# Taking rats in stores?



## Mitsy (Apr 8, 2013)

So I have been training to of my rats as shoulder rats with rat daddy's help and decided to focus on misty my black hooded an work on Abby finding her comfort level. 

Anyways how would I go about taking them into stores I know pet stores would be fine but what about other stores should I call ahead or ask when I'm there.


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## Grawrisher (Sep 10, 2013)

I'd call ahead if I were you


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

I am not sure too many other stores would allow it. Maybe mom/pop shops, homegrown stores, or things like coffee shops. I just can't see WalMart or something being cool with that.


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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

I don't ever call ahead, i just put Lilly on my shoulder and go. I've been to Meijer, ACO Hardware, Wal-Mart, several gas stations and many other places. I've never been asked to leave either. The key is to not bring attention to your rat, yes people will stare if they see her, but just ignore them and keep bee bopin' along. And carry something to keep accidental poopies in.


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

If you are going with the "and hope no one notices" approach, which is probably the only one that would work as calling ahead would earn you a NO likely.

I would treat it as if you were skipping class or sneaking into movies (what I hope is a universal experience). Act like you have permission, act confident in what you are doing as if the manager her/him-self pet your rat. If you get caught, I've always gotten away with creating a diversion with confusion. "What? But I called and explained the situation and got permission! It's my service animal!". Unless you've found a manager, the employee likely doesn't care enough beyond that.


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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

nanashi7 said:


> "What? But I called and explained the situation and got permission! It's my service animal!".


Ehhehhehheh, totally doing this if I'm ever told to leave. Nanashi you are a genius.


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## Crezzard (Jul 20, 2013)

I just walk in to anywhere with my rats. My old rat used to pop out of my jacket whenever I got to the checkout at tesco 


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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

I'm actually taking Lilly out to the store now. The Meijer here is (a lot like a big wal-mart) open 24 hrs and we normally go at 3 am, but this time I don't want to keep her out of my sights (read the thread on health if you're curious as to why) so my hood will be up and she'll be nicely concealed on my shoulder.


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## Daniel (Jun 24, 2013)

Been wanting to do this, but none of my rats I'd yet trust with doing it. They are either too small, or skittish, or aggressive. 

I'd be happy with an outing to Petsmart, where I know they won't mind. I thought about getting one of those harnesses but I guess people here have had mixed experiences with them.


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## Xerneas (Aug 6, 2013)

Even if harnesses aren't a problem for your rat (although most can slip out anyways), or your rat is fine with going out there are lots of dogs people like to bring in Petsmart! That's what would concern me a lot. I mean, if your rat is sitting on your shoulder I guess it's not a biggie but man some dogs are crazy...


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## Minky (Apr 4, 2013)

When I had a shoulder rat, I used to take her everywhere. Never asked permission, I'd just bring her along in my coat pocket. I wouldn't bring her into any place that serves food, however. 

Anyway, inevitably people will ask what kind of animal you have, and when you say "rat" be ready for aversion. I used to tell folks that Dolly was an English Teacup Mouse (something I just made up). And they'd say "How darling!" In reality, she was just a plain old grey hooded, top-eared feeder rat. But if I told people she was a rat they'd be repulsed. If people ask, you can try saying she's a Fancy rat or a Dumbo rat. . . sounds better than just "rat" to the unenlightened.


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## Xerneas (Aug 6, 2013)

I have no experience with shoulder ratting but when people are disgusted with me having rats one thing I've found often works is to say that they know tricks (coming when called is a very successful one) or are litter trained. This helps to charm them a little (in my experience...) and will also tend to break down that stereotype that rats are dirty. Just a thought!


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## JBird (May 23, 2013)

Just going to chime in with something important... *PLEASE do not say your rat is a service animal when it is not*. Please. It is incredibly irresponsible and it hurts the ACTUAL service animal community. Many people do this to get their Chihuahuas and other purse-dogs into stores and restaurants and it is despicable and heavily frowned upon. Please treat the service animal community with respect and do not lie to get your "way" and bring your rat with you to Wal-Mart. 

If you insist on taking your rat to a place where you know it will not be well received (hint: don't do that in the first place) just apologize and say you were not aware of the pet policy and either leave or politely explain that your rat is not going to be leaving your shoulder and he is there to socialize- he is friendly. If they are understanding and are okay with that, they will be, if not, respect that. Really. It is not that hard and you will be much more responsible for doing so. Pet/animal policies exist for a reason and it is completely disrespectful to the business to disregard that because your animal happens to not be a dog/cat/other "typical" pet.


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## Amelia (May 3, 2013)

Must admit -- I would never take my rats out into a public store like this (outside of a pet shop or similar). Of course we absolutely adore our rats but some people are genuinely terrified of them and taking them out in public like that is just asking for trouble. I'm not really terrified of anything so I don't really know what it would be like, but imagine if you were phobic of rats (that is, an IRRATIONAL fear that cannot be helped even though the person may not want to feel that way), and someone strolled right past you with one on their shoulder. It could be very distressing to them. Sadly, although they are amazing animals, rats aren't exactly conventional pets and we have to be respectful of other peoples fears and inhibitions.


