# HELP Fast Growing Lump



## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

One of our two male rats has a fast growing lump on the side of his body. He's 1 1/2 years old.
We took him to the vet a few weeks ago and he said that it would take a few hundred dollars to remove.
He also said that an operation might not work well, since our rat is overweight.
(Our two male rats are on the same diet. One is looking completely normal, but this rat is pretty overweight.)
I'm worried about how fast the lump is growing.
Any suggestions?
This link talks about draining lumps yourself, but I don't know if I should be doing that.


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## AMJ087 (Aug 27, 2008)

If its an abcess you can treat it at home. If its a tumor you can not and it needs to be removed surgically. Try to PM stace87 or lilspaz68, they are pretty good with knowing tumor and abcess differences.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

I found this online:


> An abscess usually is squishy and movable while a tumor is fixed in one place and hard. An abscess may have a scab in the center and if you pick it, it will end up being necrotic tissue and pus will come out after you pick it off.


It's definitely a tumor. It's hard and in one place.


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## steffiez (Nov 24, 2009)

If you're positive that it's a tumor, then you have to get it removed. 
Don't just go to any vet, take your rat to a vet that has a lot of experience with rats, or else the vet may not know exactly what he's doing. Good luck :-\


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## Stace87 (Jun 24, 2008)

Do you have a photo of the lump? How quickly is it growing? How quickly in size has it developed? If it does turn out to be a tumour and he is otherwise in good health, I would have it removed if it's operable as he's still of a young age.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

It's definitely growing. The vet doesn't think it's a good idea to operate though.
So right now I'm just concentrating on keeping him as happy as possible.
I also mix flax in his food, since I read that it might make the tumor grow last fast. It's worth a try.
If we finally need to say goodbye to him, then I'm most worried about his brother. They are so attached to each other.
They usually sleep like this:







.
The one with the tumor is Ratatouille (bottom). The other one is Desperaux.

If anyone has any other suggestions, I would love to hear them.


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## Stace87 (Jun 24, 2008)

Why does the vet not think its a good idea to operate?


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

Stace87 said:


> Why does the vet not think its a good idea to operate?


He's a bit overweight and has some breathing problems.
The vet things that he probably won't survive an operation where he has to go under.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

The cyst is about 2 1/2 inches now. He still seems reasonably ok.
He moves around a lot slower, so I put everything he needs on one floor of the cage.
Does anyone have any advice as to when is the right moment to say goodbye?
These are our first rats, so I'm still very unexperienced with all of this.
When it's time, do I just bring his favorite treat? Is there anything else I can do to make it easier?
It's probably not good to bring his brother is it? I thought maybe he will then understand what happened, instead of him just have gone missing.
Is it a good idea to have my kids be present? They are 8 and 11 and very sensitive (especially my youngest).
I don't want them to go through something too shocking.
And how can we help his brother? Should we get him new buddies as soon as possible? Or maybe even before it's time?
I would love some tips from more experienced people here on the forum.


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## Stace87 (Jun 24, 2008)

As its growing quickly (assuming it will eventually take his life) and he's only 18 months old, I think I would be inclined to try removal despite the weight and breathing problems. Has he been treated for the breathing problems? If so, what has been tried? What is the problem he has? How heavy is he? Do you have a photo of him?


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

This is Ratatouille:
You can see the lump on his side.








He weighs 2 pounds and 4 ounces. He has mycoplasmosis and has had antibiotics for it before.
He's doing okay enough now, but the vet thinks his breathing will still cause problems during the operation.
The operation costs a few hundred dollars and the vet doesn't think he will make it through.


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## olddeadpig (Jan 6, 2010)

If you can, get a second opinion. My doe Flash, who weighed over 800 grams and was seriously overweight, survived 3 operations in the past four weeks no problems. Unfortunately she then developed a fast growing squamous cell carcinoma - unrelated to the operations - and had to be pts earlier this week, but our exotic vet didn't blink at her weight when considering anesthesia. If your vet uses inhaled gas anesthetic - isoflurane or sevroflurane are the recommended ones for rats - and there is a trained anesthetist there and someone monitors the rat's breathing and temperature (easy to do if the vet practice is used to rats) - then weight shouldn't be an issue. It makes for quite an expensive operation but it was worth it for Flash, as she was up and running about in her lovely wobbly way within an hour each time.

Before I found our wonderful exotic vet, we took Flash to our local "cats and dogs" vet. She didn't have a clue, but much worse than her ignorance was her offering advice and saying she would operate on Flash, but stop in the middle and euthanase her if she found so much as an abscess (the first operation was to remove a badly injured eye, I thought she would simply kill Flash if I let her do it, the exotic vet I went to instead did indeed find an abscess when removing the eye but drained it without drama and the surgery was a complete success). Some vets simply don't know anything about rats and don't bother to read the journals about exotics, even pocket pets which are common throughout the western world - but they still offer to give their incompetent brand of "help", because they are trying to make a living like the rest of us. You pay, the rat suffers and dies, the vet keeps the money - no refunds in this game!

