# Squamous cell carcinoma? Ear Infection? EDIT: Pictures



## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

Emily just called me all in a panic because she just found a lump on Zuzu. She noticed it when she was giving him a bath - it wasn't large enough to see with all of his fur dry. From what she described, his cheek from below his ear is swollen. It's got a purple hue and it's darker than the surrounding skin, roundish-ovalish, and it feels squishy but it feels harder in the center. It doesn't move with the skin. She says he acts like it hurts when she touches it but not enough for him to squeak. She described that he was bothering it a lot by cleaning it and things, and he's got a head tilt, but he can walk fine. She also said that he was shaking his head often. Additionally, she indicated that he's lost energy.
Another thing of concern is that he's got yellow-white discharge coming out of his ear (she described it as looking like "melted earwax"). From what she told me, it's very thick, but not chunky. There's enough to get on her fingertip, and it doesn't have a smell. His ear is red at the site but he can move it. 

She was gone for the weekend, so the cage was a little dirtied when she got home. Zuzu's pretty old - he's going to be four soon - but he's in great health. However, in these past two weeks his nutrition hasn't been the best because we had an unexpected and very long wait for some Harlan Teklad from Kim's Ark. I can't think of anything else that may be relevant, save for the weather and the fact it's changing.

Anybody have any idea what this could be? Emily's first thought was tumor, and mine was ear infection, maybe an abscess.. but now I'm thinking a cyst or tumor  Emily will have pictures for us by tomorrow, hopefully, but until then, any suggestions on what it may or may not be, and what we can do for it?

Thanks a bunch  We really appreciate any help or suggestions you guys can offer!


EDIT// I read up a little and, from what I can tell, it may be a little like this:
http://ratguide.com/health/figures/squamous_cell_carcinoma_figure_2.php
Any ideas?
I also found this:
http://ratguide.com/health/figures/squamous_cell_carcinoma_figure_4a.php
http://propellertail.com/case_study_1.html

EDIT 2// I know veterinary care will be the automatic response, but we really need some other suggestions for the meantime.  Neither I nor Emily have jobs, and Emily's mother isn't too keen on the rats (she figures they're "just rats" and vet care is a waste of money for them). While we will do our damnedest to get Zuzu to the vet as soon as we possibly can - this will include me giving her what little is left of my money and having her pay me back - and while Emily does get an allowance for what she does around the house, it's still questionable as to whether or not Emily will be permitted to take him to the vet.. so we really need something we can do in the more immediate sense.  In the mean time, though, I will be doing research and we will both be vet-shopping in hopes of finding somebody that can care for him well and doubly at a little less of an expensive cost than the vet I went to for Damian's neuter. Hopefully we'll find somebody who will look at Fletcher's bumblefoot and charge it as one appointment.


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## zoe9 (Oct 3, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help!*

I really think Emily needs to get Zuzu to a vet as soon as possible. That ear sounds very nasty and is likely bothering him and if it's an infection he'll need a course of antibiotics. As for the lump a vet would need to have a proper look at that to determine what it is. Hopefully it's just an abscess or benign cyst which can be treated and nothing dire like the poor case study rat in the link above. But again, I really think he needs to be looked at professionally, especially considering his age.
Good luck - I hope he'll be okay.


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help!*

Zoe - Thanks a bunch.  We're going to try our best to get Zuzu to the vet ASAP.. maybe we can score a deal with Emily's mom. Regardless, I really hope it's benign too, and I appreciate your input and your well-wishes.


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## zoe9 (Oct 3, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help!*

You're welcome. And I saw your edit explaining the vet situation after I posted my reply. I really feel for you and Emily not just being able to take him straight to a vet. I couldn't even imagine trying to deal with some of these rattie problems on my own. 
All my boys are healthy right now but in the past I've been to the vet so often (daily at one point with one very sick rat) that the vet actually stopped charging me 'consultation' fees (I think he felt sorry for me.)
Anyway best of luck and I hope you can arrange that vet visit soon.