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## naley_2006 (Aug 19, 2013)

A lot of PetSmarts have signs that say your pet must be on a leash and have vaccinations. How would that even work for rats?

Also my sister's friend brings his snake with him everywhere. Literally. He bikes everywhere he goes so the snake just curls up his arm and he goes into McDonalds (where he also works) with the snake and no one says a thing if you don't draw attention to it.


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## JBird (May 23, 2013)

I work at a bunch of different pet stores and all of them are very welcoming of any pet coming in on their owner's arm.  Lots of folks come in with their exotic pets, and the leash rule is bent to the animal's needs. 
One woman comes into one of my stores frequently with her kinkajou in a baby pouch! People can come in with their snakes but they (like us) have to be respectful that not everyone likes snakes! I've only had my BP in my store once and had four or five people freak out- and she's a baby at 150g!! I know not to take her to stores on that side of town now because the folks there aren't as interested. Had a guy bring in his 2yr old albino BP to my store on the other side of town one time and I (and several other customers) positively gushed over him. Some places are better suited for strange pets just bc the clientele varies! 
That being said, like others, I don't think it's really appropriate to bring your rat into stores other than pet stores. Or your snake, or your dog, or your cat, or your kinkajou, etc... Ok, maybe the kinkajou, but only to let people say they had seen one! Not everyone likes rats/snakes, but also don't forget that a LOT of people simply don't like _animals. _Us critter lovers aren't the only ones out there, unfortunately.


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## Grawrisher (Sep 10, 2013)

My friend got away with taking the sugar gliders I gave her absolutely everywhere, but they mostly hid in her cleavage inside her shirt, and if anyone did notice shed just be like "they're sugar gliders" (which for some reason everyone in my town either loves them or has never heard of them...not other options)....a rat doesn't really stay in your shirt though and isn't a sugar glider.....tread lightly 


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

First of all, if you are even considering bringing your rat into a place of business you are not taking a common rat. You are bringing a shoulder rat. A shoulder rat is a very special rat, it has a high degree of self confidence and an especially calm personality and more than likely you have spent hundreds of hours with him or her in bonding and training. 

There's just about no way you are going to explain what a shoulder rat is over the phone to anyone. So basically if you call ahead and ask, people will hear you saying "I want to bring a rat into your place of business." Oddly enough in my town you would most likely get a very pleasant yes, we would like to meet it, because every business knows our shoulder rats and most look forward to their visits and the positive attention they can draw to their businesses, especially if they cater to children.

But elsewhere where businesses haven't met Fuzzy Rat or Max or even Amelia on rare occasions, most businesses are going to receive your call as if it is coming from Willard himself.

We never hide our shoulder rats.... ever! A rat that pops out of a pocket can seriously frighten someone and cause a panic. I don't go out of my way to attract attention but our rats are clearly visible. My daughter will sometimes dance around the store with a rat attracting as much attention as she can... she's 7 years old and most people find it cute. However we do follow the 15 foot rule where possible. We try to make sure anyone approaching us sees the rat from as far away as possible. If someone is rat phobic they will have plenty of room to avoid you without panicking. I also don't do leashes. I've always relied on Fuzzy Rat's charisma to open doors and impress people. The number one land two questions I get is "what is that?" (or is that a .....(insert anything but a rat)? and "doesn't she run away?" My reply used to be "Fuzzy Rat is a highly trained fancy rat, she loves meeting people and she NEVER bites, would you like to meet her? and no, she's definitely not a common rat". Fuzzy Rat loved meeting people and giving rattie kissies and after the first, young lady got her kissies and started jumping up and down for joy everybody would line up to get some of their own. Depending on the size of the crowd we attracted the smart phones came out next and people took turn posing right in the store with Fuzzy Rat. The night manager at the local Shell station and Minimart called his wife and mom on his smart phone and sent them streaming video of Max in his store live just two weeks ago. 

Sure most business owners and managers hold their breath when we walk in for the first time. You can actually see the confusion on their faces. But when the first customer shows interest and our rats attract a friendly and inquisitive crowd and the roof doesn't cave in and the world doesn't end and no one runs off screaming they exhale and very often join in the fun. 

