# Any suggestions on how to optimize smaller cage space?



## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

I got my 2 boys about 2 weeks ago along with a 16"l by 12"w by 20"h petco playhouse 3 level habitat. I've also added a 3rd shelf and a hammock and hanging basket to maximize floor space but I'm just wondering if there are any tricks to improve smaller cages without crowding them. I also take them both out at least 2 hours a day to help them burn off some energy. They seem happy together in it but every calculator says its too small but none that I've seen take shelf space into account And I'm assuming shelves also count as floor space. The box of the cage says its recommended for hamsters, rats, and gerbils but the connecting tubes and wheel that came with it are way too small which made me wonder if the cage itself was too small. They can climb through the holes where the tubes should connect to the bottoms of the platforms at least which they prefer to the bars. Sorry if I'm rambling but these are my first rats and I just want to make sure I do all I can to make them happy so any suggestions are greatly appreciated. I especially love "do it yourself" things. Its more satisfying when they like what you put time and thought into making. 

They are in the bottom for size reference. They just don't hold still when I get close, the little beggers. (Mu and Gu)


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## Kiko (Sep 18, 2009)

Sorry to say, but that cage is absolutely not appropriate for rats. Not even 1. MAYBE as a temp hospital cage, but if you want to house your rats permanently you need a bigger cage

For now give them lots of out of cage time, and clean it often since it is so small it will get nasty fast. Also rats love hammocks/Critter spacepods/ and hanging flower pots and small baskets, as toys they love paper towel tolls stuffed with paper and treats


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

Also, I enjoy cooking but I noticed there isn't really any topic on recipes. If anyone has some good treat recipes, I'm definitely interested. So far I made simple peanut butter treats which went over great and was surprisingly simple.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

Kiko said:


> Sorry to say, but that cage is absolutely not appropriate for rats. Not even 1. MAYBE as a temp hospital cage, but if you want to house your rats permanently you need a bigger cage
> 
> For now give them lots of out of cage time, and clean it often since it is so small it will get nasty fast. Also rats love hammocks/Critter spacepods/ and hanging flower pots and small baskets, as toys they love paper towel tolls stuffed with paper and treats


I'm planning on getting a second cage to place on top of this one and removing the top door (9r vice versa if the new ones bigger obviously) to keep the hammocks and for an emergency second cage but it will have to wait about 2 weeks. I could also use some store suggestions because the closest store was petco where the price jumped from $50 to $100 so i opted for the $50 sense the box said it was ok for rats knowing I have nothing but free time to let them out. They love the hammock and hanging basket. I gave them toilet paper tubes but they seeem to prefer the large one they can crawl through. but I am looking forward to getting a bigger cage. Its so much fun decorating them and have already gotten some new ideas but I dont want to croud the cage.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

In my defense, here is a better picture for sizing. I noticed they looked bigger then they are in the first picture. They are small rats. The larger one is only about 6" head to butt.










edit: Correction: they are 7" and 7 1/2". 

*reminder: please use the modify feature to add small details to your post. - jaguar*


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## Snippet (Dec 30, 2010)

I agree that that cage is no where near big enough. IMHO, boys need a cage that has a foot print of at least 80x50 cm. For this reason, this cage still wouldn't be great even if you made it bigger. If you're looking for a new cage I'd go for something like the Super Pet My First Home For Exotics which is big enough and fairly cheap.


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## Kiko (Sep 18, 2009)

NariCaution said:


> In my defense, here is a better picture for sizing. I noticed they looked bigger then they are in the first picture. They are small rats. The larger one is only about 6" head to butt.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Yes and they are small now, but they are babies. They will get MUCH bigger, the pet store labels them as 'small, medium, large' as a basis for snake food actually. it is meaningless for pets, since we are keeping them.
That rat with double in size when he is full grown.
Grown males can get 1-2 pounds. BIG boys.

The super pets exotics is good for a couple of rats, as well as Martins RF-680 which i highly reccomend.


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## luvmyfurbabies (Jul 27, 2011)

As for helping with space for the time being, I think I would just do maybe another hammock. It's hard to tell with a picture, but it looks fairly full in there already. And with the free time you have to let them play out of the cage I think it's ok for a very temp home. 

I have a similar situation.... as of right now I have my 2 young girls in a 20g long tank.  But those are the exact 2 cages I am looking at, too, and am actually leaning towards the Super Pet one as I can get it online with shipping for less than $80. (Check out the Ozbo site.)

