# Rat math...oops



## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I'm sure you all are very familiar with ratty math.

I accidentally on purpose bought another rat yesterday. 

Puts me at six girls and one boy.


She's a teeny tiny little double rex dumbo. She looks like a velvet rat right now. Blue with a headspot and berkshire belly.

I think she's going to be a shoulder rat- she reminds me of my heart rat, Romeo, who I miss dearly. She glued herself to me right away. 

I've named her Fleur. All my girls have cutesy girly names so she had to have one too. She is soooooooo cute.


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## Kelseyrawr (Jun 12, 2014)

"Accidentally on purpose bought another rat" Hahahaha! Yes! That's how we got little Maxxie X) I can't wait to see pictures of your new little lady!


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## PawsandClaws (Jul 22, 2014)

She sounds like a total sweetheart. Pictures please!!


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I was doing tarantula math and picking up a baby Pumpkin Patch tarantula, but I ended up doing rat math too..

oooops. 

I will try to get some photos coming soon.

She is shy and very calm. She flattened out on the bottom of the cage when intro'd to my group, who are very sweet, ranging in ages and very used to newcomers. I ended up letting her ride in my hood for like two hours, and she was snuggled right in. She tried my bra but kept slipping, there's not a lot of extra room in there..

She is adorable though.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

Rat = Yay!

Tarantula = Yuck!


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## rudecrudetattooedfatgirl (Aug 30, 2014)

Really Dan? Really? We work so hard to educate people on how awesome rats are and you judge something else to be icky?


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## PawsandClaws (Jul 22, 2014)

Yeah, Dan's comment rubbed me off the wrong way too but I didn't want to say anything. With the bad reputation that our pet rodents get, we (the rat community) should be more understanding of other people's exotic pet choices. I am sure he did not mean anything by it, probably didn't think. I think tarantulas are fascinating personally but would never own one myself because I am a little fearful of spiders generally.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

I just hate spiders. Plus, to me, tarantulas don't really seem like "pets". They're more like living exhibit that you'd have out of fascination so I didn't think anyone would get offended by me calling them icky.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

PawsandClaws said:


> rubbed me off the wrong way


The way you phrased this made me chuckle. Never heard anyone say "rubbed me *off* the wrong way" before. Sounds dirty that way.


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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

Dan203 said:


> Tarantula = Yuck!


I politely disagree with your statement but I can respect it. Perhaps Dan is an arachnophobe, there's nothing wrong with that. Don't jump on the poor man for his opinion.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

Hey-Fay said:


> I politely disagree with your statement but I can respect it. Perhaps Dan is an arachnophobe, there's nothing wrong with that. Don't jump on the poor man for his opinion.


Not really an arachnophobe, as they don't terrify me, but I certainly have a strong dislike for all spiders. Most bugs actually. They just skeeve me out.


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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

I love spiders but crickets give me the heebeegeebees :/


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## PawsandClaws (Jul 22, 2014)

Crickets scare me too and they constantly find their way into our home. I never want to kill them but I am also too frightened to relocate them so it usually turns into a huge mess.


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## rudecrudetattooedfatgirl (Aug 30, 2014)

I put a smiley! It was meant to be a gentle chiding.


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## mimsy (Jun 8, 2014)

My husband is with you Dan on the spiders. Hates em. I love bugs. Unless it's a parasite-that grosses me out-fleas, mites, lice, bot flys..yuck-sorry to offend if someone likes those. haha


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I am offended by that. I have eight tarantulas I love like my children. They are very precious to me. The same way as my rats are. Your feelings would be hurt if someone said that about your rats. Don't say it about my spiders.

For those who actually have some interest, I have-

(common and scientific names)

Abigaile- Togo Starburst Baboon, H. Maculata
Melinda- Mexican fireleg, B. Boehmei
Valeria- Chilean rose, G. rosea

The rest have no names yet (it's hard..they live 30 years so picking names is a process)
Pumpkin Patch, Hapalopelma Sp. Columbia
Brazilian Blonde Birdeater, N. Tripepii
Curly hair, B albopilosum
Brazilian salmon pink birdeater, L. paryabhana
Green Bottle Blue, C. cyanopubescens


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## mimsy (Jun 8, 2014)

I guess my feelings don't get hurt that easy about things like that. My Mother is terrified of rats and considers them disgusting. She just barely handled the ferrets. The skunk was on the disgusting list. I'm 45 years old and she is 70 and she is not changing her mind. It doesn't upset me or offend me. She's always been freaked out by..well everything but cats and dogs. Even my horse scared her.