I"m going to tell a couple of Fuzzy Rat stories here to make a point, I'll omit the names of the businesses as there may be some corporate policies that got stretched. But at one of the busiest fast food restaurants on the busiest highway in the state we walked in with Fuzzy Rat on shoulder, and I took my place in one of the 6 lines at the counter. The place was packed but no one commented until I reached the counter and the young lady clerk noticed my rat. She asked what it was and I did my little speech and she called back to the kitchen to someone to come check out the rat. Naturally, the entire kitchen staff came up to the counter and the entire place shut down service as the staff asked questions and dared each other to touch the rat. In restaurants I have a rule about servers touching my rats, it never happens over the counter or while the staff is working and not likely to wash their hands. Some customers might feel that the food preparers or servers touching a rat and then their food might be unappealing an I don't want people handling raw food to handle my rat. So I had to tell them that they would have to come around the counter if they wanted to meet Fuzzy Rat. Now within what seemed only a matter of seconds the entire lobby had filled up with diners waiting behind us. Someone from the back asked why the line had stopped moving and the clerk that had called everyone up front shouted back 

"We're sorry, please just give us a minute, but we've never had a rat in here before!!!" 

This is one of those shoulder ratting moments, you will never forget... where the surreal intersects the absurd.

I'm standing pressed against the counter of a fast food restaurant by a mob of people so vast and so deep I can't see how far it goes back, with no possible way to the door and someone shouts that the food service has stopped on account of your rat in the restaurant... 

Sooooo I maintained my best practiced calmest smile and turned around so the crowd could see Fuzzy Rat (and know it wasn't some form of wild rat infestation). And Fuzzy Rat, who adored crowds an attention stretched her front legs and lifted her head like a show dog taking in the mob and then....

nothing happened. I mean.. there was half a second of silence and everybody went back to their conversations or stood quietly and patiently, and the staff made a few more comments and drifted back to their work stations, making a point to say "good bye Fuzzy Rat" and I got my food and went to the children's section with my daughter where she and several other kids took Fuzzy Rat up on the climbing apparatus and all of the parents gathered around me and I explained all about the benefits of rats and told a few Fuzzy Rat stories, and we ate and hung out for at least another half an hour and no one wanted to leave... A few people kept their distance, some asked questions, all of the kids came over to meet Fuzzy Rat, and everybody glanced over from time to time, some smiled, other's commented to each other, but for the most part it was normal, like everyone had dined in a fast food restaurant with a rat before. 

One of the parents that joined the group of us in the kiddie section commented that it must be lots of fun to travel with a shoulder rat and it seemed a great way to meet people and indeed there were at least a dozen parents that had joined out little rat chat circle, most inquiring about getting rats for their own kids and I thought to my self yes it was... Over the two years we traveled with Fuzzy Rat and now Max we've met hundreds if not thousands of people, we get stopped wherever we go. Complete strangers walk right up to us and talk to us and pose with photos with our rats. Fuzzy Rat was a rock star, and we were her entourage. Traveling with a shoulder rat is a trip and a half...

To be fair things don't always go that well... We went to another fast food franchise off I-95 and the manager politely asked us to take "the rat" outside for health code reasons, so I asked my daughter to wait outside with Fuzzy Rat while I ordered our food to go. No problem, I wasn't really offended. Then something rather surprising happened, it was Saturday lunch service and most people had come with their children and as I stood in line one after another the children dragged their parents out the front door to meet the rat and my daughter was actually getting mobbed right outside the front door and by the time I got my order, most of the guests were outside meeting Fuzzy Rat. I couldn't help myself, I went outside and we decided to have lunch right in front of the restaurant. My daughter was surrounded by kids so she was happy, the weather was nice so I didn't feel too put out, but the restaurant was empty. We had vacuumed 95% of the lunch time business out of the franchise. And of the people who were pulling in most came met Fuzzy Rat and left. I didn't say anything about having been asked to leave, but I don't know what my daughter said or if people having spent their lunch time playing with Fuzzy Rat just changed their minds or forgot about lunch the effect was the same. We ate and hung out about 45 minutes, until the lunch rush ended and left. Now I don't know what it costs a large franchise highway exit fast food restaurant to effectively have their dining room closed for a Saturday lunch by a charismatic rodent... but you can bet they never let it happen again! The next time we went to that place, I asked my daughter to wait outside while I went in to get take out. Within seconds, the manager sent her assistant manager to call my daughter inside and she herself disappeared into the back room. The server didn't even ask if it was to go and served us on a tray. We sat and ate leisurely, occasionally chatting with a few inquisitive kids and parents and the assistant manager made a point to smile and wave goodbye when we left. It was actually amazing to see how fast people can come to like fancy rats once they get to know them (and fear what offending them can do to their business.) 

It might sound strange, but other stores have noticed that my rats entertain their customers and will go out of their way to be friendly to us to encourage our patronage. Happy and entertained customers buy more, and come back more often so their kids might see the friendly rat again.

To be absolutely clear, unless your rat is very well trained stay out of stores, never put your rats on any counters shelves or the floor without prior store approval, and never let food handlers touch your rats unless they are off duty and are likely to wash their hands before going back to work. You are a guest in someone else's business, never push your welcome by taking advantage of someone's kindness. People have their limits.

