# Please help! Rats dying :(



## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

I have no idea what is going on. First one female lost weight suddenly, was really weak, and died. Now I have another female that has lost a ton of weight and is so weak.....I dont know what could be wrong with them....there are no vets in my area....What could strike so fast and be contagious among my rats? I have four females together before the first one died....and now that another one is 'infected' I am really worried that I am going to lose everyone....Has anyone else had this happen? Rapid weight loss, lethargy, sudden death? She is still eating but her hips are sticking out, her fur is really ragged...but there are no wounds or lumps...What could be killing them? I feed them a mix of cat food, rat mouse pellets, broccoli, carrots, and celery....THey are all only about a year old.....Does anyone have an idea what it could be? Please help....


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## Poodlepalooza (Aug 9, 2012)

I am not sure what it could be. Do you notice any noises with their breathing? Sneezing? Have you rat phoned her to listen to her lungs? you should only here the swish of air, no clicking noises. Until some one with more insight responds, try to get your girl to eat some Ensure or pedialyte to help keep her hydrated. Pedialyte or Gatorade can help with lethargy. Maybe some baby food in a yummy flavor like banana to get her to eat something. Avocado, not the part near the pit or skin, is a good food to help fatten them up. With baby food, you can mix in baby cereal (multi grain formula), baby formula powder or crushed lab blocks as well. You may want to try a little yogurt as well. I would try to find a vet somewhere, even if you have to travel. if it is something contagious it needs to be treated before it attacks all your babies. I hope one of the more experienced folks will be on soon & give you some advice.


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## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

Well there are vets in my area but none of them handle rats....and there are no issues with their breathing that I have noticed...No wheezing or sneezing or rattling chests....


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## cagedbirdsinging (May 28, 2012)

Did you visit a pet store recently with rats and then come home within 4 hours of the visit? It very well could be one of the viruses that are known to wipe out entire colonies practically overnight.


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## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

Yeah I have been to a pet store but I did not handle any of the rats.....I did purchase 3 mice about a week ago but they do not seem ill at all.....and they have not been in contact with the rats but are in the same room....what kind of virus could do this? Are the contagious to people/dogs/ other species?


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## cagedbirdsinging (May 28, 2012)

Handling isn't necessary. These viruses are airborne and we can carry them to and from places with infected rats. Your new mice may also have brought it in.

You need to call the nearest vet.


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## phatdaddy (Feb 3, 2013)

scary situation, time to seperate and clean up as much as possible. what area do you live in?


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## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

KY. yeah I am going to give their cage a good cleaning, I just wish I knew what was going on....and how to help them......


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## cagedbirdsinging (May 28, 2012)

If it is one of these viruses, it's already too late for separation. Everyone is infected. Your only option is to get to the vet ASAP.


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## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

But there are no vets in my area that handle rats....I just don't know what to do for them...or how to help....because the vets in my area only handle dogs/cats/ferrets ....


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## JLSaufl (Jan 20, 2013)

Have you contacted your vets? My clinic doesn't see rats, but my veterinarian knows about rat health and will come to my house to see them.

It's worth a call, someone has got to be able to help you, or direct you to someone who can.


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

While I'm not out ruling a virus, I wouldn't say it's the only thing that can cause this.

Check their teeth, do they look weird (what color are they). Have they been showing Any weird signs lately? like hanging their heads over shelves frequently, tiring quickly, rolling (hands always in a fist), eyes look weird, ect. It Is possible that this could be just a coincidence of CHF or other disease, especially if it's a genetic issue and they were related.

In the mean time if it Is something like CHF try to increase their fish intake (rats Love sardines) as fish contain a lot of amino acids that help with the heart.


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## Rumy91989 (Dec 31, 2012)

The pet store where you purchased your rats should have a vet recommendation, especially if it's a national chain as they're required to have contact with a local small animal vet.


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## cagedbirdsinging (May 28, 2012)

Any vet with a degree knows their way around pretty much any common animal. Medications have broad spectrums and at the end of the day, if it means billing a visit, a vet will see your rats.


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## iHayleyNorris (Jul 28, 2012)

Could also be a parasite of some kind. Tape worms can cause incredibly rapid weight loss and death in small animals? Any fleas in your house? 


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

OK start by checking the rats over thoroughly, Rat phone them, check for scabs and anything else that's changed about the rats and their surroundings.

If it's a killer bug and you have no vet, your screwed, but if it's anything else you have a shot at fixing the problem and saving your rats. 

So go through everything you find and post it and maybe someone can help.


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## iHayleyNorris (Jul 28, 2012)

Pics, pics, pics!


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## iHayleyNorris (Jul 28, 2012)

Check their stools as well. Any abnormalities about them? Color? Texture? Smell? Maybe pull a couple apart. If its a parasite, you might find some in their poops.


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## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

The first girl that died was hairless, so it was really easy to check her over for anything abnormal.....but other than being thin there was nothing. Well her teeth were really dark, and I know rats usually have yellowing teeth...but hers were almost the color of a penny....