She knows I've always had a small zoo happening at my house, everyone goes into their cages or into my bedroom when she comes to visit. Honestly for her being able to look at them through bars is her coming a long ways. There was a time she wouldn't even go in a house if she thought there was rodents or reptiles in it.

Love her dearly, love my pets dearly. Everyone had their own phobias and fears mild or severe. Mine are parasites, with a mild following of humans-humans can be nasty vermin imo.

with that all said, my 17 year old daughter keeps asking for a tarantula. Which I wouldn't of minded if I didn't end up with a HUGE amount of rats currently. So she may have to wait till she moves out-or if she doesn't move out, wait till our pet population is down by a lot. I babysat my old science teachers tarantula-I don't know enough to tell you what kind, he was very large and very boldly colored yellow and black. It was really beautiful.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

That was more directed at Dan than you. It wasn't a very polite way of saying he wasn't fond of the pets I have..


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## Jaguar (Nov 15, 2009)

Hey-Fay said:


> I politely disagree with your statement but I can respect it. Perhaps Dan is an arachnophobe, there's nothing wrong with that. Don't jump on the poor man for his opinion.


Everyone is entitled to their opinion, of course. But they should also express that opinion in a mature manner - "yuck"ing someone's pet is not that. It contributed zero to the topic and was just unnecessary. Please, if you have nothing meaningful to contribute to a topic, do consider taking up casual chat in The Lounge instead. Thanks!


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Anyway.

Fleur is a shoulder rat for sure. She rode around in the collar of my sweater for a long time while I went to pick up litter, treats, and bird snacks at the pet store. No one knew she was there until she moved or was pointed out, she just kind of crashed and cuddled up to me like a little warm beanbag.

Chloe, one of my older rats, had her pinned and squealing tonight poor doll. Wasn't hurting her, at least not on purpose. Fleur's skin is very delicate and the other rats have scratched her some while grooming her. But Chloe was trying to remove the ointment I put on. Silly rats.


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## Akarah (Sep 2, 2014)

Kinsey said:


> Anyway.
> 
> Fleur is a shoulder rat for sure. She rode around in the collar of my sweater for a long time while I went to pick up litter, treats, and bird snacks at the pet store. No one knew she was there until she moved or was pointed out, she just kind of crashed and cuddled up to me like a little warm beanbag.
> 
> Chloe, one of my older rats, had her pinned and squealing tonight poor doll. Wasn't hurting her, at least not on purpose. Fleur's skin is very delicate and the other rats have scratched her some while grooming her. But Chloe was trying to remove the ointment I put on. Silly rats.


Can't wait to see pics!!!


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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

Kinsey said:


> For those who actually have some interest, I have-(common and scientific names)Abigaile- Togo Starburst Baboon, H. MaculataMelinda- Mexican fireleg, B. BoehmeiValeria- Chilean rose, G. roseaThe rest have no names yet (it's hard..they live 30 years so picking names is a process)Pumpkin Patch, Hapalopelma Sp. ColumbiaBrazilian Blonde Birdeater, N. TripepiiCurly hair, B albopilosumBrazilian salmon pink birdeater, L. paryabhanaGreen Bottle Blue, C. cyanopubescens


I have a mature female A. Metallica who's very much my baby. I can pet and handle her and she's as docile as a kitten; and as soft as one too! Believe it or not but i was once an arachnophobe. I got over it once i realized how awesome spiders are. I would love to have a green bottle blue one of these days, they're beautiful!


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Avics are great spiders. 

My GBB is a very fast moving little beast and not at all friendly. It spent 3 weeks loose in my house a while back because when I opened the lid, the little guy burst out of it and was gone.

Out of all those spiders I can only hold a couple. The curly hair is a baby still but I can hold her, and the rosea I can hold. He is a mature male sadly and doesn't have long, he's been mature over a year, but he's a great guy and I love him. The rest are look don't touch, especially the togo starburst. She will ruin your life. Heart palpitations and muscle spasms are a side affect of a togo bite..so I leave her alone.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

Any animal you can't even touch without fear of it "ruining your life" isn't much of a pet. It's more like a living exhibit.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

...she's still a pet. Would you touch her? Enjoy your heart palpitations and suffering. Oh, and bonus that there's really nothing a hospital can do, you have to ride it out. There is no antivenin.

Just because I don't touch her doesn't mean we don't interact. I enjoy watching her feed and interacting with her through her enclosure. Don't be so closed minded. You don't have to touch it to love it.

I don't touch my scorpion either. And she's super precious to me. 