I suppose I might add that I've been checked out by cops twice, but I'd say that was more related to a middle age guy being surrounded by a mob of kids at a playground than having a shoulder rat. Having a 7 year old daughter, I suppose I actually liked the idea that the cops would check out that kind of activity. Shoulder rats attract small kids, and would make great bait for a pedophile. And I'm pretty sure moms everywhere forget to warn their children against getting into a strange car with a nice rat. Of course, one of cops I met actually made the stupidest remark ever when I asked if he would like to meet my rat... He responded "I'm afraid of rats and I'd rather be shot." I seriously had to doubt the wisdom of issuing a gun to anyone that would rather be shot than touch a kids pet. I'm not sure I would trust his judgment in a situation where my life might be on the line.

In any case, shoulder rats are a trip. You never know what to expect, mostly it's great fun, sometimes it's a hassle dealing with inquisitive crowds or even occasional ignorant people. Some stores will welcome you with open arms, some will ignore you and some may ask you to leave. Rural businesses are more rat phobic than more urban ones, if that matters. But honestly, no one is going to call you a witch and burn you on a pyre like they did a few hundred years ago. So the up side usually outweighs the down side about 50 to 1.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Of special note... regarding pet shops. I stopped by a chain pet shop on the way to the vet's. My rat had a bad case of mites, and one of the employees grabbed her and hugged on her... so now the employee had a bad case of mites. I cautioned her to change her shirt and wash her hands, but I don't know if that's what she did before handling the small animals in the store, so perhaps they got a bad case of mites too. You don't have to think too hard to come up with how this could work in reverse and get your rat sick. Be careful in pet shops.


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## Stefni (Aug 10, 2013)

Aaaah I love reading about Fuzzy Rat! This made my day  Can't wait for the day my rats are more calm and comfortable around other people. I'm too scared to take my rats out with me, they know me and love me and come to me for protection when they see my boyfriend, we're trying immersion with him but he doesn't have as much time as I do so it's not really working. My rats are petrified of strangers  

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## xxTheRatChampion (Apr 18, 2013)

*I've taken Rata to a petstore once but I've never taken her to an actual store. Maybe like a gas station or some place like walmart. I'd doubt they'd let a rat into a coffee/food place. Even though rats are cleaner then dogs, they still step in their own poo and pee and its really unhealthy for a rat to walk around in places where they serve food, unless of course if he/she stayed on your shoulder.

But take a purse with and fill it with things you may need incase. Like a hamster water bottle, treats, food and something to carry poop in.*


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## rattie-love-247 (Jul 9, 2013)

The only time ANY of the rats we own have ever been outside of the house was when my oldest daughter took her rat, Dottie in to school last year when her science class was inviting students to bring in any small vertibrate pet, excluding cats & dogs. My daughter's rat mind you is a very sweet, interactive chatty girl & my daughter said that most 1st reactions from the classmates was "aah a RAT!" or Ew or nasty....you know, the usual repulsion most of the kids now-a-days are taught. By the end of the class session, my daughter said EVERY student had touched, held or petted the rat & ALL of them wanted more contact with her. Some of the students learned that their fear/repulsion was misplaced & had a better understanding of how great rats can be as pets & got to experience that first hand & will likely go home trying to re-educate their own families. 
For my 2nd story,
We've also had the chance to re-educate staff at a vet clinic when dealing with one of my girl's mammory tumor situations. 7 days post surgery the girl delivered a small litter of 4 pups, (i had bred her but wasnt sure if she was pregnant or not as she hadnt started to show or gained any significant weight along with the circumstances surrounding the mammory tumor situation & the surgery & all the daily handlings administering medications & the post surgery incision care led me to believe she was not in fact pregnant)...so the litter was a surprise. on day 14 post surgery we were at the vet clinic for a check up on her stitches & i had of course brought the litter. One of the secretaries was coming from the back & immediately said "ew rats." upon hearing there was babies there. I frowned at her & said "no not ew." she tentatively came over & was saying how she wasnt gonna hold one or touch any & mid sentence was cut short as a pup was placed in her hands by another vet assistant, while the vet & yet another assistant were gawking & touching the other babies & mom. This secretary went from "Ew, rats." to "Aww. they're not so ugly." When i recognized mamma getting tired of the intrusions & taking a protective position over the babies, I let everyone know momma was done & needed her babies back. Everyone quickly respected that & the vet went on to look over mom's stitches. one other client in the clinic had a little 4 yr old boy that was fascinated by the babies & got to peek at them but dad said no touching so i respected that & didnt push it.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

When we were on the road, Fuzzy Rat would drink out of the top of a water bottle cap and she was a junk food junky so anything we came across in our travels for ourselves was eagerly accepted. We usually kept some rat blocks in the car, but she rarely ate them when we were on the road. 

