# Introduction Frustration



## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

Guys.........I'm at my wits end! I believe I started the intro process (cages next to each other) a few days before thanksgiving.........hummm maybe it was a few days after but anyhoo it was around that time. The group is still not successfully introduced. 

I'm frustrated. 

I went through a BIG intro process. Pulled out all the tricks for insurance, and it seemed to work until I put Cricket (new rattie girl about 4 months old) into the cage. I know they are suppose to squabble (and they did at length) I had her in for a day or two but I always saw her in the same place all the time. The little hanging basket in the corner. She seemed stressed and unhappy even though I caught her in a hammock with other ratties on occasion. I just lost my nerve I guess, and I plucked her out of the cage. It really seemed like they were all just picking on her terribly. Her tail was showing evidence of many nips.....sigh..... I think I really just hurt the process by taking her out. 

I have introduced one rattie to the bunch successfully. Wasabi (my hairless rat) seemed to be picked on terribly also, and it was hard for me to bare that as well; however, there was a big difference. Wasabi seemed to be less afraid of them than Cricket is. Wasabi was like "Hi how ya doin.. what's up....whatcha doin...i'm wasabi....hey look at me!" She was in their faces all the time. She was scratched up a bit for a day or two but that didn't stop her from getting in their faces. 

Cricket just seemed to stay in that basket, and come flying out when I opened the door. I'm at work 8 hours a day usually, so I guess I could not be sure if they were getting along during sleepy hours.......... anyhoo that's the background info. 

I started the whole process over again 

I left the two cages by each other for a few weeks, then I cage swapped. Then intro in the bathtub..........still agression. Left them a few days tried the bathtub again, then moved onto intros on their free roam area. They'll be fine for a few mins then MORE AGRESSION. I went back to neutral territory, and while they seem to be a bit better there is still agression.........help............

I know Cricket CAN live with other ratties, as she had cage mates at the shelter.......I just don't understand. 

I need some ideas, tricks, advice, miracles, help, uggggg i'm just fed up! 

I guess I have one specific question about intros. 

It says don't separate unless you see blood......WELL you can "see blood" when they get scratched but is that severe enough? How much blood do you need to see? Does it count if they get nipped on the tail and you see red but no significant blood flow? I just need clarification. 

.....again..... help.....


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## glindella (Sep 9, 2007)

Do any of the other rats get along with her? Maybe if she makes a buddy from the established group it'll be easier to move her in... If nothing else shell at least have a friend

Im really grasping at straws here, my intros haven't been going well either:-(


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## Berks (May 15, 2007)

How much time do they spend playing in the "free roaming area"? And is there one out of your group who seems to be the most aggressive with her? Or is it all of them?


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

when i start having problems like this i give them all a bath at the same time. they hate me for it but they bond over it. it may be an underhanded trick but it does work if most of the resident rats are being aggressive and if the new rat is. it doesn't seem to work as well if only one resident is being bully though. it helps some, don't get me worng there but she was still pushing the new rat around a lot while the others ignored it. i think part of that was because the bully was also the queen of the colony. i fixed that by rotating rats into the new rat's cage for a couple of days each. i started with the ones that the new rat seemed to get along with best then ended with the queen paired with the one that got along with the newbie best. that's what worked from my trouble intros. after they stopped huffing at each other and settled down i left them like that for a day or two then cleaned the main cage, redecorated and put the newbie and the queen in with the other residents at the same time. the queen and the newbie were never best of friends and would squabble the most out of everyone but i would also find them rat-piling together too. everyone was pretty happy most of the time in the end.


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## pooky (Dec 10, 2007)

i have also been having trouble introducing my naked rat to my blue rat.i need help too.


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## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

I'll answer some questions......

The boys didn't seem to mind her that much but all the girls at one point or another seemed to pick a fight with her. 

As for their free roam time it depends on the day...never less than one hour a day however it's usually around 2 hours 1-2 times per day. 

Twitch....I actually did give them a bath during my first attempt at intros with Cricket but no luck. I needed to give them a bath after the pudding lol. 

now for and UPDATE!!!!! 

so I decided to take the rats who were most aggressive toward Cricket, and hold Cricket and one of the others at the same time on my lap. I was talking to both and petting both. So I did that, and I brought all the ratties up to the bathroom (neutral territory) and I sat in there for 15 mins saying in a firm voice NO when they would fight with Cricket then I left them in there, and I was on the other end of the door in the computer room. I listened for distress but none came. I went in and they were mingling. I think they finally decided I was serious about them getting along. So after about an hour I put them in the cage, crossed my fingers, and watched for aggression. I watched for about 40 mins, and nothing but really minor squabbles, and Cricket was even exploring the cage!!! So YAY, so far so good! I haven't seen her in her "safe corner" since. 

phew.................