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help!*

Thank you, Zoe.  I suppose that's what we get for having rats while living under the roofs of parents who don't appreciate them in the same way we do, eh?
Emily and I both have always had a LOT of luck in our rats' health, so I can't imagine being in and out of the vet that often! I feel for you, and here's hoping you don't have to go through that in the future. At least there's the pitying vet.

As for Zuzu, I've read a bit and I'm still doing my research, but things don't look good. All of the cases similar to his that I've found on ratguide indicate that this kind of thing is often recurring and usually fatal (it ended in death in all three or four of the studies I read about). I'll keep looking, and I won't give up on him, but I did have the burden of telling Emily that it may not get better and she should start preparing to lose him. *sigh* She's devastated, but I suppose these wounds heal.. at least she was able to make him happy while she had him, and he her. And at least we're out of school, so the potential loss of Zuzu isn't likely to interfere with her academic performance. 
My hopes, in terms of the vet, is that we can strike a deal with Emily's mother to take the money out of Emily's allowance and then I can contribute as much as I have. I'm not sure how likely it is, but anything is worth trying.

My thoughts on it right now is that, from what I know, it's most likely a case of squamous cell carcinoma - a type of cancer. I'm going to try to see if we can get him draining and surgery, although I get the sick feeling that it'll end with him having to be euthanized. My hopes are that, right now, it doesn't progress too quickly before we can get him to a vet, and that it doesn't interfere with his quality of life. I have no doubts that we will have to part with him soon, as much as I hope otherwise, so I'm going to try to help Emily make him as comfortable as possible.

However, it's not the end yet, and we'll keep fighting - and I'm sure Zuzu will too! Wish us luck, and if anybody finds anything that they think could help or has any suggestions on what we can do before we're able to get him to the vet, or if you have any consolations, we'd really appreciate it! Thank you!


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help!*

im putting the pictures up now....i wish this wasnt happening, im telling myself its not real......and it will just go away...



















here they are...i hope it is just an ear infection, but im only fooling myself....


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Another update - sorry for the constant posting.  I'm nervous.

Chances of Zuzu getting veterinary attention aren't good. Emily's mom says that "it wouldn't matter if we did take him because he'll die soon anyway," being that he's old, and her mom's boyfriend Gary said the same with his apologies (that being said, he likes Zuzu quite a bit). No adults are on her side for it, and without their help there's nothing we can do. If we can't get him to the vet we may have to put him down, somehow. I can contribute money to a vet appointment, but not enough to pay for it in full, and if Emily saved up her allowance it may take too long before it's too late.

She just told me she's noticed a loss of balance and coordination, and the ability to grip things. She noted some changed in gait and thinks he may be having problems with using his legs. This makes me think it may have root in his brain.

I know it's frowned upon, but does anybody have any suggestions for humane euthanasia at home in the event that we're unable to convince her mother to take him to the vet to have him pts? Any suggestions for medications we could try? Any help is appreciated. We want what's best for Zuzu, and I know home euthanasia and self-medication are bad, but we don't want him to suffer, let alone live his final moments in pain.  Thank you.


EDIT// Good news: Gary said he'd try talking to Emily's mom about taking Zuzu to the vet. Nothing guaranteed, but that makes a lot more hope for our pal.


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Golly, guys, I'm REALLY sorry for he frequent updates.  Here's some more news.

Emily's mom was surprisingly understanding and comforting towards Emily and her position (she's usually a very hard-faced, "get over it, it's just a rat" kind of person, so this was good), but she said that taking him to the vet was out of the option due to the fact it would require money she doesn't have. She gave Emily a hug and ice cream and apologized that there wasn't more she could do.

We'll be keeping an eye on Zuzu and we'll be taking notes on his condition. However, since veterinary attention isn't probable, and since we can't get the growth removed or drained, we will be looking into possibilities for at-home medication. We're seriously facing euthanization, and weighing our options for home euthanasia and whether or not we'll be able to take him to a vet to be pts. Suggestions on both of these will still be appreciated.

Emily told me Zuzu randomly squeaks now. It's my fear that his condition may be quickly going for the worst.


