# sneezing blood (NOT porphyrin!)



## justmudtrout (Aug 28, 2007)

Yesterday morning when I got up, I carried out my usual routine of getting ready for school and giving the rats breakfast - cheerios and fresh banana slices. Phrixus (my buck) was happy, active, and glad to see me awake, as was Lily (my girl). I had a half day of school that day, and I came home at lunch to a question of, "Did you notice anything strange about Phrixus this morning?". No, I said, he was normal and chipper. I was told to go into my room, and this is what I saw:

I saw red spray and globs smeared across the top of their PVC pipe. I saw it blasted across the side of my wall, a good foot and a half long at that. I saw the fleece 'carpeting' saturated in various spots. Their window of their wooden hut had a cm thick ring of red along the bottom of it. The insides of all of their huts were sprayed. It was clung to the cage bars... it was everywhere, from one end of the cage to the other, from top to bottom.

I was stunned. At first I thought it was porphyrin, or rather, I wanted it to be, but there was a lot of it and I could smell a metallic tang. Phrixus had it around his muzzle and his paws, and over his tail. Lily was clean.

Mom and I took him to the vet immediately. I brought along the piece of PVC pipe to show the vet, and he took a swab of the red and confirmed it to be blood, containing a number of white blood cells as well. But here's the kicker... he could find nothing wrong for there to have been that much blood. No missing toes, no bitten tongue, no abscesses, no cuts, nothing. His breathing was normal, his lymph nodes were not swollen... there was just nothing.

Not knowing what else to do he prescribed antibiotics for both Phrixus and Lily, because white blood cells do indicate something being fought against. I had also explained that there were no 'warning signs' of something bad to come. He had been perfectly fine, save for a bit of porphyrin (of this I am certain) around his eye and nose occassionally and a bit of sneezing for both him and Lily. Nothing unusual, nothing serious. The house has been dry and we've had some fluctuations in weather, everyone in the house has some form of sneeze or irritation in that department. I gave them both echinacea and 2 days prior to this incident, what little porphyrin I had seen had cleared up.

Yesterday Mom and I stripped the cage down and scrubbed and washed EVERYTHING. I even scrubbed down the bars and the 'storage section' of the cage to minimize dust, or anything, that might be causing irritation or infection. We also double rinsed all of their fleece and soft things, so be sure it wasn't the detergent. Even the stuff that was already clean we re-washed with the double rinse cycle. I also made a trip into town to invest in some more towels (their hut-bedding-of-choice) so that I could change them out more frequently (as in, everynight), as Lily has a poor habit of peeing in her bed but sleeping in it anyway. Anything I could think of to protect against environmental problems. We even sat up the humidifier in my room to combat some of the dry air. 

Yesterday evening, Phrixus was fine. He wasn't sneezing blood, he was content, active, and had a healthy appetite. This morning and afternoon he was also fine, and there was no trace of blood in the cage anywhere. At supper time, however, just as I was about to give him his dish of food, he sneezed blood, and I noticed a bit on the pvc pipe. Not much, but just the same. I brought him out on the couch with me so I could watch him. By half an hour though he was no longer sneezing blood, and he had never sneezed up much anyway during this period and was happy to eat his supper. He sitting beside me now as I write this, gritting his teeth and roaming around the desk, fine as could be.

I realize that I am not giving the antibiotics a chance to work... but I have never heard of it and cannot seem to find any information about it. It's concerning to me that the vet does not know what is causing it and is really just 'trying' the antibiotics to see if it helps. Mom wonders if perhaps it was a blood blister of some sort. I was just wondering if any of you rat owners have any idea about this?

If it matters... the antibiotic prescribed was Clavamox. Phrixus is neutered and just over a year old, while Lily is a bit younger than him.


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## ~KK~ (Jan 26, 2010)

Is it possible that he got a nosebleed? It could have been a burst capillary in his nose that took awhile to clot...but i don't really know much about rat health, just what came to mind when I read this.


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## justmudtrout (Aug 28, 2007)

I suppose it is possible, and it was something we wondered about it, but there sure was a lot of it for such a little critter, and for it to just be a nosebleed I would think?


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## AMJ087 (Aug 27, 2008)

Ive never had this happen but obviosuly if you are concerned go to a vet. If it stopped and hes fine its probally a nose bleed I would think anyway.


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## AvaAdoreSmashing (Dec 31, 2009)

Sounds like it could be a nose bleed. perhaps his nose dried out and the skin cracked causing it to bleed... Dry weather sucks. I would keep up with the meds due the white cell issue. Very strange. I've heard you sometimes have to be careful with humidifiers, but if his breathing hasn't been wet then it should help. You could also try using warm water in it. Maybe letting him roam the bathroom while you shower for the steam could help.


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## justmudtrout (Aug 28, 2007)

AMJ, please re-read the message. I took him to the vet immediately, but the vet could not find a cause but prescribed antibiotics to see if it would help. I am looking for some idea as to what it could be, as it is concerning to not know what is wrong when your rat is sneezing a fair amount of blood. It has not stopped although it has lessened in amount. If it's a nosebleed and nothing more serious that's good, but again, there was a lot of it the first time it happened. 

Ava, I'll be careful with the humidifier then. I will certainly keep up with the medication just in case. Here's hoping it's just a nosebleed afterall!


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## Jaguar (Nov 15, 2009)

If it persists or happens again I would consider getting an xray of the nasal passages done as it could be a lesion or something in there.


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## AMJ087 (Aug 27, 2008)

Sorry, its ok. We all make mistakes. I agree its probally dry weather then.


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## psycho_ash (Sep 27, 2009)

I hope he gets better...

Lemmiwinks had a really bad dry-nose problem, she got bad, non-stop poryphin all the time from her eyes and nose. I set up a humidifier and ran it 24/7 and it cleared up literally overnight and she was fine for the rest of her life. Because of this, I personally believe that humidifiers are a godsend.

I am tending to agree with the nosebleed theory... although the white blood cells worry me. I guess this is just common sense, but I'd keep an eye on him and keep doing what you're doing. 

If anything does happen, it certainly isn't because you aren't a good caretaker.


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## justmudtrout (Aug 28, 2007)

Jaguar, I'll keep that in mind, thanks.

and no problem, AMJ. 

Thanks for the comments, Ash. If there is an infection or something else the antibiotics should help. I'm glad to hear that so far it does sound like it's just a nosebleed, and I am also glad to report that he is still doing fine and there has not been any more blood since the little bit that occurred yesterday around supper-time. They're both very spoiled and I do what I can and then some for them.  I'll keep the humidifier going once in a while, because it's helpful for the rest of us too with this dry air, and I'll be sure to keep an eye on him. 

Thanks guys!


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## psycho_ash (Sep 27, 2009)

Does your humidifier have a humidistat? Lemmi always seemed to do best around 50. At 40 she'd get dry again, and at 60 she would get the wet-sounding breaths.


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## justmudtrout (Aug 28, 2007)

Unfortunately not, it just has a high and low setting. :/ I turn it on for a while and then turn it off. But so far so good, there have not been any more incidents and there was no blood today at all.


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## psycho_ash (Sep 27, 2009)

Well, there's no blood, so you're doing something right.


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## Whythis85 (Dec 20, 2021)

I have had this happen with my girl Eve. When I 1st got her she wasn't in the best shape. When she started to feel better she started sneezing blood. At 1st my vet didn't believe it was blood until I showed him a video. He wasn't sure what it was and but her on antibiotics. After a while she was fine. Now 6months later she has started up again. I am not really sure what drives this and my vet who is normally very knowledgeable is stumped.


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