# Skinny young rat, suggestions?



## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

Hello folks,

On black Friday we purchased three rats from the bin at petco. All three looked active and had no symptoms of illness (at least that I, being totally inexperienced in picking rats could see). Two of the three were quite small, with a black berkshire being the smallest (about the size of a small adult mouse). After we got them home, I noticed that the little guy felt skinny (i.e. I could feel ribs, etc.) but I thought nothing of it as I thought he was very young and smaller than the others, so probably had to compete for food and for all I knew, baby rats might normally be that skinny. 

Today he felt just as skinny, if not skinnier, while the other two have continued to grow and gain weight. I can feel his spine, base of skull bones, hip joints, upper leg bones, and the vertebrae in his tail... He basically feels like he has no fat on his body. His stomach is not sunken in though and he has no other symptoms that would point to parasite infection or other illnesses. 

At this point, I am thinking that he has either some sort of congenital issue (i.e. can't digest or process certain nutrients, etc.) or that he has teeth issues...Which I can't check due to his squirmyness and small size... I'm afraid I'll hurt him while trying to restrain him to look. 

I'd like to try giving him access to higher fat / protein foods alone, so he gets a chance to eat them without being bullied away by the other boys, just in case he's not getting food due to that (or is unable to fight for food because of his weak condition). He seems fine behavior wise, still climbs, eyes are clear, normal poo, no signs of mites or lice, etc. so I'm leary about separating him because I think that would cause him undue stress. When offered food alone, he does not act as if he's starving and might in fact eat a little slower than the others.

Could you guys suggest some foods I could use that are safe, maybe easy to chew (in case of teeth issues), and would help put weight on him if it is bullying / small size at fault? I tried a piece of walnut today (which he nibbled on) and also have the following on hand if any will work: tuna, cheese, salmon, and eggs (which I could boil). He is currently eating 23% protein lab block from petco(I'm waiting on harlan teklad to arrive) and a treat supplement of oats, oat and rice cereal, dry pasta, unsalted sunflower seeds in the shell, and rice with occasional carrot pieces and raisins. 

If anyone has any tips on foods or any ideas about what might be causing this, I'd love to hear them.

Thanks,
Artgecko


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## Gannyaan (Dec 7, 2012)

Can you see if he likes mushed eggs and olive oil ? It will give him extra fat and protein  

Other foods to gain weight I can think of off the top of my head 

Oat meal with olive oil (no sugar...)
Avocado (avoid region close to skin 
"Ensure" 
Tuna with lots if olive oil 


Hemp oil and flax oil are good too  


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

I don't know if it would help but if he'd been younger id suggest soaking his lab blocks in soy milk. There's also nutrical paste you could try. I wouldn't do too much added protein as those levels are really high. 

Offer those protein snacks you have during free range if you choose to offer them. He's more likely to get to it. Put in a second food bowl if you suspect he's not getting it, or scatter feed. 


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## Pandandelion (Oct 20, 2013)

Hard boiled eggs are a good source of protein that are soft enough to chew if he's having teeth problems although I doubt that might be the case. You can also feed him mealworms, which are protein packed and very easy to eat. My rodents love them and will devour one in seconds. They're also good for enrichment because you can put two or three in a box with shredded newspaper or bedding and let the ratties search for them. Pet stores sell them in containers of 50 or 100 for cheap and they'll last a pretty long time if you put them in the refrigerator because it puts them in a sort of suspended animation.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

Thanks for the suggestions guys. 
I may look into the meal worms... i have purchased superworms for my geckos before but didn't realize rats would eat them too. I have some almond milk on hand...but it's "vanilla" and is sweetened, would it help to give him lab block soaked in that? My harland teklad should've arrived last week, but I think the USPS lost the package and have emailed the seller... Hopefully it'll arrive this week and I can switch them over. There's only one bowl of food in their cage now, but I find pieces stashed all over, so I'm not sure if food access is an issue but I'll add an extra bowl just in case.

If this is congenital then I guess there's not much I can do but give him access to food and wait. 

Thanks again!
Artgecko


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## Gannyaan (Dec 7, 2012)

Almond milk is extremely low in protein... Soy would give him the extra he needs  


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## Finnebon (Jul 15, 2013)

Try Nutri-Cal. It saved my 2 special babies when they were very very young and not able to absorb the nutrients well enough when they were starting to eat solid foods. You can get the tubes (I use the Dog one, but I think they're all the same formula, just labeled differently) in almost any pet store. The tube is a bright orange color. They're kind of expensive, but if you look for them online, they're much cheaper usually. I just bought 3 bottles from Dr. Foster and Smith website which has a lot of good pet supplies. It takes about a week to get it delivered, so even though it's a few bucks more, you should buy a bottle from a pet store now so he can start eating it right away. then if he likes it, you can order more online for cheaper.

Give about a thumbnail sized glob two or three times a day until he starts putting on more weight, and then cut back to twice a day, then once a day when he's filled out more. The other babies will love it too so it will be a good tool to use to bribe them to like you faster.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

Thanks for the tips everyone! 
I'll try out the eggs and the oats / olive oil tonight. He looked even worse today and is making a "clicking" sound for lack of a better description when breathing.  The other two still look healthy at least. 
Finnebon- I'll look for the nutri-cal locally and if I can't find it, I'll order it... Even if I can't find some for him it might be a good thing to have on hand for future issues.

I got my harlan teklad today so I mixed some in with the old blocks, I figure I'll mix them 50/50 for a couple days, then reduce the amount of old blocks until they're switched over. I now have two bowls in the cage so he should have easy access to food.


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## Gannyaan (Dec 7, 2012)

If he's making a clicking noise, he's sick and may need antibiotics......... Thats probanky why he's skinny/ sickly....... 