And yes, to repeat myself and be very clear, shoulder rats NEVER crawl on counters floors or shelves of any stores, especially food establishments. Whether it is or it isn't a health issue, it's a perception issue. A well trained shoulder rat looks calm and relaxed and very competent. When I raise my arm and say "shoulder rat" and the rat runs up to my shoulder, People's eyes get all wide and they smile. And they feel comfortable and relaxed too. When meeting groups of people new people will often wander up to see what all of the fuss is about and ask other people in the crowd "Is that a rat?" and the other people will usually reply..."No, it's a trained fancy rat." Perception is *everything* in shoulder ratting. 

A good shoulder rat doesn't pee or poop indoors, before you go into the store you put them down outside so they can go to the bathroom on the ground. This is another reason you can't just take a reasonably calm rat into a store. It's a major leap of faith to put your rat down on a sidewalk or parking lot and wait for it to go to the bathroom. You don't always have a sprawling lawn handy to put your rat down on. And you better be darn sure what will happen when your rat hits the ground. Fuzzy Rat surprised us once by not wanting to go into the store and she ran off back to the car where she waited for us under our car to open the door. Then she came right out and we scooped her up, but she took a short cut under several parked cars from the place we put her down to our car. And just to be very clear, when your rat is going cross country under parked cars you aren't going to catch her. A rat can go through under a car way faster than you can run around it. Knowing that Fuzzy Rat was going back to the car meant we didn't need to panic, just stay ahead of her and wait at the car. Amelia will stay on shoulder, but if you put her down she will become unpredictable and can break for cover and she might pee or poop in a store which is not good and can be quite embarrassing. 

Training Fuzzy Rat to potty outdoors was actually quite a challenge. Once she got comfortable with going to the bahtroom anywhere on the ground outdoors, she started doing the same indoors. So we had to do indoor potty training all over again. She finally decided it was fine to go to the bathroom on any black surface like asphalt. My wife has a black leather chair and I have a black phone. Both of which we had to keep Fuzzy Rat off of. Max figured out indoor and outdoor potty training on her own by three weeks of age. Outdoors she will start climbing down and make a point of needing to go to the bathroom when she will go and come right back on hand, indoor she will ask to go back to her cage or use the travel cage. If I'm sleeping when she has to go she will wake me up. I have no clue how she learned it, but am grateful she did. Potty training a shoulder rat means your rat needs to learn two very different sets of bathroom rules. Even dogs can get away with one set of rules as in it always goes to the bathroom outdoors. 

A true shoulder rat is a very special animal. And it comes across as such to anyone that meets it. Most people are impressed whether they like rats or not. None of the businesses or stores we go to would ever let a rat in, but a trained shoulder rat is a very different thing.

We took Max to the town charity fair Saturday before last and a very apprehensive young lady asked what kind of an animal Max was... this photo was taken a few minutes later... (keep in mind it was outdoors, in a crowd of hundreds of people, with generators and rides going all around and with a rock and roll band playing nearby)









I'm not in the photo because I was taking the picture, and none of the girls in the photo had ever met a real live trained fancy rat before. And it was only Max's second outing after safe site training.

Max is only 7 weeks old in the photo and doesn't have half of Fuzzy Rat's charisma and she can be shy around new people, but she seems to like girls more than boys and she has her rock star moments already. She was really squirmy and apprehensive when she saw the huge crowd and the moving lit up rides and first experienced the loud noises of the generators and the rock bands... but she held it together, (just barely) with lots of reassurance and an experienced handler, but she really loosened up after a few hours among the crowd, as you can tell by the photo, where she's going hand to hand passing out rattie kisses to people we just met. By the time the fair ended people were actually looking for us and asking to meet the rat and bringing their friends along. Max was quite an attraction. And I only went later on in the evening to catch the fireworks so as to avoid getting mobbed by too many small children.

We're still working on Max's in store etiquette, But in any event, scenes like this one are what you can normally expect when you take out a true shoulder rat.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I usually get past the "Ewww, It's a rat" thing with "No, she's not a rat, she's a trained fancy rat, there's a very big difference". Some people will actually go on and on about how awful and filthy rats are while holding and petting our girls. I've actually had one woman refuse to believe I had a rat until I showed her the tail and another man who flatly told me I was wrong and Fuzzy Rat wasn't a rat at all, and he knew all about rats. I've learned better than to argue with people that like my rats for whatever reason.

And my all time favorite are moms that will let their kids mob us and handle our rats while keeping a 30 foot distance themselves. You have to wonder, if they are so afraid of rats, how they handle their kids looking over ledges and cliffs, I suppose they stay away from the precipices too while they let their kids play on the edge?

Humans are much stranger than rats.


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## Stefni (Aug 10, 2013)

You know, I have to say that the worst is trying to explain to your own family that they aren't vile creatures or try to explain to them how smart they are, it really frustrates me. 
They all think I'm crazy especially since I spend so much money taking care of them.
They really have no idea and I try to explain but it all goes over their heads :banghead:
Really does upset me when my own family are such narrow minded people.


