# Rat suddenly extremely lethargic



## Campuschris

Hey there! I currently have 1 rat at ~2 years old, purchased from Petsmart in a pair of 2 in August of 2010 (I know, I know, get from a breeder. But I don't regret buying these guys at all). His cage mate passed away due to lifelong health issues a couple months ago. That one was sick most of his life, taking all sorts of medication on and off. It was his time.  

My gf cleaned the rat's cage last night (using the same cage cleaner we have their entire life: http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=2753346 and the same bedding we've used his entire life: http://www.petsmart.com/product/index.jsp?productId=3166875 . In fact, the bedding that we used had already been opened before, and the top 1/3 used in his cage the week before. So it was not a brand new bag, he had already romped around in some of the bedding from that back previously. Also, I freeze the bedding 24 hours before using it, in case of mites). He was EXTREMELY agitated by this, trying to save what old nasty food piles he had crammed under this bedding or that. We've done this dance with him (and his old cage mate) since he was little. He just took it a little harder last night than usual, becoming more agitated than normal. Immediately after the cleaning was finished he was still energetic, quickly running for treats given to him and storing food. Several hours after this, however, she checked on him again to discover he was extremely lethargic. He would perk up from time to time, but if you set him on a location he will not move from it. He IS capable of moving, as he randomly does muster the energy to traverse from our lap all the way up to our shoulder (once an hour at best), but he acts very weak. If left alone, he will simply lay down and squint his eyes as if sleeping. He doesn't brux/grind his teeth at all, either in happiness or stress. He does, however, eat. He's consumed any treats we put him front of him, as well as any food blocks in reach and even some bedding. But again, not with an abundance of energy. He does so slowly with small nibbles. 

We took him to the vet this afternoon, the best rat vet we know of (though her knowledge of rats is still limited. Not many people in our area even mess with them). She said his lungs sound clear and his heart is beating at 200bpm. She suggested that he might be dehydrated and gave him a vitamin B shot + a shot of water (quite a bit. The whole process was heart breaking- he wasn't happy with that at all and screamed greatly). She said to return tomorrow at noon to check up on him... but said if he hasn't perked up from that, then it isn't looking too good for him. 

Some quick info on the current rat: The current rat has always been the healthy one. A bundle of energy with no known health issues until this event. No warning signs at all that this was coming. No major diet changes in the past 2 months. Some behavior changes in the past month, due to the loss of his cage mate. We attempt to play with him at least an hour a day, sometimes 2. (I have no intention of getting another rat, or pet for that matter, for a long while, so we make due with the best we can. This guy is my last for a bit.). He has become exceptionally OCD since, but never acted lethargic or otherwise lacking in energy. He still moves and plays as much as before. If he is depressed, he's showing it in other ways. There are no pesticides in the air in that room and we use no chemicals around him nor wear any when near him (no perfume or cologne or the like). He has a giant air purifier next to his cage that runs constantly. His cage is 4 levels tall (built for a ferret: His cage ). The top 2 receive draft from the air purifier to help keep him cool. They also have a box and igloo for him to hide in. The bottom 2 levels are blocked from all drafts. Temperature in the room never exceeds 80 degrees (its a satellite room and hard to keep cool. We're renting as roommates so I can't change that situation  ) He has shown no signs of heat stroke or similar issues. He has no visible physical ailments, neither bumps nor scratches nor anything else. All his feet look fine. Tail is a somewhat pale at the base compared to the middle/tip, which are a brownish color. That paleness goes about 1/3 of his tale (never really thought about taking note as to whether this was normal or not until now.) 

So here I am. Can anyone think of anything, based on all the information that I gave, that might be the cause? Any suggestions that I can bring to her tomorrow to give some reason why we shouldn't assume that he's just gotten old and would be left suffering if we don't put him down. Make no mistake- he's not in good shape. If I put him in a location, he will not move from it. This means I have to keep him near food and water to make sure that he doesn't go without sustenance. At this exact moment, his quality of life is not good. If that can be fixed, I'll do whatever it takes to make it happen. But if it can't, I do not want to prolong this any more than necessary. 

Thanks in advance for any information!


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## Campuschris

I also have NOT noticed a head tilt of any kind. I've been watching for it but unless it is not at all pronounced and hard to see, I haven't seen anything of the like.