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## Brizzle (Mar 26, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

This is not to sound mean, but..
If Emily had a weird growth on her neck would her mom not take her to the doctor because it's money she doesn't have? I bet Emily would be in the doctors office in a heartbeat. If you don't have the money for vet visits, I don't believe you should own pets. It's cruel to let them sit there if they are in pain.
As for home euthanasia, I wouldn't do it. Going to the vet to have him pts is the best choice. And I'm not sure there is any medication you can give him, but someone else can probably tell you more than I can.


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## zoe9 (Oct 3, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Oh this is so awful and sad, especially after seeing the photos of the lovely old boy.
He is such an old boy so my wish would be he passes peacefully and quickly. The alternate is too horrible to think about because the last thing anyone wants to see is their beloved rat suffering at the end of their life.
I don't know about at home euthansia. I'm sure there are ways it can be done though (car exhaust fumes spring to mind but that's about it.)
I'm sure you are doing research yourself so have probably found this site but I'm including the link below just in case . I haven't looked at it properly though, the idea upsets me too much.
I hope you won't have to do it and somehow you'll find a way to take him to a vet.
All the best to you and Emily and Zuzu.

http://www.alysion.org/euthanasia/


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Brizzle: I agree, and Emily made it known to her mother that the need of a vet was likely to pop up when her mother said it was okay to keep all seven boys, but there's not a lot we can do for her mom's lack of ethics. I won't go into her mother's history with this kind of thing, but I will say that it WAS Emily's intent to rehome the boys in the first place, and while she does have responsibility for them almost entirely, I can't blame her for the inability to see the vet. Not saying that you do, either, but I figured it would be good to mention. I see your points and agree with them, by all means.. I do wish we could convince her mother to take him to the vet, but there's not a lot we can do if she won't. We might still try, but there's no guarantee it will work.

My concern about taking him to the vet to be put to sleep is I've read a LOT about vets using improper methods to put them to sleep. :? We'll do some asking around tomorrow to see what our options are. Obviously, taking him to a vet is preferable still, but we worry that all of those horror stories you hear about rats being put down without the use of proper methods will happen to our poor Zuzu. Thanks for the advice, none the less.

Zoe: Thanks for the consolations, and we really appreciate your support through all of this. The link does help, and we'll keep it open as an option. Thank you, very much, and I'll be sure to have Emily give Zuzu a kiss and a scritch so he knows you're wishing the best for him, too.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Zoe: Yes, thank you so much for all you are doing for Zuzu and me to help. I greatly appreciate it. Ill be sure to give Zuzu a scritch and a kiss for it from you. Thank you again.


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## ration1802 (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

I just want to add that I don't think that home euthanisia shouldn't be looked upon as an option. It should be done by a veterinary professional, if you don't have enough money for treatment, at least find enough money to make sure he's put down with the respect the old boy deserves.

I've heard some horror stories about home euths, some going wrong. They will make your toes curl .. literally. There is too much risk involved and ask yourself .. how would you feel if it did go wrong? He didn't die and suffered futher?

I know it's only at the option stage, and I'm sure you are both desperate to do something for him. But if you can't get him treatment .. find out how much euths cost in the area, hound the goodness out of your parents and at least you'll be prepared when it does come time, or becomes to much for him.

If you're worried about the actual vets methods, call and ask them. Many will gas first and give the injection once they are asleep, if you ask them to. Eg, my vet won't do it as standard (no idea why!) but he will happily do so if I ask.

Good luck guys with whatever you choose, it can't be easy =/


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

thanks for the advice Ration, im going to put more pictures of him up so you can see how lovey he is


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*










I got this cute picture of him when he was taking a lab block from me.

edit// If you want to see more pictures of him go here:
http://otterfoxfursona.livejournal.com/18959.html?mode=reply


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## ration1802 (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

He's gorgeous.