I choose not to take the risk of a very painful bite and do not handle Abigaile with my hands. I use a metal implement to enter her enclosure when I have to. I also do not handle some of my more traditional pets. Like a gecko I own named Monster. Or my squirrel. Or the hamster I had for 3 years that I rescued. They don't want to be held.

Next you'll tell me my snakes aren't pets either because they are cold to the touch and they don't come when called...oi.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Tarantula  This is Valeria. Chilean rose.

Now tell me again how he's not a pet.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

Kinsey said:


> Next you'll tell me my snakes aren't pets either because they are cold to the touch and they don't come when called...oi.


I absolutely would say that, albeit for slightly different reasons. Pets are suppose to provide some sort of emotional return. Spiders, snakes, geckos, etc... are incapable of that. They can learn to tolerate you as a non-threat but that's about it. They are not biologically capable of caring about you. The hamster and squirrel probably could become pets if you were to put in the time and effort to socialize them, but if you just leave them alone in their cages then they're just living exhibits too. While I'm sure that you care for them all it can't possibly be the same sort of emotional bound you have with the creatures who actually have the capacity to love you back.


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## rudecrudetattooedfatgirl (Aug 30, 2014)

Ok. Everybody back to your corners. Relax...unclench. Pets are like art, it's entirely subjective. If you don't think something is a pet...don't get one. If you feel a connection with your spider then it's real, because it's real to you. Our opinions are all valid, they just differ. Just try to be respectful of other people's beliefs.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Dan, please relocate to another thread. I'm beyond livid.

To tell me that my most beloved companion, Jason, is not a pet is like saying he is not also a snake. He is so precious to me. And to say a snake cannot bond to a human is ludicrous. It is a different bond than one experiences with a rodent, dog or cat, but a bond none-the less. Jason will come to me when I enter the room, shows a definite preference for my prescence over that of others and will try to return to me, and has worked out how to get his way. So have some of my other snakes. Jason is so beloved to me I would sooner sell my soul than be separated from him. Some of my other snakes, Devil's Due for example (female rat snake) have worked out how to make cutesy eyes when they want something and show an ability to be trained to do or not to do a behavior. Both of my rat snakes are crazy clever beauties. Many of the snakes I am closest with will respond to my entrance to the room by lining their little selves up to be taken out of their cages. They even have favorite foods, caging preferences, heck, Jason picked out a cat bed he HAD to have and then moved right on in. 

They are a different creature but by no means are they exhibits. I would sooner put myself at Jason's mercy than that of my squirrel, Tim. He is a non-releasable adult fox squirrel rescued as an adult. He has brain damage and issues. Though I have and continue to try and bond to him he rejects me with very painful bites.


I got pictures of Fleur and a couple other rats. Here they are. Fleur is the blue, Chloe is the agouti and Lucy is the cinnamon rex.


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## Sabatea (Aug 23, 2014)

Not to cause anymore problems but I myself am not too fond of spiders. I did search up your little ones though and I mus say that greenbottle blues are absolutely gorgeous. As are togo starbursts. It's a shame they can't be handled but I see no reason why you can't have them as pets and cherish them without them allowing you to play with them. I don't always pet my dog but I still love her regardless. I'd love to see pictures of more of your tarantulas if you have any!

Fleur is also absolutely beautiful! I'm so glad you found this little girl and gave her a good home. I can't wait to hear her adventures as a shoulder rat. She seems like she'll do wonderful as one. You seem to have so many wonderful animals! XD


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

You don't have to LIKE them..but just my feelings are hurt at the rudeness.

Thank you! She sure is a nice little rat. I am very fond of her already. I spotted her sleeping beside Echo today. I knew Echo would take her under her wing. She's a PEW, massively massively obese. I rescued her. I love her personality- she's a darling. And seems to be maternal. So I knew she would help Fleur. Fleur is pretty young, maybe too young to really be with so many adults, but they are caring for her and she gets individual time with me. I maybe have another heart rat..and that would be very unusual. My Romeo was my heart rat..I've never had another one.


I suppose you could try to handle some of them. But I choose not to. Some people do- I do not think it is a good idea. Tarantulas stress easily as well so the individuals I have who can deal with being held are it. If I want a kiss or something I can go see one of my other kids. Jason the boa gives nice little nose kisses. My dogs will gladly kiss me all day too, and my lovebird knows how to give a kiss as well. No shortage of love in my house.

Here's Melinda, the mexican fireleg. She's a fireball, not friendly and fast moving at least at this age. Once she matures to full size she'll be too heavy to move so fast.


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## surrounded (May 24, 2012)

I think you did your math wrong...you were supposed to get 20 more rats! Quickly GO BACK!


