# Rat Anxiety?



## elliotulysses (Feb 8, 2015)

I know that rats differ in personality greatly, but can they develop some form of chronic anxiety? Hansel is a very shy boy, always searching for his next spot to hide, and is extremely nervous when exposed in the open. He likes pressing against me if he is out and needs to be pet to be reassured. He does not show food aggression but will always run to eat his treats or individual pieces of food somewhere secret, and squeaks when his cage mate comes too close by.

He loves affection like a well socialized rat, and trust me and my girlfriend enough to accept treats from hand. We've socialized two other rats and have seen them become more extraverted, but Hansel is taking awhile coming out of his shell.

What would be the best plan of action?


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## DustyRat (Jul 9, 2012)

My girl Jet was far worse than what you have mentioned. It took 6 months for her to come out of the cage on her own. He likely just needs more time.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Rats don't develop anxiety they are born with it from what I can tell... I've trained several rats to be true shoulder rats and go outdoors with our family... The best shoulder rats are basically fearless, they take crazy risks and usually have very good eyesight. The worst candidates panic in open spaces, when going into well lit buildings and when meeting new people... By panic, I mean bolt off and run for cover.

This anxiety level seems built into the rat right from the start. Some rats can be true shoulder rats and take to it like a fish to water, some can take a limited amount of outdoor activity and stress while others will get themselves lost or killed very quickly, sometimes first time out. I have tried, but you can't teach a high anxiety rat to be less anxious. As low anxiety rats get older they do become more careful and cautious, but they rarely ever panic.

If you think about it depending on the threats in the environment both types of rats will flourish. In a low predator environment, low anxiety rats will get more food than high anxiety rats, in a dangerous environment the high anxiety rats are less likely to get themselves killed... it makes good evolutionary sense to have both types of rats in the genepool.


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## elliotulysses (Feb 8, 2015)

Ok this makes sense. Hansel seems to be more aware of the cats and may be freaked out by the snake room (don't do live feedings EVER). But I try to keep those areas off limits during free roam. I think he just might sense it and be afraid. I did get him from the feeder rat bin because Mr. Chuckles was a feeder rat and turned out to be my little fearless rat ambassador. We have a cat that he likes to literally chase around because SHE gets so freaked (try to keep this from happening though). But maybe Voodoo and Mr. Chuckles were just more brave shoulder rats. Both will hop up on their own accord and even jump to other's shoulders, but Hansel stays in his spot and is content being a laprat.


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## elliotulysses (Feb 8, 2015)

DustyRat said:


> My girl Jet was far worse than what you have mentioned. It took 6 months for her to come out of the cage on her own. He likely just needs more time.


Oh man! So it will just take time and adjusting. I'm going to try to make him more adventurous by doing the yogurt trick.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Actually all rats will eventually become more comfortable with their environment over time. Just like your rats will become more comfortable around their humans. But based on each rats inherent anxiety level, or what I generally refer to as their stress limit, the point where they panic, each rat will have it's limits. 

Some humans skydive and rock climb and scuba dive, they join the military and engage in dangerous occupations while others freak out on standardized tests and never learn to drive a car. It really has nothing to do with intelligence or upbringing in most cases, it's just where their panic point or maximum stress level is set. I can drive a car, and I've worked on certain dangerous jobs, but I've never found the need to jump out of a perfectly good airplane. Most humans and rats aren't just total risk taking freaks or paranoid agoraphobics, most range somewhere in between. And rats that have been traumatized can recover over time... but basically as a rat owner and trainer you have to adjust your sights to be realistic for each rat you own.

This is Fuzzy Rat walking right up to a stranger and saying "Hi".











This is Max doing a meet and greet at the town fair...









And this is Amelia hiding in a tree... 








After a life time, she eventually was able to walk on the ground under the tree, but she never walked out into an open outdoor space on her own... She would panic if put down on the ground and run for cover... 

Our current true shoulder rat Cloud doesn't like to be held by strangers and she never explores more than a short distance away from us... Fuzzy Rat would take off on her own and come back an hour later, sometimes with new friends in tow, she loved to go off on her own to explore... 