I'll keep my fingers crossed for him, whatever happens


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Ration: As Emily said, thank you for the advice, and I appreciate your input. You're right, things are only at the option stage right now. We were planning on calling some vets and asking how they do the procedures as well. I'm reconsidering home euthanasia quite a bit.
It is hard, but a choice we have to make whether or not we want to, so we'll be trying to keep even heads about it. Thanks a bunch for your well-wishes, and I'm sure Zuzu appreciates them too.

I'm doing updates on Zuzu, since Emily doesn't have regular access to the internet. This morning she told me that the lump was swollen a little more, and he can no longer move his ear. It's my guess that the gait troubles he has are only ocassional. She did notice some odd behavior on the side, like him laying down to eat (as you can see in some of the pictures she posted) and things. She said he stress/pain-bruxes a lot (although he does eye boggle when she gives him a cuddle).
Here's hoping the best for our boy.


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## A1APassion (Jul 29, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

I clicked the link to the Live Journal & I see that a few days ago it was discovered there had been a rat fight between a few of the rats. 


it is quite possible that this swelling is the result of that fight & all he needs is some antibiotics (as do the rest who were cut up)


btw... how are the other two rats (Pin & Hamlet) that have noticeable wounds that appear to be infected?


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*



A1APassion said:


> I clicked the link to the Live Journal & I see that a few days ago it was discovered there had been a rat fight between a few of the rats.
> 
> 
> it is quite possible that this swelling is the result of that fight & all he needs is some antibiotics (as do the rest who were cut up)
> ...


We're hoping it's just an infection of the sort, so that's a possibility. Thanks a bunch for the suggestion.
Having him pts isn't our first option, believe it or not from all our negative talk, we're just trying to figure out what our options are and what will be best for him  We figure it's best to have the information ahead of time, and if we don't end up needing it, it's always there for future reference. In any case, antibiotics sure are worth a try!

From what Emily told me, they're all healed up now. However, she'd have to clarify that, since I haven't been to her house to see them myself. I'll have her check back to you on that, and maybe she can take some pictures if she feels inclined to.


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## Brizzle (Mar 26, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

Nicotine and Otterfox, I WILL NOT tolerate harassment from the two of you. DO NOT email me again with a rude message, or I will find some way to report it to the mods. It is not acceptable behavior and I do not appreciate it. This is an open forum where people place their own opinions. If you can't accept that, then why are you posting here? I only care about the well being of your rat.

This message from otterfox was unacceptable.
"Now you listen here Emilys mom has 6 kids and doesnt have time to take her rat to take her rat to the vet. Your child and a pet are two different things but you obviously dont understand that and you shouldnt be criticizing other people on how they raise their pets and if you have anything else to say bad about my mother or my family having pets i will give you my number so you can personally talk to me. the only kind of people that talk about other people like that are immature losers who doesnt know anything about anything."

That's all I have to say about this. Do not message me again.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*



A1APassion said:


> I clicked the link to the Live Journal & I see that a few days ago it was discovered there had been a rat fight between a few of the rats.
> 
> 
> it is quite possible that this swelling is the result of that fight & all he needs is some antibiotics (as do the rest who were cut up)
> ...


They are fine, thanks for asking.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*



Brizzle said:


> Nicotine and Otterfox, I WILL NOT tolerate harassment from the two of you. DO NOT email me again with a rude message, or I will find some way to report it to the mods. It is not acceptable behavior and I do not appreciate it. This is an open forum where people place their own opinions. If you can't accept that, then why are you posting here? I only care about the well being of your rat.
> 
> This message from otterfox was unacceptable.
> "Now you listen here Emilys mom has 6 kids and doesnt have time to take her rat to take her rat to the vet. Your child and a pet are two different things but you obviously dont understand that and you shouldnt be criticizing other people on how they raise their pets and if you have anything else to say bad about my mother or my family having pets i will give you my number so you can personally talk to me. the only kind of people that talk about other people like that are immature losers who doesnt know anything about anything."
> ...


I didnt write this. My sister Amanda did.
One: I do not refer to myself in third person
And Two: I was just yelled at because she sent it. 

I left the window open when she asked to see the computer. My sister also thinks that if this is an open forum and natural opinions should be expressed, then this letter is apparently not harassment.