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## Stefni (Aug 10, 2013)

"Humans are much stranger than rats"

I could NOT agree with you more Rat Daddy 

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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

Stefni said:


> You know, I have to say that the worst is trying to explain to your own family that they aren't vile creatures or try to explain to them how smart they are, it really frustrates me.
> They all think I'm crazy especially since I spend so much money taking care of them.
> They really have no idea and I try to explain but it all goes over their heads :banghead:
> Really does upset me when my own family are such narrow minded people.
> ...


It took having a literal baby rat, 2 weeks old, to convince my family. They all loved the fluffy squeaky balls of motion and would "check in" to hold them. They don't like my bigger (older) rats, though. Even when I'm sitting there showing them they know to come to their name, climb on my shoulder and will walk around with me. It's upsetting because my dog can't even manage a sit and everyone loves her.


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## Stefni (Aug 10, 2013)

nanashi7 said:


> It took having a literal baby rat, 2 weeks old, to convince my family. They all loved the fluffy squeaky balls of motion and would "check in" to hold them. They don't like my bigger (older) rats, though. Even when I'm sitting there showing them they know to come to their name, climb on my shoulder and will walk around with me. It's upsetting because my dog can't even manage a sit and everyone loves her.


Totally get what you're saying, it seriously sucks lol 

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## Hey-Fay (Jul 8, 2013)

Rat Daddy, you need to write a book on Fuzzy Rat's adventures, the way you tell her tales are magnificent!


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## Mitsy (Apr 8, 2013)

thanks everyone! I think what I will do is instead of calling in my aware of what store im taking my rats into and when I go in I will ask someone at the store if it is ok or get them to get the person incharge of that stuff so I can ask them because then they see my rats and not just think they are gross.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I learned a strange lesson when I was a kid of about 10 years old and my dad refused to buy me a BB gun. I found a broken one in someone's trash and fixed it with a friend. Naturally, I hid it in the attic and snuck it in and out, but my father pretty much got wind of it in very little time. And he gave me the following speech:

It began with "Don't answer me and don't say anything. I'm not asking you if you have a BB gun." And ended "If I ever find out you have a BB gun because the neighbors complain and you break any windows or kill anyone's pets or get into trouble I will kill you." This happened long before I learned the term plausible deniability. And in fact, it's over 40 years later and that BB gun still resides in my closet, no we didn't break any windows, or kill anyone's pets and I didn't get killed, and when it came time to upgrade to bigger toys, I had a multiple couple year track record of safety and responsibility.

If you live in a really rural area, things are going to be harder for you as rural area's are less tolerant of all animals, but in general no one would really want to give permission as they don't want to be responsible for your rat. If someone gives permission they become responsible, but if they don't they can claim they didn't see you come in when something goes wrong. 

The first time we went into a local mini-market the all Arab staff looked somewhat panicky but no one said anything. We purchased our things and checked out we had Amelia with us and no one said anything about the elephant, or rather the rat in the store. The next time we came back a lady in line behind us asked us about our rat and we talked to her and she skritched our rat and a couple other people asked and we talked to them right in front of the counter staff. The counter staff were all sporting huge smiles of relief this time but no one said anything. The third time in, the counter man made a few polite inquiries and seemed amused. 

Yesterday we were in the store and the manager or owner and his more experienced staff stood back but stayed very close while we were served by a new employee. They had huge grins as they watched their clearly uncomfortable new clerk check us out. Some folks in line were basically ignoring us, including a police officer right behind us and one lady wanted to meet Max and we let her pet her and answered some questions, but basically the management was testing the new employee in customer relations. He remained polite stayed with the sale checked us out promptly and seemed to relax when I told Max she was not allowed on the counter... Max is still learning proper in store etiquette. 

As we left, we heard people laughing and talking, no doubt we were the topic of the conversation. The general tone was amusement and perhaps relief, but basically I assume the drift of the conversation was 'those are the people that ALWAYS come in with their rats'. So in a few visits we went from "see no rats, hear no rats, speak no rats" to those rats always come in, and they don't bother anyone. Maybe even to where it's fun when the rats come in and a test for a new employee. 

To be honest, shopkeepers usually have no clue as to what to do when you walk in. Mostly they hold their breath and wait and see what happens. If their customers run out screaming you will be asked to leave. If their customers mob you and start playing with your rat and they feel you are an attraction, they will give your rat treats to induce you into coming back. If your shoulder rat is well behaved and stays on shoulder it may be ignored or welcomed, if it runs all over the floor or counter or bites a customer, you won't be welcomed back, nor will we ever be allowed entry. 

If you brought your well trained shoulder rat to my town, no one would give it a second look. People would assume it will be well behaved and most likely they would strike up a conversation with you right off. 

