky to never have had an issue with it). However, since it is a respitory issue, these things can help (assuming it isn't a virus, cure as well).

a bit of honey daily, any honey works (Manuka is recommended but it is super expensive, and any honey works). Mixing it into some baby food would be recommended. So will fresh parsley (dried will not work, I believe fresh Oregano also works) you can typically get a large thing of fresh parsley for under a dollar (Here it's about 54 cents and it feeds my 5 boys daily for 2 weeks or more). Tea will also help (Mint or Black). just make sure it is cooled down. If you want to make sure he is staying healthy mix in some Pedialyte into the tea (or the baby food). These things are all best given over the course of a couple of days. 

Personally Honey and tea works the fastest (these take 12 hours to 48 hours to fully kick in), but Parsley works but it can take a few days (3 to 5 days) of eating daily for the full affects to kick in.

How is he doing?


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Today has been a good day for Pikachu. He has been more active, and has playfully wrestled with his brothers today. So far all three are still sneezy, but their spirits are high. I have done my best to keep them hydrated and well fed. Luckily, tomorrow is Tuesday because I can get to the vet now. Thank you everyone for the advice. I have tried some of the treatments posted above, and they did seem to make a difference. I will do my best to keep everyone updated. Hopefully soon I can post pictures of them.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Hello everyone, the medications I received are called Baytril and Doxycycline. I had the vet show me how to give them the medication but I hope I can administer it right in the future. As for the boys, they are doing fine. Today they have been sneezy but still active. Would it be alright if I move their cage into the pet room? I am curious because I have three guinea pigs and two adult rats that are not sick. I do not know if even having their cage in the room would be contagious. I want to move them in the pet room because it is warmer and it has been very cold today. I forgot to ask the vet this question.


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Baytril and Doxy are the considered the best combo you can do for rats.

I personally wouldn't move them in there for a few more days, maybe a week, just in case. the Medicine only helps with the symptoms if it's a virus or bacteria they are still contagious for a few days.

Could you move them to another room other then your pet room?


----------



## unlikelyfather (Sep 11, 2012)

They can still be contagious unless the medication has been fully administered over the duration of it, and you don't want to expose your other rats to it. It can pass through the air in certain cases and it's better to be safe rather than sorry. If you have a small space heater or heating pad you could put it in the room to warm them up or near the cage, just make sure it isn't so warm that they'll overheat.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Their not in the pet room, and thank goodness. Unfortunately, Danny which was the twin of the pass Denny also passed away recently. It was sad, right when I thought they were improving. So far Pikachu and Cosmo are doing well, and I deep cleaned the cage again. D:


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

I'm so sorry 

Maybe see if your vet can test for a virus? I think you can draw blood from rats (though I think they need to be under anesthesia).


----------



## dashielle89 (Apr 24, 2012)

If they keep dying like that it definitely could be some sort of virus. Testing won't really do anything for you as far as curing or treating it, but at least you'll know what you're dealing with then maybe the vet will want to up the antibiotics to at least keep away secondary infections. To be careful you may want to wash before you handle the rats in the other room and keep the doors and vents closed to prevent it being transmitted through the air.

Weird though, I've heard a couple people mentioning their rats have to be anesthetized before having blood taken, I wonder why some vets are doing that. My vet requires pre-op blood work to be done before she will allow them to go under anesthesia so she knows their organs and everything are functioning well enough to handle it, seems like they could do other test just the same without them being put out or at least just giving a sedative.


----------



## Mousey (Oct 23, 2012)

Glad you got Doxy & Baytril. Please do not support this pet store anymore, even when you need to buy food or supplies. Where are you located? I'm sure there are some rescues in your area or close by.


----------



## unlikelyfather (Sep 11, 2012)

Hmm... what cleaning supplies are you using for their cage?


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Good point Unlikelyfather, what type of bedding are you using as well?