Hope this helps.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

Thanks for the helpful info~ hopefully they won't grow so rapidly that they can last 2 weeks in that cage. I was also considering making my own as I've found a couple different guides and I have some basic hardware skills. Any pros and cons to making your own cage? I'd of course make it to the specs of the larger cages but I'm just wondering if I should really just fork over the money and get an actual cage instead of trying to build one as far as durability is concerned. or would attaching the cage I have now on top of say, a chinchilla or guinea pig cage work ok? That should adequately increase floor space and add lots of height but I'm not sure what would be better to do... I do kinda like the franken-cages. 

Thanks again for the opinions so far, my boys are gonna love their very soon coming, new, definitely bigger, home. And I'm definitely looking forward to having some big boys. One is already turning out to be quite the lap rat ^.^


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## AllegroAssai (Jul 21, 2011)

NariCaution said:


> Also, I enjoy cooking but I noticed there isn't really any topic on recipes. If anyone has some good treat recipes, I'm definitely interested. So far I made simple peanut butter treats which went over great and was surprisingly simple.


I just opened a recipe thread ;D

http://www.ratforum.com/index.php/topic,27930.0.html


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## luvmyfurbabies (Jul 27, 2011)

The only thing I could see being an issue with building one from scratch would be to make sure you use a powder coated metal, otherwise it won't take long for the bare metal to absorb stains and odors. I don't see why you couldn't add your cage on top of another, so long as you are able to seal any holes up nice and tight.


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## Kiko (Sep 18, 2009)

^
The issue with the cage she is it's got a tiny foot print.

For now it's alright, they are small babies so as long as they get a bigger cage soonish they will be fine. It's small yes, but I have seen much worse lol.

For the price, and ease I recommend buying a cage as opposed to building one, I personally don't like grotto 'cabinet' style cages because they offer poor ventilation and have to be So well made to avoid to avoid urine seeping in the cracks, chewing, cleaning ect.
But in the end it's up to you.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

I agree with you there. I don't much care for grotto cabinet cages either and I can't really fit another piece of furniture anyway. I was thinking of just getting some wire cage material or something similar once I checked out a hardware store or maybe making something like this... http://exoticpets.about.com/od/careofrats/ss/myratcage.htm . And thank you for the tip on getting powder coated metal. I probably will end up forking over the extra money unless I can find easy and rat-proof materials.


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## jadeangel (Jan 7, 2009)

Most car/bike shops can powder coat the metal for you, but you can also get Rustoleom pain and spray the metal yourself. The only downside to this is the paint has to cure for 2 weeks before you can use it on your cage.


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## RooppyRekfare (Aug 3, 2011)

*This is strictly what i needed*

Charming  Your personality shines auspices of these pictures  

Although dressing nicer is getting more common with guys these days, I don't know if I would like a customer taking more every now into shopping and creating a clothes than me. I deliberate on that the furthest you should go is buying discriminating things, If a guy makes it appearance of like he planned his outfit the time before, it kinda loses novelty (in behalf of a absence of a better time). But i take nothign against metrosexuals in inclusive, and benevolent for the sake of the guys who are.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

*Re: This is strictly what i needed*



RooppyRekfare said:


> Charming  Your personality shines auspices of these pictures
> 
> Although dressing nicer is getting more common with guys these days, I don't know if I would like a customer taking more every now into shopping and creating a clothes than me. I deliberate on that the furthest you should go is buying discriminating things, If a guy makes it appearance of like he planned his outfit the time before, it kinda loses novelty (in behalf of a absence of a better time). But i take nothign against metrosexuals in inclusive, and benevolent for the sake of the guys who are.


Umm... What now? This is not relevant to my interests.


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## Bananana (Aug 1, 2011)

*Re: This is strictly what i needed*



RooppyRekfare said:


> Charming  Your personality shines auspices of these pictures
> 
> Although dressing nicer is getting more common with guys these days, I don't know if I would like a customer taking more every now into shopping and creating a clothes than me. I deliberate on that the furthest you should go is buying discriminating things, If a guy makes it appearance of like he planned his outfit the time before, it kinda loses novelty (in behalf of a absence of a better time). But i take nothign against metrosexuals in inclusive, and benevolent for the sake of the guys who are.


Looks like we've got a spambot, guys. I was very confused for a moment.