Still you will always find a place where your rats aren't welcome. We went to the public library and there were several teenagers there, naturally they pounced on Fuzzy Rat and it got loud fast. The no dog signs were changed to no animals that same day and we were politely asked to leave. Complex security on the other hand liked Fuzzy Rat and didn't find that they had any problems with us being in the rest of the municipal complex. So we are welcome throughout the municipal complex, but just not the library. I know this seems odd, but as we were the first to show up with a rat the rules were established based on their first experiences with us. If we didn't get mobbed by the teens and it didn't turn into an event, we would have most likely not have had an issue there. They actually welcomed us when we first walked in, but I can clearly see where a librarian would not appreciate even a happy crowd getting too loud.


My advise is go to stores you know will be friendly first, like the pet shop and build your confidence and test your rat there. Don't touch any other animals there. Then try a store or two that isn't critical to your survival, somewhere being asked to leave won't make any difference to your life. Something like a shoe store you only visit a few times a year, then another good business is one where you are known and a valued customer. Also pick off hours and evening hours where you won't get as easily mobbed and you can practice your rat and human handling skills.

I know asking up front is a nice thing to do, and in a perfect world it might even be the right thing to do. But if my job were on the line and I was asked to give permission to let a strange animal into my place of employment and your rat then becomes my responsibility and career decision, I might be reluctant to invite you and your rat in too. On the other hand if you walked in, I'd likely watch you closely and in the absence of a policy react quickly to whatever happens.

Last story... I went into a chain pharmacy which just got a new manager. She was a very pleasant and attractive young lady, and her well trained staff brought my presence to her attention fast. And I was hardly down the the first isle when I was asked if I needed help. And in fact I did, and she took me right to the items I wanted. It was better customer service than I had ever received there. As soon as I started browsing the products and reading the labels I noticed the young lady was straightening items on the shelf next to me. She was ignoring Fuzzy Rat on my shoulder, but she was hanging close by. So I struck up a conversation with her about the products I was choosing from which quickly turned to Fuzzy Rat. The manager had lots of questions and they went very much like this... 

Q- What kind of an animal is that?
A- A highly trained shoulder rat.
Q- I've heard somewhere that rats are smart but I never saw one like that before. Have you ever taken her elsewhere?
A- Sure she goes ever where with me, it's important for her training to go out as often as possible. We go the the (insert a long list of places we go to here).
Q- Do you ever have any trouble with people? 
A- No, most people love meeting Fuzzy Rat and she loves to meet people. She's very friendly and NEVER bites. Would you like to meet her? 

To which the young lady manager cautiously reached over and stroked Fuzzy Rat, and seemed delighted at the experience. Her face changed from apprehension to relief... The perceived threat had been resolved, and she realized her customers weren't in danger at all... I followed up by adding that Fuzzy Rat wasn't permitted on counters or shelves or on the floor. Which obviously addressed any questions about sanitary issues she may have had before she even asked. But the tone of the conversation changed on a dime.

Questions moved to what does Fuzzy Rat eat, how long have I had her, how do you train a rat to be like this, etc... Another customer came by and met Fuzzy Rat and also seemed pleased to meet such a friendly well behaved animal and walked away with a big smile. 

No the manager didn't throw us a parade, nor did she ever express her official permission or extend an official invitation. But it was very clear that she was going to do nothing about us being in her store. She left it off with saying it had been a pleasure to meet us and she was more than impressed with Fuzzy Rat. By the time we checked out, a few minutes later, the staff was obviously up to speed. Fuzzy Rat was completely invisible as if she wasn't even there. No one commented or reacted. Basically we didn't change corporate policy regarding shoulder rats, likely there wasn't one in the first place and there still isn't one. And in the absence of a policy, Fuzzy Rat doesn't exist any more than an unusual hat might get noticed. 

To the stores credit, the skilled manager addressed a novel situation immediately and aggressively. She assessed the threat and risk to her customer's safety without over reacting. She put customer service first. And by taking no action and setting an example for her staff she defused what could have become a situation. After having met Fuzzy Rat and having skritched Fuzzy Rat and having witnessed that her other customer was comfortable with Fuzzy Rat being in the same store she acted appropriately and reasonably. On the other hand if she had to give official permission and thereby set a policy... I'm pretty sure she would have had to tell me rats weren't allowed in the store.

When you stroll in with a rat all your asking for is plausibly deniable implied consent and for the staff to do nothing until they observe you. By asking for official permission, you are asking someone to risk their job based on an animal they have never met before and one that comes with a bad reputation. If something goes wrong, it's much easier for someone to say they didn't see your rat than to say they invited it in. And once the staff realizes that nothing is going to go wrong it's not a problem anymore anyway.... When the regional supervisor asks, they will respond... "Yea, that's the rat that comes in every Friday. The other customers really like her." And once inertia is on your side, your about as hard to get rid of as a boulder in a pool dig.