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

What? I didn't know anything about that, so I don't see why you're penalizing me for it. I'm afraid I have absolutely NO control over Emily's actions, and had I known she'd been planning to send that I would have tried to convince her not to. Still, though, she's her own person and I have nothing to do with the actions she takes.

I apologize for her lack of better judgment, but I don't think it's fair to accuse me of something I had nothing to do with, nor is it fair to turn it into a public display. :/ It would have been much more orthodox to message her back with your thoughts, or, if you think I'm to blame for it as well, you could have messaged me privately and I would have told you the same thing I'm telling you now under closed doors. I appreciated your input, I thanked you for it and agreed, and I ended it there. 
I'm only here for Zuzu's well-being, and to get advice and suggestions on how to deal with what's wrong with him in order to ensure what's best for him is the option we take. I apologize on Emily's behalf, and you're right, it's not acceptable to message people like that - but I also don't think it's acceptable to post things like this on the forums either. I personally am not here to harass anybody and I think I deserve an apology for the accusation.

As for Emily, I'll try talking to her. Please do understand that she's not the only one who uses the computer, however, and please do also understand that I'm very much a separate person from her.


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## ration1802 (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

I've noted the issue and it will be looked into. 

Let's not get into petty arguments of who said what and why, because it will snowball into a completely needless argument. 

On topic: Keep us updated about Zuzu


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

i didnt do anything wrong...STOP criticizing Me for something my sister did! I should have logged out but i didnt think she would do that. Okay? Yes, nick is a separate person from me, but so is my sister. We are exact opposites. So I AM using my better judgment in this, dont say i am not.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*



Ration1802 said:


> I've noted the issue and it will be looked into.
> 
> Let's not get into petty arguments of who said what and why, because it will snowball into a completely needless argument.
> 
> On topic: Keep us updated about Zuzu


He is doing fine, well, as fine as he could be in this stage. He is sleeping a lot more, and his body has gotten wobbly.. He has been bruxing madly more now and he shakes his head more often. But nothing else. I am taking him with me to Nicks house later.


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## ration1802 (Sep 25, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

How is his eating/drinking? It may be worthwhile getting some Ensure to keep his energy levels up if he's not eating or drinking much

Bruxing can also be a sign of pain, so keep your eye on that.


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## A1APassion (Jul 29, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*



A1APassion said:


> I clicked the link to the Live Journal & I see that a few days ago it was discovered there had been a rat fight between a few of the rats.
> 
> 
> it is quite possible that this swelling is the result of that fight & all he needs is some antibiotics (as do the rest who were cut up)
> ...





Nicotine said:


> We're hoping it's just an infection of the sort, so that's a possibility. Thanks a bunch for the suggestion.


Just thought I would bring this up since I didn't see this mentioned anywhere on this forum. It offers a whole new perspective on things.



Nicotine said:


> Having him pts isn't our first option, believe it or not from all our negative talk, we're just trying to figure out what our options are and what will be best for him  We figure it's best to have the information ahead of time, and if we don't end up needing it, it's always there for future reference. In any case, antibiotics sure are worth a try!


Umm, I'm not going to get into any discussion about one's personal choices, ethics or morals. I don't discuss mine so I surely don't ask anyone else to discuss there's. I saw this because I truly believe not a one of us can decide for another such personal choices... not one person in the world has walked a mile (much less a step) in my shoes. I trust that you have the support of your family & friends to lean on in making these ultimate choices & I trust that with that support the best choice will be made.



Nicotine said:


> From what Emily told me, they're all healed up now. However, she'd have to clarify that, since I haven't been to her house to see them myself. I'll have her check back to you on that, and maybe she can take some pictures if she feels inclined to.


Good. I don't think there are many suggestions of care I could offer this many days since the fight. Open wounds can be easily treated, easily cared for & quickly healed up... but you have to act as quick as possible after the injury to ensure this. If you would like to talk off the public forum about any specific details I would gladly accept a private PM. It appears that there is so much happening within this thread & some of the reactions that are being evoked by it... that it has gotten far too sensitive a story to continue openly. 