Its hard to say about the poos because I have three girls still together, two of which are showing no signs of being ill.....The remaining girl is really thin, i can make out her backbone and hips even through her hair which is really rough looking right now. Her balance is off....she tries to climb the side of the cage but falls, but that could be because she is too weak. I fed her some of her favorite foods last night so that she could get a bit of weight back, and while her little belly is now 'normal' looking the rest of her is skeletal. 

I am not trying to be cruel to my rats and not take them to a vet.....I understand that that is the best option and I want to take them. So please stop recommending I do so, because I cant....Within an hour and a half drive of me there are two vets. One of which hates rats in general, and only sees dogs and cats. The other will see more exotic animals on occasion, but not rats.......there seems to be a general mind set around here that rats are nastly mean rodents....And no one wants to mess with them.... I put some of that rodent vitamin stuff in her drinking water last night, but all in all she seems a little bit stronger.....but so did my hairless girl before she suddenly passed...

Does anyone know of a drug that can help there immune system? Like give them a boost? And has anyone tried using ammoxacillin with their rats? I just don't know what to do, I feel horrible that this happened.....


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Teeth are not suppose to be brown. Sounds like it could be an infection of some type or from something they are eating.

Balance being off is a very bad sign, and even a thin rat shouldn't have balance issues. this could be something like an ear infection, or more serious like a PT, but since she is eating and you haven't mentioned any other signs such as falling over while walking or rolling (like how a dog rolls) or clinched fists, it probably isn't PT. could be CHF (Chronic Heart Failure). most of the time it's easily fixed.

I'm not sure of any medicines you can get them, but Fish (like sardines) and Flax oil would help. so would Vitamins (remember though that these are expensive) are co-enzyme Q10, L-caritine, and Taurine. All of which though can be found in fish and liver (chicken liver would be best). Honey would also help out, especially if it's an infection.

Can you give a full list of symptoms? Do any of them smell funny? anything else?


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## Flora (Aug 30, 2012)

Is there a Petsmart near you? The Banfield Vet clinic inside the store will be able to help.


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## JLSaufl (Jan 20, 2013)

I'm not trying to be rude or mean, but I guess I'm wondering why you would get a pet full knowing if it were to get sick there would be no place for you to take it?

I cannot imagine that NO vets will not help you, and exotic vet is just that....an exotic vet. Whether they like rats or not, they should still see them.


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## cagedbirdsinging (May 28, 2012)

The bottom line here is that you *NEED* to visit a vet to help your rats at this point and keep them alive. There is nothing that we can do to help you. You need a professional.

Can you give us your zip code so we can locate your nearest vet? It does not have to be an exotic vet. Any regular vet should see you, and I find it hard to believe that the nearest standard vet is an hour and a half away.


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## Rat Princess (Jan 28, 2013)

They live in KY probably in the country the nearest vet from my home that will see rats is 45 minutes away too. Umm I used amoxicillin on my baby and it helped, but if it's not bacterial it won't help and it isn't that effective even if it is bacterial. You also have to measure it and dose her right with it, which is difficult to do without the right things. You have to know their weight along with other things, so unless you can do that you don't knowing if you are giving them enough, or possibly giving them too much. To much is hard to do, but my boyfriend told me there were tests done on rats to see how much they could handle and bad effects started happening at the level of 250mg, which is really high so I would definitely not do that. I medicated my baby without a vet, but I purchased a lot of things so I could do it right. A lot of people don't support it, but if I wouldn't have my baby would've died. I know what you are going through and I'm sorry I can't help. I think vets can choose which animals they see, if I were an exotic vet I wouldn't treat snakes or poisonous frogs. It's a title that usually means they might treat it, but it's not always true.


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## iHayleyNorris (Jul 28, 2012)

I understand not being able to take them to the vet, no matter how much you want to. I use to have the same situation until I moved. 

Definitely quarantine the sickly rattie. Maybe put a heating pad in her cage with some fleece covering it so she can stay warm and fight off infection. 


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## mistymornings18 (Aug 13, 2012)

Some of y'all are being very rude to her!!! This isn't her fault and she can't help that they won't see her rats. I didn't check every vet in the city to be sure that someone would see pet rats before I got them. Sheesh lay off. 
I'm sorry your pet is sick. I'm not sure what can be done. Hope that they get better. 


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## mistymornings18 (Aug 13, 2012)

JLSaufl said:


> I'm not trying to be rude or mean, but I guess I'm wondering why you would get a pet full knowing if it were to get sick there would be no place for you to take it?
> 
> I cannot imagine that NO vets will not help you, and exotic vet is just that....an exotic vet. Whether they like rats or not, they should still see them.


Vets can pick and choose which pets to see. 


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## mistymornings18 (Aug 13, 2012)

cagedbirdsinging said:


> The bottom line here is that you *NEED* to visit a vet to help your rats at this point and keep them alive. There is nothing that we can do to help you. You need a professional.
> 
> Can you give us your zip code so we can locate your nearest vet? It does not have to be an exotic vet. Any regular vet should see you, and I find it hard to believe that the nearest standard vet is an hour and a half away.