Naturally... and I say this with love... don't bring a rat into any business unless it's trained and ready! If your rat goes native under the store fridges, and they have to call an exterminator to remove it or if it bites someone, you will have a very bad day.

And lastly, when a restaurant asked us not to bring our rat back... and I mean the owner was polite... and it was a rural area... He said "I know it's your family pet but for the sake of the other customers we don't permit animals like yours." I thanked him with similar courtesy and told him. "Our family has enjoyed dining in your establishment for the past several years and we're certainly going to miss you." The restaurant about half a mile down the road was pleased to take on our business and it turns out that the food is both cheaper and better. So we don't really miss the first restaurant nearly as much as we thought we might. And no, on a hot summer's evening, when we travel, we don't leave a rat in the car while we go somewhere to eat. 

The management made and effective decision to reduce their bottom line by about $500.00 per year in repeat business. I don't hold it against them. But most establishments are far more reluctant to send business to their competitors in my experience.


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## Grawrisher (Sep 10, 2013)

I have to speak honestly from a cashiers point of view, I work in a store where we have done multiple online training sessions about no animals in stores, but honestly, they don't exactly pay me enough to argue with the people who come in with their chihuahua in their purse, honestly even in stores where they're not technically allowed, most employees aren't paid enough to care


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


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## binkyhoo (Sep 28, 2008)

My concern. Driving with rats loose in the car. Bring rats to places, that is fine if it is fun for you, your rat and others. It might be that I drive in a highly populated area. I get so concerned just driving the rats to the vet. They go in their carrier, which goes into a box , that gets strapped in. Just say'in.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Driving with rats in the car isn't really much of a problem usually... Well until you look out your open window and see your rat car surfing on the side view mirror. Yup Fuzzy Rat, tail blowing in the breeze. I had to pull over very slowly on the highway shoulder to bring her back inside and she wasn't all too happy about it. And she would climb the seat belts to get her nose out the window (which didn't bother me so much as my dogs used to do it too but with a rat where the nose goes.... the rat is sure to follow. I pulled her in from walking on top of the window glass more than once. Still most rats aren't nearly that crazy. That peculiar quality of being fearless made Fuzzy Rat an amazing shoulder rat but honestly she also had more luck then sense. Of all of the rats I trained the fact that she died of illness and old age boggles my mind. That rat could come up with more ways to turn my hair grey than a child. 

But CAR DOORS KILL RATS, more than open windows! Rats love diving through closing doors or hanging their heads out doors to look down at stuff, either way you never close a car door until your rats are entirely under control. It's so easy to forget... and it's so easy to get distracted. And therefore it's so easy to kill your rat. There's a story to illustrate this point I have from personal experience, by I'd rather not tell it... as it didn't end well. And I promise you it's a mistake you won't make twice with the same rat.


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## taleia (Jul 25, 2013)

I have to say, I am sympathetic to those with phobias/fears. I am afraid of no critter on earth - except snakes. And when I see a snake, it's involuntary, I sweat, my heart races, I start shaking, I want to cry. I'm a calm person without any anxiety issues, but phobias are real. 

My grandma has a phobia of rodents; she loves me and knows I love my girls, so she would never criticize, but on the other hand I love her so I would never bring my girls near her or show her pictures. Respect goes both ways.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

taleia,

Phobia's are very real. That's why I don't like carriers rats can pop out from. I want people to see my rat from a distance. Phobias are distance driven. I'm pretty sure that you can observe a snake through thick glass and from a distance. At about 30 feet away you might even acknowledge the snake has pretty markings. If someone were holding a snake 15 feet away from you you would most likely start to feel uncomfortable, but you aren't about to run off screaming. If a snake slithered out of someone's purse on a bus next to you, I'm betting everyone on the bus is going to know about it.

The key to dealing with phobics is distance. 15 feet or 5 meters is about the minimum safe distance for most phobics not to lose their cool. If everyone sees your rat from 15 feet away off they can go around you or warn you off. You aren't getting kicked out of the store. 

There is a big difference between rat phobics and people who don't like rats. I've even met rat phobics that like rats but can't come close to one. A person who doesn't like rats might not want to come close but isn't going to tear off screaming in terror, but a real phobic most certainly might. I've seen one freeze up, stop breathing and turn blue which is also not a good thing. True rat phobics are very rare. But they are out there and if you don't take reasonable precautions and keep your distance very bad things can happen when you cross paths with one.

Lastly DON'T take people's objections lightly. And you are not going to cure anyone's rat phobia by putting your rat on their head. I promise you this will end badly and cost you a friendship or get your rat killed. I've actually seen people try this stupidity with varying degrees of horrific outcomes. If anyone says they don't like rats, don't try to change their minds and if they say they are afraid move away as quickly and as calmly as possible.


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