From everything we tried, we found that there is a certain degree of progress you can make with a rat, but for the most part their limits are pretty hard set. You might get an agoraphobic human to go outside into their back yard, but you'll never get them to jump out of an airplane. Set your sights differently with each rat and be realistic. There's nothing wrong with having a shy little furry friend... Amelia was a really great rat, we loved her even if she was always reclusive and she never made the cut to be a true shoulder rat. She would slink out of her hidey hole at around 5:00 AM wake me up to say hi, eat her breakfast and then evaporate again until dinner time. We never saw too much of her, but she was always a sweetheart when she was around. In contrast, Fuzzy Rat slept on my desk, rarely out of arm's reach.









Two rats, different like night and day. And basically it was mostly due to their different panic points and stress tolerance. Sometimes you can tell one from the other when you adopt them, but mostly you find out who they are after you get them home.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I forgot to add... for anyone reading along, that all of our rats had extensive outdoor training at our 40 acre safe site, Amelia is at the safe site in the photo where nothing bad could happen to her... 

True shoulder rats are special from birth, and they are highly trained and experienced before they can go places... do not just take your indoor rats outside, you will get them lost or killed!

I post these pictures of our shoulder rats to demonstrate a point, and perhaps to show off a little.. yes, I'm very proud of our special rats, but I don't want people to think outdoor activities with your rats are either safe or easy... A great true shoulder rat will make it look easy, but don't be fooled, they are very special and rare animals and there's a lot of work and training that goes behind taking your rat to the beach for a swim and some frolicking in the sunshine.


...and yes, I do have a video of Fuzzy Rat swimming in the lake with the kids... and no, I've never seen any other rat jump into a lake and swim around with anyone... She was a 1 in 1000 rat, even for a true shoulder rat, and the kinds of things she did naturally would have gotten most rats killed long before anyone could have taken any nifty pictures. She died of old age and tumors at home in her cage... as did Max and Amelia... not all shoulder rat candidates are nearly that lucky.


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## elliotulysses (Feb 8, 2015)

Rat Daddy said:


> Actually all rats will eventually become more comfortable with their environment over time. Just like your rats will become more comfortable around their humans. But based on each rats inherent anxiety level, or what I generally refer to as their stress limit, the point where they panic, each rat will have it's limits.
> 
> Some humans skydive and rock climb and scuba dive, they join the military and engage in dangerous occupations while others freak out on standardized tests and never learn to drive a car. It really has nothing to do with intelligence or upbringing in most cases, it's just where their panic point or maximum stress level is set. I can drive a car, and I've worked on certain dangerous jobs, but I've never found the need to jump out of a perfectly good airplane. Most humans and rats aren't just total risk taking freaks or paranoid agoraphobics, most range somewhere in between. And rats that have been traumatized can recover over time... but basically as a rat owner and trainer you have to adjust your sights to be realistic for each rat you own.
> 
> ...


Thank you! Your advise is always insightful and appreciated. Thanks for the information. I have a feeling Mr. Chuckles is going to be like Fuzzy Rat. I think he actually enjoys chasing the cats haha


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I really wouldn't be surprised, when our part wild rat went on walkabout for 5 months we really were pretty convinced she was dead. But oddly all of the feral cats stayed off our property... my wife joked that our lost rat, or it's ghost was chasing them away... Well, when she came home, we were pretty sure it wasn't her ghost. She was a nasty vicious piece of work when she got angry, more than a match for a domestic cat.

So yes adult rats can chase cats, there are even youtube videos of rats attacking cats and cats avoiding or ignoring rats. It's easy to forget just how good rats are at surviving and thriving in hostile environments. 

And a rat like Fuzzy Rat is a mixed blessing... as brilliant as she was, she got bored easily and she could be pretty indoor destructive. Keeping her challenged and occupied was a full time job, until she got old she hardly even slept. We loved her to death, and she was absolutely amazing, but be careful what you wish for or some mid-summer night you may find yourself outside at 1:00 AM walking your rat in the rain too. A few laps around the soccer field and she was usually tired and ready for bed. Winter indoors, was not easy for anyone.


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