I'm still thinking a virus like Sendai or SDA though.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

I am located in the Panhandle of Florida, I contacted a rescue in my area that said they would see into the store. They were concerned mainly because of the recent E.Coli outbreak a few weeks ago the store was apart of. So far when I clean out the cage, I remove the litter and use an antibacterial soup first. I use a damp rag to do so. The soap I have is dial.Then I rinse after I have also scrubbed with a scrubby sponge. After it dries I spray it down with Lysol and let it sit for around 15 minutes before I rinse it again and let it dry a second time. As for bedding, I am using a mixture of carefresh and aspen curls.


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Carefresh can cause respitory issues, but I don't think it would kill a rat.

I would still try to see if you can find a vet who can do a blood test on them.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Thank you for telling me, I will look into other bedding. Pikachu and Cosmo seem to be improving. On a side note I found a breeder by chance on craigslist. She is going to let me adopt two male rex dumbo rat babies the first week of February, which happens to be around my birthday. I do not plan for them to be around Pikachu or Cosmo because I do not want them sick. Hopefully, by then Pikachu and Cosmo will be healthier. I am just really excited, and was very surprised to receive the email from her this morning. I honestly did not think anyone would respond to my add. She even sent me pictures of them, their mum and dad. =)


----------



## unlikelyfather (Sep 11, 2012)

Lysol products can have a very strong scent that makes me, a person with some lung issues, have problems whenever I spray them. I would suggest not using lysol when you clean the cage, and I'm not sure about your soap either. The recommendation usually seems to be vinegar and water, and sometimes baking soda. Dish soap is generally all right but anything with a lingering fragrance can contribute to lung irritation.

As for Carefresh, it's dusty... Personally I would swap to either all aspen or cage liners. Actually, for me, I was using aspen until that seemed to make Ras sneeze a lot. Since then I've switched to just paper towels, and that does a decent enough job for my needs. I clean the cage regularly in order to prevent buildup of smells.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Thank you for the advice. I will be aware in the future. On a unfortunate note, Pikachu and Cosmo passed away today. It does not even make sense, they were getting better. I did everything I could for them. I am really upset about this. It has been bothering me all day because lately they had been fine. I probably will not adopt feeders again, I just cannot bare it. At least I have my future rex boys to look forward to. It is comforting to know they are coming from a breeder. =(


----------



## cagedbirdsinging (May 28, 2012)

I'm so sorry for your losses. That sounds absolutely traumatic.

There are a few viruses out there that can wipe out an entire house of rats in no time flat. I've never experienced this (and pray I never do), but it sounds like this is something that may have happened to you.

When you get your boys, be sure to avoid any pet stores in your area or places with other rats. If you have to go somewhere that has rats, be sure to not return home for a few hours so that any potential virus has a chance to die off. This is why a lot of us take quarantine so seriously and do not even house new rats within the same building. Even though it's rare, these things do happen.

I'm sure that your next experience with rats will be a much better one. I hope you stick around to chat with us and learn as much as you can!


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

Thank you for the kind words, I will be staying around. I still have 2 adult female rats I had in another room, but one is sneezy with a runny nose like the ones that passed away. This is making me think whatever they had was very contagious if it traveled in another room. Right now I have Jasmine quarantine in one room away from Lamb Chops. I have had them for awhile now and they were very very healthy. If they die from whatever this is too I will never forgive myself because I was the one that adopted the others from the pet store that had whatever it is. Is it possible it could infect hamsters too? I have three hamsters in the room with lamb chops away from Jasmine too.


----------



## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Aw, I'm so sorry 

Rat diseases 99% of the time can not travel to other animals.

I hope your girls do not have it. I would disinfect their cage (Probably with warm water and dish soap/Vinegar) just to be safe.

Since it could just be a coincidence, give her a bit of dark chocolate and start Echinacea (you can buy it in a liquid or powder pill) once a day (either on 3 days, off 3 days, or on 10 days, off 5 days) to hope that it helps.


----------



## Pikachu (Dec 31, 2012)

I am hoping it is just a coincidence. I will try and pick up some dark chocolate at the market tomorrow. I am not sure what Echinacea is, but I will research it.


----------