I don't know what I can do but It's just an offer... to help you & to also spare some readers of any further alarming details. Maybe it's time to skip a chapter & update after this story closes.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*



Ration1802 said:


> How is his eating/drinking? It may be worthwhile getting some Ensure to keep his energy levels up if he's not eating or drinking much
> 
> Bruxing can also be a sign of pain, so keep your eye on that.


His eating has actually picked up which i dont know if it is good or bad. His drinking is also fine. You do have a point. Ill look into the Ensure. Thanks for the info.

He bruxes constantly, so im going to guess it is from pain


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

for A1Apassion, you do have a point with the rat fight a few days ago, but he had no injuries to speak of. Only Pin and Hamlet had been injured. I had checked everyone else. He might have had an injury that i missed...but i would have noticed, especially since it was so close to his face....


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## A1APassion (Jul 29, 2007)

*Re: Tumor? Abscess? Cyst? Please help! EDIT: Pictures*

The thing with swelling & infection is that it localizes in specific places of the body & that depends on where the location of the injury is.. the bite may not be right where the swelling is localized... it may be further up the head or slightly away from the wound with the blood flow moving that direction to where the swelling is located.

I'll explain just a little of a scenario that is quite possible based on just the little info provided. 

In your LJ post you mention you had been away for a short time so the cage was a little dirty ( I don't recall how long you were away. There had been a fight & you noticed the wounds on the other two rats, one you mentioned was quite alarming & since you didn't find wounds on the other you figured him to be the one who was being a bully. Since those wounds were so obvious you may have over-looked the other rats injury (sorry, I can't keep the names straight without re-reading everything). It may have even been just a scratch & hardly noticeable. A dirty scratch can be serious. If the fight happened while you were away for a couple days & it happened shortly after you left then enough time had passed that any cleaning you did do as far as bathing them may would not have done much to ward off an infection. Not your fault, ok?

Now this is just an educated guess on my part. If I am correct then you can learn from it. I am really hopeful that this is something your boy is strong enough to recover from. I just wish it were possible to get him some antibiotics.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

*Re: Squamous cell carcinoma? PICTURES AND UPDATES*

Zuzu's health has decreased

The bump has grown in size and he has lost a huge amount of weight even though he is eating well. I have a feeling i will lose him soon...

I'll post pictures when i can...

Keep him in your thoughts for us..


EDIT// Nicotine here. Zuzu also has a pungent smell coming from his ear now, and I think there's more discharge than there was before. Emily would have to confirm that. The discharge has also changed in color, and now it's green-yellow instead of yellow-white.
I think we might try calling some vets today, if we can pry Emily's sister off the phone. We're going to see where we can get him put to sleep at. We'd like to try antibiotics first, but I can't imagine her mom to be willing to pay for those even if I chipped in. We'll see, I guess. We're trying to be quick about it due to his rapidly decreasing health. :/


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

Nicotine here! Good news: There's a glimmer of hope left yet for a visit to the vet's! Emily and I went vet-shopping today and we found three possibilities who we think we could find the money for. The one that's most knowledgeable about rats may up the price from their original quote on us, so that's where's it's a little double-sided, but there's still hope.
However, it still comes down to what Emily's mom says. We're thinking that we could maybe get Gary to help us out. Since I can pitch in $30, that might work for us too.

Our buddy's gained a bit of weight since earlier! The swelling is a little worse, though. He's sitting on Emily's lap and he was eye-boggling a little bit ago, and he's cleaning himself now, so it's not getting in the way of his ability to function.. but you can tell it hurts and bothers him. He fusses with it a lot. So we're going to try to figure something out quickly.

Wish us luck!


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## kaylaface (Sep 6, 2007)

Is there any rat rescues in your area? If you can't manage to get him into the vet asap then I suggest surrendering him. Even if they can't save him, they can have him put down humanely. Even a local animal shelter should be able to arrange something like that. Just a suggestion if the vet thing doesn't pan out soon.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

Kayla - Nicotine here again; No rat rescues around here. However, that's something we can look into.. I think we might have a dog shelter nearby. The suggestion is REALLY appreciated right now.
Thank you!