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## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

I thought they were fine. They were showing no aggression. I wake up and Wasabi has a bite on her nose, and cricket's toe is i dunno bit off? Split open??? My boyfriend suggested she caught her toenail but I really don't think so. The vet can't fit me in until 2 today. This all blows!


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## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

They let me take her in early. I don't understand..... they all looked fine, they were mingling. I just don't understand.


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

it is possible she ripped her toenail on something, it is an unfamliar environment. and the other may have gotten in a fight with someone else. unless you're there to see you can't be sure. do you have video camera that can record when you aren't there?


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## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

Dan has a camera but I dunno how long it would run. In any case I really don't want to chance it again. I just don't want to put her back in there. My ratties seem unusually aggressive toward her.........the vet patched her up......another 100$ vet bill as well . We are beginning to run a bit low with christmas and 400$ worth of vet bills in one month. I have two options at this point. 

1. get another FN (the smaller version) because any other cage would cost just as much and be worse. 

OR

2. give her away to dan's sister who adopted one of her cagemates already.  I LOVE cricket. She is super snuggly and I completely fell in love. 

Dan's allergic, and having a second huge cage isn't really the best option either............ I'm just sad right now


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## AlexzRose (Aug 15, 2007)

I'm sorry to hear it's not going so smoothly. 

Sadly I dont really have any advice. I've been lucky with smooth intros so far..


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## Mana (Apr 22, 2007)

How often and how long did you let them mingle together outside of their cages before you put them all together? It sounds and from the times of your posts that they had one good meet together and then you put Cricket in their cage? Also, did you very thoroughly clean out the cage before you put her in so it didn't smell like anyone? I also completely rearrange so no one has their usual spots anymore.

What I would do is just continue letting all of the rats mingle in neutral territory for while. At least once a day, every day. Keep the cages next to each other, do cage swapping, all that jazz. Take it very slowly. If there's one or two rats particularly aggressive with Cricket, do that thing again with Cricket and the other rat on your lap for a while.

It sounds like they're warming up to her, just very slowly. At first there would be aggression right away, and then eventually it took all night before anything happened. So I'd just keep it up, take it slow, have patience!

Another thing I do, is put the new rats in the old cage (after multiple successful play times with everyone) during the day, while I'm there to keep an eye and ear on them. If there's any concern about real fighting, I put the new rats back in their cage before I go to sleep or leave.

One of my rats is a bit difficult when it comes to newcomers. She just doesn't like new rats. So it takes a while for her to warm up. I remember her first (and second and third...) meeting with little Kismet, I thought she was going to kill her! Now they're the best of friends ^^


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## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

I've been trying to intro them for a few weeks. I believe the first time I did intros I did the first step over a few days, and the rest all in one day! The seemed fine then but like I said she just looked miserable, and she stayed in her safe zone. She was in the cage for a few days, and I noticed nips on her tail, so she came out. Then I had the cages by each other for a few weeks, and I would repeat each additional step for a day or two. I had a few set backs and had to go down a step but then they finally seemed to be moving on, so I did the other steps and put her back in the cage. It seemed fine FINALLY. No fights, she was exploring, then I found her under a towel. I was getting her out when Leela went for her, and she jumped outta the cage....the lower half. I didn't see leela go for her foot it was for her side, so it's very possible that her toenail caught on something when she jumped......I just cant be sure about that though. I've nearly given up at this point, and I'm too nervous about trying intros again. I've just considered buying another cage, and trying to intro a different girl to cricket..........I dunno. I'm in a bit of a rush......my info is probably convoluted, so I'll try to write something a bit more understandable when I'm home in a few hours. mmk I'll be back


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## pooky (Dec 10, 2007)

congrajulatons mopydream! winkie dripped two drops of pee on pookie! is that suppose to happen? my rats are not fighting winkie is teaching pookie not to do things she dislikes like getting in her face.


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## mopydream44 (Jun 10, 2007)

congratulations? What for? 

Your intros are going well if there is no blood, and they are certainly going much better than mine if they don't result in 100$ vet bills! YAY! 

Update
Cricket was climbing on the walls of her cage when the other ratties were free roaming, and Leela bit her foot through the bars of HER OWN CAGE!!!! Throws hands up! STILL FRUSTRATED. I'm going to build a C and C cage, and get cricket a friend..... perhaps I'll think about intros again in the future.


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## pooky (Dec 10, 2007)

sorry i miss read something. have you tried cleening the cages thoroughly and putting them in the bathtub together with water. did you put their cages next to eachother when they were in them?


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