# Jerky body movements akin to hiccuping with faint chirping? I'm so lost, PLEASE help



## annabanana (Aug 12, 2012)

Busmalis has recently, within the last two weeks, started doing this weird, hiccuping movement. I first noticed it while we were snuggling and he was intensely bruxing and eye boggling, so I thought that he was very content and that this was just another little rat mannerism that was new to me. However it has been happening about once a day now, and I'm starting to get worried. 

I've had Busmalis for five months now. I know that excess porphyrin is a sign of URI, but every morning since I've had him he wakes up with a tiny bit around his little nose. My vet said I had nothing to worry about, but now of course I am going over every decision I've made. So yes, a tiny bit of porphyrin on his nose in the morning and a couple sneezes a day, (I was also told sneezing varies from rat to rat?) but other than that I've not noticed any odd behaviors until this most recent one. 

He's a lazy little guy, but he's been like that since I found him. He does play and run around like a crazy man, but for the most part he prefers to snuggle. I tried listening to him like a telephone, and I didn't hear anything that would strike me as weird, but then again I have nothing to compare it to.

Does this fall under "normal" rat mannerisms? Or should I call my vet ASAP to make an appointment?


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

Hiccuping is normal, often from allergies. 

What type of bedding is he on?

If you can give him a bit of Dark chocolate (90% of higher if you can, but 70% or higher is fine as well). and increase Vitamin A and E (Nuts, Seeds, Carrots. Make sure it's natural Vitamin A found in fruits and vegetables though). Or give him a bit of Echinacea (you can get it at the store in either liquid form, try to git it without gold seal if possible, or in a powder pill form).


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

Yeah sounds like hiccupping, sometimes with the sound its normal, but mostly they are silent. Watch for an impending URI with the noise.


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## Pixxie (Jun 3, 2012)

Honestly, it's pretty normal. Two of my rats often wake up with a little porphyrin, but it is always in the same spot and it's always roughly the same amount. As long as there is no change, he is fine.


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## annabanana (Aug 12, 2012)

Thanks guys. 

I originally had him on Carefresh Natural bedding, but it was so dusty that he was sneezing NON STOP. Plus, it really did nothing for odor control, even with doing a full cage cleaning every other day. Right now we're using Kaytee Clean and Cozy Lavender. We both seem to like this; it's soft and fluffy for him to snooze on and make little rat barricades, and it's been pretty good with odor control. He doesn't spend a ton of time on his cage. If my sister or I am home his cage door is open and he can come and hang out on the couch, race up and down or whatever else he wants. Plus he likes making himself into a rat burrito with our blankets. 

So could the bedding be the problem? I'm not sure why after months of use he would just now be having issues, but that's why I'm here! Thanks again!


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## LightningWolf (Jun 8, 2012)

I would try to get the Clean and Cozy without the Lavender. added smells like that can cause issues.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Now, this might sound like a strange analogy but some years ago I found the bat in my bedroom, hanging from the drapes. When I woke it up, it started making jerky movements a lot like my rat makes when she wakes up. Eventually, the poor little bat actually started vibrating, at which point we netted it with a long handled fishnet and gently eased it out the window where it took off and was never heard from again.

As it turns out bats significantly reduce their body temperatures when they sleep and they have to go through a rather drawnout warm-up procedure before they can fly. I always assumed that rats might conserve energy in a similar fashion. In the case of my big girl, she does the hiccuping thing, then she stretches and yawns and then just like the bat she kicks into gear. Although I haven't seen this with all of my rats, at least for the one, she's been doing this since she was a few weeks old and she still does it at 20 months.

It's not something I would worry about if there's nothing else wrong with your rat.


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## annabanana (Aug 12, 2012)

Rat Daddy, that is actually a really good analogy, and it makes perfect sense. He usually does it when he's waking up from one of his many naps. Thanks!


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## Pixxie (Jun 3, 2012)

I really would get him off of the lavender scented bedding though, as it can really irritate their respiratory system. I know I am wildly allergic to lavender and I can't imagine being surrounded by it 24/7. The unscented Clean and Cozy is great though. It is soft, fluffy, and truly dust free.


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## lilspaz68 (Feb 24, 2007)

I have recently heard that the lavender bedding caused severe allergies in a rat girl, so bad she lost weight, and was losing her fur. I have also heard of this reaction with guineapigs, so avoid the scented beddings.


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## trematode (Sep 8, 2012)

I would personally keep an eye on them. One of my girls made loud hiccuping noises and started sucking in her sides. Each of my girls ended up having a mild upper respiratory infection. One of my girls have started doing it again and seems to have a bit of ployphrin build-up when ahe gets up, so I have been keeping an eye on her breathing. I personally find it very difficult to hear respiratory sounds. I grabbed a cheap stephoscope that I had from volunteering so I can listen more easily. I have not had any experience with bedding. I prefer to use fleece and towels. I change it whenever I notice odors (every couple of days). My friend was telling me that her vet (an exotics specialist) recommended changing the litter box daily because those scents can be aggravating.


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## cervine (Oct 14, 2012)

Hi, my boys were doing the exact same thing. Sneezes a few times a day, just a little bit of porphyrin when they woke up, and the little chirpy hiccups once a day. Other than that they were hyper and good eaters. They're on fleece, so there's no dust in the cage. The vet put them on antibiotics and one's symptoms went away, but the others stayed, despite 4 weeks of treatment. Today, the one that was still showing the symptoms made little hiccups like normal, except they sounded congested, almost. I took him to the vet again and they did an X-Ray-- his URI had progressed down into his lower tract but not quite to his lungs yet. He's now on a baytril/doxy combo, so my fingers are crossed that he'll start getting better.

So, my rat ended up being sick. But then again I've read that this stuff is normal for rats. It's confusing, for sure. I would go with your gut instinct but either way, keep a close watch on him.


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## annabanana (Aug 12, 2012)

Hey everyone, just want to give you guys an update...
He's still doing the hiccuping thing, but yesterday morning and today I noticed a significant amount of porphyrin around his nose. I've never seen this much before, it looks like he dipped his nose in strawberry jam. Aside from that, he looks and acts like he normally does. I'm going to call my vet. I just don't feel comfortable with that huge increase in porphyrin seemingly overnight. Oh yeah, we've been using un-scented Clean and Cozy for about three weeks now. He seems to like it.


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