If I'm doing your vet a disservice and he or she is an exotic specialist and knows about rats, then perhaps your poor boy simply has a tumour which is too invasive to debulk or otherwise operate on. Some types of tumour can be very aggressive and invade the local tissues so much that to try to remove the malignant bit would probably hit a main vein or artery and result in the rat's death anyway. In that case all you can do is make him as comfortable as possible until you make the call that it's time to end it. Metacam seems to be the painkiller of choice so try and get a supply of that - it would be unfair to leave your buck in more pain than necessary. It smells of honey and my rats have taken it happily straight from a syringe (no needle of course, and let the boy hold it himself rather than sticking the nozzle right into his mouth, as there is a risk that you could send the liquid down his windpipe and choke him otherwise). Food can be softened by soaking in infant formula milk or puppy milk, and this will get extra calories into him if he is losing weight, as will applesauce. Give him lots of love (I know you would do this anyway!!) and cuddles, but bear in mind that ratties don't show pain until they are practically dead - they will go to great lengths to avoid looking vulnerable, as in the wild this would lead their many predators to attack, so a rat showing great distress is really at the end of its tether and you don't want to get to that stage. At some point you have to make the call as to when his quality of life is no longer acceptable, and take him to the vet to say goodbye. And then have a good cry, as I have this week over Flash. If we love our rats, it hurts when they go, but once we're over the mourning we still have the good memories. 

I really hope I'm being too pessimistic and that something comes up for your lovely boy - he's a cute chappie! All the best.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

I really, really appreciate all the advice both of you have given me.
I'm going to discuss it with my husband and see what we should do.
I would love it if we could keep Ratatouille with us a lot longer.
He's a total sweety (even though he loves to nibble us now and then)!


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## [x]RaeLovesRats[x] (Feb 7, 2008)

How is his breathing just now? Wheezy? Noisy? Laboured? Fast?
If none of these things, he doesn't have breathing problems. All rats carry myco.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

I just went to another vet to get a second opinion. He's a specialist in exotic pets.
He said that it's a tumor and not a cyst. It will cost about $300-$500 to remove.
He doesn't think there would be a problem removing it.
However, if it's malignant, removing won't really help much. And he's almost 2 already.
It's a lot of money for what will most likely be a bad outcome anyway.
This vet also said that about 87% of all rats develop tumors. I didn't know it's that common.


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## Stace87 (Jun 24, 2008)

Definitely sounds like a better vet. Are you going to have it removed?


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## AvaAdoreSmashing (Dec 31, 2009)

Have you tried checking out other pets near you? There might be a rescue place that might be able to offer you a lower price. Now that you know for sure what you're dealing with, its still okay to try other vets for a cheaper price. Ultimately it's you choice to do what you feel is right. I would absolutely suggest getting his brother two new pals. That way if his brother ends up with health issues later on then you wont be stuck with the Lone Rat Situation again.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

I called some other vets in our area (Milwaukee, WI), and it doesn't look like I can find anything cheaper than $300-$500.
Most vets don't even want to give any quotes without seeing the animal first. Which means of course paying $50 every time just to get a quote.
It's a shame this is happening right when my husband is in between jobs.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

If it was a clear case of saving Ratatouilles life, we would spend the money!
We're just trying to consider mostly whether a surgery is really the best thing to do for him.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

Ratatouille will be operated on tomorrow.
Wish us luck!


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## Stace87 (Jun 24, 2008)

Good luck!

I don't know if you've had any rats that have gone through surgery before... but I found this article useful for post-op care.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

Thank you so much! These are our first rats, so I didn't know anything about this yet.
I also want to take the article to the vet, since he was talking about using a color to protect the stitches.
According to the article that's not the best thing to do.
I hope this vet is good enough. It's this guy.
He's the exotic animal specialist.


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## Wanda (Dec 3, 2008)

He got through the operation okay and is resting now.
I'm picking him up in two hours.
I read the article from the link and am preparing an aquarium for him.
Should I put the whole aquarium in their cage, so the brothers can see each other?
We have the critter nation, so enough space.
Or will it just frustrate them not to be able to go to each other.

Thanks so much for all your advice and helping me through this.
It was really scary when the first vet told us that Ratatouille would probably die during an operation.
I now hope that we can enjoy him a lot longer.
I can't believe how attached I've become to both of them.


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## Stace87 (Jun 24, 2008)

I wouldn't put the aquarium in their cage. I imagine it probably would frustrate him. You could perhaps let one of the quieter boys visit him though?


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