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## Finnebon (Jul 15, 2013)

For the clicking it might be the start of a URI. Try giving him some slightly watered down RAW honey (it won't have any effect if it's pasturized). If he won't eat it just straight, you can try mixing it with yogurt or mayo or something like that. Anything to get him to eat the honey, and that should help for now. If it's not too bad, the honey should fix it.

Try soaking his lab blocks in whole fat soy milk or whole fat goat's milk too and he should eat it more happily and hopefully put on some more weight! I hope he feels better soon. Baby food is usually always a good option, almost any of the savory flavors they will like.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

Thanks for the advice! The clicking just started a couple days ago so I think the weight loss weakened his immune system causing him to be susceptible. I happen to have some local honey in the pantry so I'll give it a try. I will get some baby food as well. Do they tend to like fruit-flavored things? My crested geckos eat food that is similar in consistency to baby food but it comes in fruit flavors (you mix with water to get the right consistency). 

Here's the analysis of it (I'm thinking it's too much protein?) 
INGREDIENTS: Pea Protein Isolate, Germinated Brown Rice Protein Concentrate, Stabilized Rice Bran, Dried Honey, Fructose, Flax Seed Meal, Schizochytrium Algae (source of DHA), Dried Fig, Dried Date, Alfalfa Leaf Meal, Dried Kelp, Spirulina Algae, Calcium Carbonate, Malic Acid, Taurine, Natural Fruit Flavors, RoseHips, Calendula Flower, Marigold Flower Extract, Phaffia Rhodozyma Yeast, Paprika Extract, Turmeric, Potassium Citrate, Guar Gum, Salt, Magnesium Gluconate, Canthaxanthin, Calcium Propionate and Potassium Sorbate (as mold inhibitors), Rosemary Extract and Mixed Tocopherols (as preservatives), Lecithin, Vitamins (Vitamin A Supplement, Vitamin D Supplement, Choline Chloride, Ascorbic Acid Phosphate, Vitamin E Supplement, Niacin, Beta Carotene, Pantothenic Acid, Riboflavin, Pyridoxine Hydrochloride, Thiamine Mononitrate, Menadione Sodium Bisulfite Complex, Folic Acid, Biotin, Vitamin B-12 Supplement).
 Guaranteed Analysis: Crude Protein min. 27%, Crude Fat min. 7%, Crude Fat max. 9%, Crude Fiber max. 6%, Moisture max. 8%, Ash max. 5%, Calcium min. 1.2%, Calcium max. 1.4%, Phosphorus min. 0.6%, Vitamin E min. 100 IU/lb, Vitamin D min. 1000 IU/lb, Vitamin A min. 10,000 IU/lb.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

I have sad news to report. Sheldon refused food yesterday evening when i tried some of the things you guys mentioned (oats in olive oil, honey, and eggs). He was shakey and was breathing with an open mouth. Today when I came home he was dead / not moving. When I removed his body, I noticed that his stomach (lower) was somewhat bloated, while the rest of him was very skinny (could feel all of the bones). I'm wondering now if he had megacolon and I just didn't notice... I just happened to stumble across a post about it in another forum secion and some of the symptoms seemed to fit (small, skinny, poor muscle tone in back legs, bloating).  I'm not sure if that was the case, and it would seem odd since he was a berkshire.

I feel bad that I wasn't able to save the little guy, or even have time to take him to a vet. 

I disinfected the cage, changed all the litter / bedding and am keeping a close eye on the other two. So far they are acting normally. I did give them some cheerios with honey on them because I noticed some sneezing and wanted to help stave off that developing further.

I'm hoping these other two are ok, whatever was effecting the little guy seems to have been an individual problem at least.


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## Gannyaan (Dec 7, 2012)

artgecko said:


> I have sad news to report. Sheldon refused food yesterday evening when i tried some of the things you guys mentioned (oats in olive oil, honey, and eggs). He was shakey and was breathing with an open mouth. Today when I came home he was dead / not moving. When I removed his body, I noticed that his stomach (lower) was somewhat bloated, while the rest of him was very skinny (could feel all of the bones). I'm wondering now if he had megacolon and I just didn't notice... I just happened to stumble across a post about it in another forum secion and some of the symptoms seemed to fit (small, skinny, poor muscle tone in back legs, bloating).  I'm not sure if that was the case, and it would seem odd since he was a berkshire.
> 
> I feel bad that I wasn't able to save the little guy, or even have time to take him to a vet.
> 
> ...


Oh my gosh I'm so sorry  I feel for you ... Was worried about the little guy ... I hope the others are staying healthy ... U did ur best for him 


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## Finnebon (Jul 15, 2013)

Oh no, more bad news... I'm sorry for your loss... It is possible that any rat can get megacolon, but HWs are much more likely, but it's still possible your baby could have had it, or even that he was HW but the markings were so subtle you couldn't see it. Poor little guy, I know you wanted him to pull through, I'm sorry he was ill instead of just skinny.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

Thanks guys. I'm thinking he had a combination of a URI and a congenital or genetic condition. he didn't seem bloated enough for the megacolon to have killed him (if that was what he had) but it would explain the emaciation and maybe it made him more susceptable to a URI (the clicking). 

The other two have started sneezing more and one is wheezing... I will be starting them on meds this afternoon (my local tractor supply has some and I found a dosing chart for some on a rat/mouse club site). I'll let you guys know how it goes. This is a pretty disappointing start for me, especially when I tried to pick out "healthy" looking rats and now have one dead and two others ill.  I'm hoping to get the current two healthy so that when I get my new rats next month (the babies I'm adopting) they won't catch something (I will be quarantining though). 

Thanks again for your help and advice.


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