# My sister's rat..



## RainyDays

So my sister had a male rat and her friend stole a female rat from the pet store and then put the two rats in the same cage and ended up ditching the female rat on her. Now my sister has moved back home and taken the two rats with her with the nine babies that resulted from them being together. We didn;t have any experience with rats breeding and kept the mom and litter in with the dad and she ended up giving birth again because we realized she was pregnant. 10 babies this time! She was only in there for a day before she was moved out with the second litter and now she's pregnant again! The babies are about four weeks. They've been eating and drinking by themselves for over a week so I've decided to put her by herself with one of the babies to keep her company until she gives birth. She is very young though and the two litters back to back have taken a toll on her(she has hair missing in places) and I'm worried if I should give the third litters babies away for reptile food and leave her with just two so she can recover.


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## JennieLove

Wow! Okay first off, keep her separated from the male from now on you dont want momma to be having anymore babies, lol.


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## JennieLove

Do Not keep the male with the female unless one or the other are fixed. Momma rat should be fine, I think she just needs to recover and take a break! You should keep momma rat by herself if the babies are eating and drinking on their own. You should look into getting momma a vet visit, they may even be able to do an e-spay on her. Either way there is no reason those babies should be considered Snake food at all! You can take the babies to a shelter or even a rescue, please dont give them away as food...


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## RainyDays

I don't have the money to take her to the vet, plus she's my SISTER'S rat. Not mine. 
She's been out of the cage with the male since this litter has been born.
Should I still leave one baby in with her to keep her company?


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## Hippy

RainyDays said:


> I'm worried if I should give the third litters babies away for reptile food and leave her with just two so she can recover.


I would never mention this on this forum. People here are very against the feeding of rats to reptiles. Please consider other options. Craigslist, A shelter near you, google some rat rescues near your area...

Your mommy rat is probably extremely tired now that she has a third litter on the way. You need to make sure you give her extra protein or else she could become ill and the pups will have bad nutrition. Eggs, chicken, even going out and getting formula and mixing it in with her food.

And, how the **** do you steal a rat from a pet store. I'm eyed like a hawk when I just wanna pet them.. 

http://www.ratfanclub.org/repro.html
http://www.ratsauce.com/breeding/index.php
http://www.spoiledratten.com/raisingpupscontent.html
http://www.worldofrats.com/ROUSBreedingFAQ5.html


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## JennieLove

I think if they are eating on their own with no problem at all, then mom should be housed alone, untill she has her litter. Dont worry about her being lonely, Im she she would love the time for herself. Do Not keep the male with her or anywhere near her, even if its only for a min of play time. Keep the male in a different cage. 

Even if shes not your rat, you are the one asking for our advise. You need to have your sister own up to her responsibilities and take care of her rats, which means getting her male or momma rat fixed. Its either that, keeping the two separate, or finding her male or the momma and babies new homes. Get yoru sister to talk on the forum, already its sounding like she really doesnt care whats going on...you seem to care more than her. How old is your sister? Does she have a job? Whos paying for the her rats food, bedding...stuff like that right now? 

I dont know too much about rats this young so Im hoping someone will comment on how to care for these babies while momma is preparing for the new litter. 

You said YOU were worried about letting these babies become Snake food...Does that mean YOU are responsible for these babies? It's sounding like your sisiter has given you ALL control of these rats, and if thats true then you need to take charge. Just becuase these are your "sisters" rats, doesnt mean you cant make a differance. Please try to get your sister involved in the forums!


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## JennieLove

Thank you hippy for all those links. I was just about too look for some to post as options.


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## RainyDays

My sister is 17, she has a full time job but won't pay the money to get her spayed.
When she moved out I refused to let her take her rat with her because I knew it wouldn't be properly cared for. She ended up buying the male and that's how this started.
She won't even buy a suitable cage for her male rat.
My mom pays for all of the rats food/bedding and I am the sole caregiver. My sister will give the rats food/water but I'm stuck cleaning ALL of the cages. She has cleaned the cage ONCE in two months.
I do not want the babies to be snake food but I don;t want the mom getting in worse condition that she already is.
I gave her some mozzarella cheese tonight and tomorrow morning I'll cook the rats a few hard boiled eggs.
I am the one who is finding homes for these rats too. She found homes for three of them but I doubt they were good homes.  One of the girls was homeless a few months ago that took a rat while I wasn;t home so I couldn;t stop her.
I'm 16 by the way and I have a job but all the money from it goes to my horse.

Oh and I have NO clue how the girl stole the rats. At the petstore the rats are in a back room but can be seen through glass. The hamsters have a cage where you can pet them though so it'd be easy to steal one.


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## JennieLove

Well if your sister has nothing to do with the rats, and you even said that you are the sole caregiver than those rats your your responsibility, not your sisters...You said you have no control of what happends to them, but you do, beaucse you are the one taking care of them...Anyways, what you need to do is keep the male separated from the female FOR GOOD. No more putting them together or else you are going to get more babies, and thats not good for you or momma rat. If you arnt able to do that, at least get the male a good home and then all you have to deal with is the momma and the babies. 

Are the babies eating alright by themselves now, good enough for momma to be alone?