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## kaylaface (Sep 6, 2007)

otterfox said:


> Kayla - Nicotine here again; No rat rescues around here. However, that's something we can look into.. I think we might have a dog shelter nearby. The suggestion is REALLY appreciated right now.
> Thank you!


You're welcome. Keep us updated on what going on.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Tomorrow I promise! I lost a girl very unexpectedly tonight so my mind is scattered and sad


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

lilspaz68 said:


> Tomorrow I promise! I lost a girl very unexpectedly tonight so my mind is scattered and sad


Oh my.. I'm (we're) so sorry  you're under no obligation.. just get to it if you can. Sorry to hear about your loss.  I hope you feel better soon.

As for Zuzu, still downhill. Yellow-green discharge from his ear has increased, and the lump has formed a lesion/scab typical of an abscess. nWe keep looking back to this: http://propellertail.com/case_study_1.html and it all looks very similar.

Emily's mom is back to her hard-faced self, saying an absolute "no" for vet care because "she can't afford it" - even though I'd be pitching in $30 and that'd be paying over half. :/ Gary can't persuade her.
I'm afraid there's little we can do to for him pertaining to vets if her mom won't agree.


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

Zuzu's abcess popped... and i freaked out because i wasnt home at the time.
But then i got home and i saw him.

The swelling has decreased signifigantly, there is no more pungent odor OR stuff coming from his ear, he can actually move his ear now, there is a slight scab on his cheek under his ear, but other than that, everything is fine! 

He is eating well, and he was a lot more active than when he had the huge lump there . He was bruxing and eye-boggling up a storm when i got him out. He is much happier now that i am here with him. He looks a lot happier too. He has gained a lot of weight too. He is now his pudgy happy self. 

I am going to stay home and keep an eye on his progress so if anything new develops i'll be here to update

Here are some pictures.  








Here, you can see the scab.








This one shows how much the swelling has gone down.

Man im happy


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## ration1802 (Sep 25, 2007)

That's a good start .. now you need to keep care of that to make sure it heals properly. There's a sticky about abscess management that is very good to have a read of and follow.

Keep that scab open, keep the wound flushed. To give him the best possible change you want this to heal from the inside outwards.

You already know that it's effected his actual ear passages .. but my fingers will keep crossed for you!


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## otterfox (Jun 9, 2008)

Ration: Thanks for the advice, I'll keep it as clean as possible!

Edit// I opened his wound up and saw a bunch of white, cream cheese looking blobs in his cheek. I flushed them out with water, then there was just a hole. I couldnt get anything else out. 

I put Neosporin on it after i sprayed it with Bactine.

Are the white things normal?

Edit2// I have him out on my lap right now and every time i touch him he squeaks like he is in pain and he is bruxing terribly...im starting to get worried again..


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Using Neosporin is actually a No-no in this case. An abscess needs to heal from the inside out...you need to get that gunk out of there (scrape it out gently if necesary), flush with saline solution too. You have to flush it out (soften any scabs that form so you can do it too) 2-3 times a day. If the top of the abscess heals (neosporin encourages this) and there's any infection/matter underneath it will just recur again and again.

I am praying its just a regular abscess from his pics! 

This is squamous cell...

















It was very hard and infected on top.


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## Nicotine (Jan 2, 2008)

Good news! Zuzu's doing well! His abscess is healing great and Emily's keeping it clean, and there's no more swelling, either. He doesn't have any more **** coming from his ear (if I remember right; Em might have to confirm that) and the smell's gone, too.

However, Emily did get two swabs of blood from his ear when she cleaned it today. We were pretty worried about that. However, we think the abscess is connected to his ear canal, and maybe the abscess bled when she cleaned it out? How worried should we be?

From the looks of it it may not be squamous cell carcinoma like we originally thought. We're hoping really hard that it's just an abscess and that he won't have recurring problems with it after it's healed up. Wish us luck! Thabks for all the help so far!


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