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## Akarah (Sep 2, 2014)

Hi Kinsey, I could be wrong, but are your girls (Ratties) kept in tanks?


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Akarah- no they are not.

Those are mice tanks in the pictures.  Mice do rather well in tanks and most cages can't hold em, they're too tiny. And a gecko cage too.


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## Dan203 (Jul 10, 2014)

Kinsey said:


> You don't have to LIKE them..but just my feelings are hurt at the rudeness.


This is the internet, people have different opinions, if you're feelings are so easily hurt you might need to find another way to pass your time. My original comment about the spider being "yuck" might have been a bit rude, and I apologize for that, but nothing else I said was rude. I was simply stating facts. While you may love your snakes and spiders they are biologically incapable of loving you back. Their brains are simply not evolved enough to allow that sort of complex emotion. They can learn to tolerate you as a non-threat and maybe even associate you with food, but that's about it. Anything else you think you feel is simply a projection of your own feelings. 

And for the record I don't hate snakes. I actually owned one when I was younger. (ball python) They're fascinating creatures.


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## Jaguar (Nov 15, 2009)

Enough. Anyone else who wants to carry on this petty argument will get a suspension. If you want to debate whether snakes/tarantulas/whatever else make good pets, take it to Rants and Raves, but seeing as this is in the rat section let's keep it about the rats.


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## Jessiferatu (Apr 30, 2014)

...Aaaaaaanyway.

Fleur is adorable! "Accidentally on purpose" is pretty much exactly the reason I have so many rats. Lol.


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## Akarah (Sep 2, 2014)

Kinsey said:


> Akarah- no they are not.
> 
> Those are mice tanks in the pictures.  Mice do rather well in tanks and most cages can't hold em, they're too tiny. And a gecko cage too.


You have nice too😊 wow, must take my hat off to you! To own many pets with different needs is hard work and time consuming! You must love them all very much😊


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I certainly do love them. I have a sort of zoo at my house.

Animals have been my passion my whole life, and by extension of that, I have a lot of them. Caring for them is pleasant for me and relaxing and I enjoy their personalities. 

Fleur is doing great with my group. Her patchwork stuff is going nuts, part of her is bald and some of her is curly and she's just goofy looking right now.


The really obese female (Echo) I was talking about before is loosing weight! She looks a hundred times better. Still horridly obese but better than before. She's got open access to food still of course but it's healthy food, and treats are for the most part also healthy and they get fresh food every day. So it's doing her lots of good. I am happy to see her looking so happy. She even managed to climb up the cage side into the upper hammocks! She could never have done that when I got her.

Sadly, Peony, her sister, has a large tumor and it seems stable but may be growing slowly. I rescued her with the tumor. She seems happy but I am sad that she will not have as long with me and my pack as her sister. I love her even though she is shy and Lily, one of my youngsters, really adores Peony. I find them cuddling a lot.

Fleur has been spotted bossing her cagemates around too, cheeky little lady she is. And she's eating from my hands now. She was never scared of me, but somewhat reserved when it came to food- that's long gone, the other ladies have shown her the way.


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## Ratpax (Aug 24, 2014)

Akarah said:


> You have nice too wow, must take my hat off to you! To own many pets with different needs is hard work and time consuming! You must love them all very much


Ditto, doing a good job with so many different species and varieties is really something.

I keep a few different species, myself, but wow, it's a lot to learn and keep up with. Like the OP, I thoroughly enjoy it all, though, and find it very therapeutic.

Interesting thread--some humans apparently view _pets_ as "worthy" of that term only if they can be demonstratively affectionate towards humans in some preconceived manner.

I have two VERY adorable (in the conventional human-dictated way) bunnies who don't care to be picked up, cuddled, or really handled in any way. While most rabbits don't really enjoy being picked up, these little guys came to me as adults and well, being cuddled just isn't their cup of tea. 

I'm fine with that--I try to make sure their lives are as happy and fulfilling as possible, even if that happiness includes me not petting or holding them. They are very cute _living exhibits_, I suppose ;D

I'm glad to see the thread back to focusing on "rat math," but it is enlightening to see how humans act--I am active on a dog forum that is specific to a breed that often is demonized, vilified, and the target of Breed Specific Legislation. It never fails to amaze me when a member there goes off on "wicked, vicious Pit Bulls," which is apparently one of the only breeds more hated than the one for which the forum was founded. Ironic, and not in a good way. 

We could all learn to be more respectful of the *responsible* owners of animals which we might not choose ourselves to share life with.

I think Fleur is adorable--have a double rex girl myself who also does the "patchwork" coat thing. My girl is naughty and wicked smart--good luck to you if Fleur follows suit.


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