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## Bananana (Aug 1, 2011)

NariCaution, what's your price range? (I looked in the posts, but didn't see anything. Sorry if you've already mentioned it). Have you tried checking Craigslist for used cages? I found a double Critter Nation on there for $75 the other day! (unfortunately, I didn't need another cage, otherwise I would have snatched that thing up lightning-fast). 

If CL isn't an option, a bin cage might work well until you can afford a larger cage. I used one as a travel cage for a long time and it only cost $35 to build. It was 36 inches long, 18 inches deep and about 32 inches high. Pretty good for thirty five bucks! However, we didn't use powder-coated wire since the cage was going to be used so infrequently and we didn't have much money to spend. That might increase your costs a bit.


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## jadeangel (Jan 7, 2009)

yup, just a spam bot  Not much we can do until they update the forums, except report it to the mods, since they don't always see the ones that are posted on already started threads >.<


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

Well my price limit would be, id say $80 because I already blew $50 on this first one... THE BOX SAID FOR RATS! D: I've already checked but so far nothing seems suitable. Slim pickings right now I guess. But I did post that I was looking for a cage and I guess if I don't get any hits before I get paid on the 15th then I'll just go to all the pet stores within a few miles for price and stock comparison But this will be a pain I i don't have a car. I'd order online but I'm at work during the day when things are delivered which is a pain but it is doable as a last resort if I can't find anything in person... Geez, being a rat mama is really a labor of love.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

BayouBird said:


> yup, just a spam bot  Not much we can do until they update the forums, except report it to the mods, since they don't always see the ones that are posted on already started threads >.<


Lol, I feel like a real forum member now. A spammer has invaded my thread. This is an auspicious moment.


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## Bananana (Aug 1, 2011)

NariCaution said:


> Well my price limit would be, id say $80 because I already blew $50 on this first one...


You can get a Rat Manor at petco for around $80 sometimes (the price fluctuates). It isn't a huge cage, but MUCH larger than the one you're currently using, but my first rats lived in one comfortably for a good six months before we could afford a bigger cage. Many people have had good luck with Martin's cages as well. The 685 seems like a good option. Prevue Hendryx (not sure on the model) and Superpet for exotics are cages I've seen lots of people use. 



> THE BOX SAID FOR RATS! D:


Unfortunately there are many, many cages marketed for rats that aren't even close to being big enough for them. _Most_ cages that are specifically marketed for rats aren't actually big enough! It's really sad. 

That being said, if you kept the receipt, you might be able to clean the cage really well and return it. It depends on the pet store, but it's worth a shot.


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## jadeangel (Jan 7, 2009)

Bananana said:


> That being said, if you kept the receipt, you might be able to clean the cage really well and return it. It depends on the pet store, but it's worth a shot.


This most definitely. Not sure where you got your first cage, but if it was Petco, they can at least do a product exchange depending on the cage and give you a credit towards the new one, even if they can't give you back your money. I've had to do that before, but it was a local mom and pop shop


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## Kiko (Sep 18, 2009)

I say keep them in the cage for a little while until you save a but of money, and then buy a nice cage you won't ever have to replace like a martins, or a SPE Exotics (which is 100 flat you can probably find a place that offers free shipping)

The R-680 can fit 2-4 rats, and including shipping wont be more then 120, it is very high quality and won't ever have to be replaced.

Criagslist is an option, sometimes you can find ferret cages for cheap. But you have babies so you'd need to wait 2-3 months anyway to put them into it, so you could have time to safe for a good cage.


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## naricaution (Jul 31, 2011)

Trying to return it would be alright but I actually tore up the cage box to make a cardboard house... I thought it was cute cuz the packaging said "playhouse"... Either way, I do like the cage and its always good to have a back-up/transport cage and it has carry handles. And I probably will either get a martins or that super pet for exotics if I can't find anything better at the pet stores. I just don't want to look now because pay day can't come soon enough as it is and I don't wanna get too excited just yet. Till then, I'm poking around online doing size, price, and customer review research. I'm just hopeful some of the smaller shops around here without websites have some hidden deals. Has anyone ever found a cage at a thrift store? also, having a bigger cage should help with bickering right? My smaller boy is a little rough and my bigger boy is a cry baby. He even squeaks when I pick him up occasionally even though I know I'm not being rough and my little one has never squeaked... Its never loud, more of a protesting chirp. and i know they get along well because they cuddle and groom each other... Is it normal for rats to be so vocal or should I be worried when I hear squeaking at night?


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