Where I used to live the nearest vet was 2 and a half hours away. The country is different then the city. 


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

I'm Not going to join the vet debate thing (One of those things that Always lead to a big fight that no one wins)

How are they doing? Has anything new happened? new symptoms (symptoms going away)


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## iHayleyNorris (Jul 28, 2012)

What you might consider doing, even though you can't physically take them to the vet, maybe go online and search neighboring cities to see if they have exotic vets. Call them up and explain your situation and why you can't drive 6 hours to take rats to the vet, maybe they'll be able to give you some advice over the phone? 

You could also fake sick, go to the doctor, get them to prescribe you Amoxicillin and treat your rats with it. If its not a parasite, it's most likely a bacterial infection and the broad spectrum antibiotic amoxicillin should nip the infection in the butt. There are medicine conversion charts in the Internet for antibiotics using animal's weights. I know, it's a dishonest way of treating them, but you do what you have to sometimes. I've done it for my babies before. Or maybe ask friends and family if they have any antibiotics laying around? 

Of course, if its a viral infection, the antibiotics won't help. But it's definitely worth a try.

Good luck to you and your babies!


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## Misfitdolly (Feb 16, 2013)

It almost sounds as if they are ingesting something toxic, the way they are losing weight but still eating. Could there be something in the cat food? Have you recently switched cat foods or added the cat food to their diet? From what I am reading cat food is too high in protein for rats. Something just keeps telling me it's the cat food but I don't really have any basis for that. I hope you can figure it out and the others don't become sick.


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## Poisoned (Nov 17, 2012)

The only thing I've noticed with people who feed cat food is that the rats are overweight. 

I really don't know what this could be... I would just do my best to keep them hydrated. Also, if you can, switch to fresh veggies and lab blocks until they go one way or another. Ensure is also a good thing to help them take in nutrients.


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

if your going to go the "dishonest" route (I do not think it's "dishonest") you can buy Bird baytril and Doxycyclin without a perscription (both used for bacterial infections) though do be aware that these are at higher dosages then what they perscribe for rats so you need to change around the dosages/dilute them.

Cat food contains so much bad stuff in it that if it's a low quality cat food I would not be shocked. Personally I would get cat food out of their diet, it contains too much meat protein for rats. Normally rats on cat food have very greasy to very thin fur, but I've never heard of death unless somehow it was contaminated by something that wouldn't normally affect cats.


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## Flashygrrl (Feb 8, 2012)

I'm curious as to what brand cat food your feeding. Most of those sold (supermakerket brands) aren't really even fit for cats....


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## eggroll (Feb 23, 2013)

Thank you to everyone who has been supportive and nice throughout this ordeal. I know I should not get a pet if I do not have a vet in my area that will handle them, but these babies were feeder rats. Even the hairless gal. So their alternative was not very pretty either.....I think I will try to take the cat food out of the diet, I have heard low protein dog food is better, has anyone tried it? She seems to be doing a lot better, her belly is somewhat round and her hip bones don't stick out anymore. Her backbone is still prominant though....but she is moving around a lot more, and even tried to run on her giant wheel but I removed it because I was afraid she would work off the little weight she put back on. She still seems sort of weak and can not climb all that well...but all in all she is better than two days ago when she looked like she was on deaths door....Another female seems to be getting slightly thin, but nothing bad so far....I think it is a virus like someone said...moving through all of them one at a time....I just wish Gizzy could have survived it....She was the one who has really dark teeth when she passed...She was also rather small and had URI infections often, but they always cleared up with vitamins...maybe her immune system was just too weak to fight it off... 

Right now I am hopeful that she will make it, and the other rat that is showing symptoms does not seem to be as severe. My two males have still not shown a sign of weight loss....and are both chubbeh ^_^.

I cleaned both cages thoroughly though. Every nook and cranny. So hopefully this will help them to keep fighting.

And yes...I live in the country in KY, rats are not seen as pets here...and when I purchased my gals from the store they were pretty shocked that I wanted them as pets. I understand that it was not a logical decision or a responsible one.....but I made it. Thanks to everyone showing support, I feel horrible that I cant take my babies to the dr...I actually called one yesterday that I located and were suppsed to see exotic animals...but when I said it was my pet rat that was sick the vet immediatly refused to see me....told me to find another vet....So yeah...they can pick and choose who or what they see.

Thanks again to everyone that was nice <3 I think for now I will focus on keeping their cage super clean and making sure they all eat, because it looks like Simmy is slowly coming out of it.


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Sounds like it probably is CHF to an extent. most rats with it can have this happen. Try to make sure she gets fish at least once a week and she should be fine.

I wouldn't use dog food at all. rats have issues with meats as they are Not designed to eat a meaty diet. Dog and cat foods are mainly meat making it hard to rats to digest and can strain their liver (rats do not have gal bladder to store enough bile to eat a lot of meat fats, only enough for the rare bit of meat) I would invest in a good quality lab block like Oxbow or Harlan Teklan. Oxbow is easier to get, and Harlan you have to order online or have a store order it for you but both are very good rat foods and in the long run are way better.


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