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## Campuschris

His ability to move has decreased throughout the night and he sounds now almost as if he has labored breathing, which is contrary to how he sounded earlier today. Vet appointment is in 12 hours... Gonna feel like days. Please: if anyone can think of Things this could be that are treatable speak now so I can bring it up to my vet!


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## jenn1c

I am sorry, I have no ideas but I really feel for you. I can't imagine how you must be feeling right now. Hopefully he will be ok until you get to the vet and she will have some ideas.


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## Rat Daddy

Most of the ratties in my neck of the woods come from the same pet shop that sells fuzzy rat pups for about two and a half bucks as feeders and pets. Some of the local rat owners have had their commercial feeder rats from this shop for 5 years. So just because your rattie didn't come with a pedagree, doesn't necessarily mean he can't live well over 2 years.

The first thought that comes to mind as it likely did yours, with the rapid onset is poison. Commerical rats will pretty much eat anything, the treatment without knowing the specific poison is to keep the rattie hydrated and give him milk thistle to protect the liver. In a day or two you should see improvement depending on the poison and the amount thereof. You never know, your downstairs neighbor might have bug bombed his apartment or the landlord roach sprayed your cage or bedding or sprayed something to kill weeds right outside the window or something bazaar like that.

But if you rule out poison, as long as the lungs are clear and he's eating and drinking and not in obvious pain, I don't think you have to put him to sleep yet. As I read this thread, your rattie has been sick for two days and you might just be a little bit ahead of yourself. Your boy still might make a come back. Make sure he eats and drinks and hope for the best. As to dying of old age, from my own limited experience and that of my friends, small animals rarely linger very long like some humans can, they go pretty quick and just fall asleep. Not a bad way to go.

Best Wishes


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## Rat Daddy

OK, so our last posts crossed, sounds like things are getting worse, difficulty breathing can be conjestive heart failure (but it doesn't necessarily have to be). Until you go to the vet, keep him warm, and just let him know you are there. Rats have pretty short lives compared to ours and every huggie and kissie counts.


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## Campuschris

Thanks for the replies! Vet appointment in 2 hours. I'll definitely mention all of this to the vet. Problem is that I can't tell this guy's progression all that well. He doesn't look like he's moving much in his cage, but thanks to the shots yesterday he is terrified of us right now and looks like he's playing dead every time we come near him or hold him (they really hurt and thinking back- he's never really experienced pain since living with me. At least, not pain that would illicit a squeak out of him). He does move SOME, but only from one side of the bottom part of the cage to the other, and that only happened 2-3 times over the course of 10 hours. But when I pick him up he goes stiff, trembles, and looks as dead as rattily possible. Makes it hard to figure out just what shape he's in atm.


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## Campuschris

I posted this on behavior forum but it needs a moderator to post it and I'll be leaving soon, so I'm posting it here as well due to its importance:

I have a sickly little rat that I've discussed on the health board. http://www.ratforum.com/showthread.php?49513-Rat-suddenly-extremely-lethargic  Long story short: he wasn't moving much, acting lethargic and seemed almost unable to move. He is on his way to the vet to determine his fate. <br><br>Yesterday he received 2 shots, both of which hurt like crazy. There was screaming. It was bad. He had never, in all my time owning him, experienced pain that would make him squeak before, so it was a new experience. This was 17 hours ago. One was for a vitamin B shot, the other full of water (trying to rehydrate him in case that was the issue). The vitamin B shot has caused him to have an overwhelming smell of vitamin B.<br><br>Since those shots yesterday, he has become completely stiff. COMPLETELY. If I lay him on me and scratch him for a long while, he will eventually start to drag himself (without moving very much- minimal movement possible) to my neck (his favorite spot to be). He seems distressed when I touch him, though. When I pick him up he does NOT go limp, instead he remains in the same position (laying somewhat on his side) and his hands/feet still locked in the same position. He does stretch them, a little, when I give him scratches on his back.<br><br>Could this be him "playing dead" due to being basically terrified of me? This is extremely important because I don't want to take him to the vet and us think he's got some awful issue that would cause him to suffer all weekend simply because he's a little scared Im gonna hurt him again. He hasn't eaten or drank anything that I could see, so if this isn't a behavioral issue I don't want him to just lay around and starve/go without water (he wont even lift his head for me to get something in his mouth).<br><br>Any info would be great!


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## Rat Daddy

How's he doing?


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