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## JennieLove

What food is momma rat on?


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## RainyDays

I never said I have no control of what happens to them?
I try my best to ensure that they go to good homes, but if my sister gives rats away when I'm not home I can't do anything about it. I tell her not to give them to anyone unless they are competant of taking care of them but she doesn't always listen.

Why do you keep bringing up the father? He doesn't have any contact with the females ever now. We just didn't realize how fast rats can get pregnant.

I'm not sure. My mom buys it. Random pelleted foods. All of the bags are thrown away now too.
What should I recommend that she buy next?
I also feed them fresh food everyday and other random healthy food I eat.


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## JennieLove

RainyDays said:


> I don't have the money to take her to the vet, plus she's my SISTER'S rat. Not mine.


Here you pretty much said you couldnt do anything about it.


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## Forensic

Stealing a rat. Wow. Guess she asked for it and then walked out without paying. Crazy.

The babies need to be separated male/female at 5 weeks. If you need help sexing, feel free to post pictures and we'll help. Theoretically the babies could live with Dad. If you don't know which babies are from which litter, you'll want to figure it out or mark them or something.

Look into a rat rescue to help, maybe have her pick a gender to keep and give the rest to the rescue or a no-kill shelter, once they're old enough (about 5/6 weeks for the babies).

Look for Esbilac (I think that's spelled right) or soy human formula to help the babies. Feed them and the mom lots of good protein foods. Get them off the pellet food, it's usually worthless. Make sure they aren't kept on pine or cedar and if they're in tanks they have to be cleaned daily.

Hope it all works out.


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## JennieLove

Im asking about the Males because I wasnâ€™t sure if you has 1 male or two, on your other post you had said you wanted to keep ANOTHER male, so that got me a bit confused, either way Im trying to help you here, so there is no need for attitude.

Now that you know that rats DO breed that fast...stop putting the males and females together in the future. 

Rats like any other animal, need a certain type of diet...any type of random pellet food isnâ€™t good enough. There are many threads on this forum that talk about what SHOULD be fed. I suggest you which over to a more appropriate food ASAP. Right now Im feeding mine, Nutro Light dog food, but again there are MANY more on other threads, just check them out. 

As for your sister, I think you need to talk to her or have you, your mom and her all talk together about what responsibility means. She obviously doesnâ€™t give a crap about whatâ€™s happening to these rats and if I were in your shoes I would tell her that if sheâ€™s not going to take proper care of them that you are going to take them from here-on-in and that she has no right in taking any of them to just randomly give out to people...thatâ€™s just stupid!


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## RainyDays

Why are you guys acting like I'm completely clueless?
I'll change their food.
I find it very easy to sex them even when the boys ball haven't dropped yet. There's 6 males and 4 females. They'll be seperated at 5 weeks. Which I knew already.
It's very easy to tell which rats are from which litter. There's a huge size difference.
They've never been on pine/cedar.
I use Yesterday's news, a horse pelleted bedding, and aspen shavings.
Unless I absolutely can't find good homes for the rats I won't be taking them to a shelter because that's irresponsible.
The males haven't had ANY contact with the mom or other females and won't be since the last accident.
I've already had some talks with my sister but I guess I need to have another one. I'm selling the babies because it isn't good to give them away for free(I'm just charging $3 per rat) and she expects some of the money. It's ridiculous.


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## RainyDays

Oh and I was just wondering why you're feeding nutro?
It isn't a good food for dogs so why would it be good for rats.
Can I feed them cat/dog food?
I have Natural Blance for my cat and dogs. It's a good quality food.


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## JennieLove

RainyDays said:


> Oh and I was just wondering why you're feeding nutro?
> It isn't a good food for dogs so why would it be good for rats.


Wow, where did you get your info from... ? Nutro light is actually a very high quality gog food which IS good for rats to eat.......... :? maybe you should spend more time thinking about what experianced rat owners are telling you instead of secound guessing them.


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## Stephanie

Ok if you sell the babies for 3 eahc then you are going to get alot of snake people that will simply tell you what you want to hear. I would charge 10 each to make sure. Also the Nutro Lite that Jennie is feeding her rats is a very good food for rats. Cat food is not very good for rats though. Are you offering momma baby food at all?


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## RainyDays

I think I might still have some... if not then I can probably get some tonight. I'm going to see if I can get my mom to take me to the grocery store to get proper rat food.
I'll try to get the person that told me that about Nutro to tell me why. I may be getting it mixed up with something else. Sorry if I am.
I've been careful about snake people. It's normally very easy to tell.


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## JennieLove

Yeah, you prob have food mixed up, and selling babies for higher prices will not attrack snake owners like steph had talked about. I hope that everything goes well, and keep up updated.


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## RainyDays

I just dont want to rauise the prices on people since I've already told them that they're for $3


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## Stephanie

$3 is way too low to sell the babies at. And like I said it is easy for snake people to lie about things. I volunteer for a rescue and you would be amazed at what snake people will say to get a rat cheap for their snakes.


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## RainyDays

Well what do I do them?
Tell them oh sorry but now the rats cost $10?


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## JennieLove

**** I would, say either take it or leave it...I want to make sure these rats are going to good homes and not feeders!


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## JennieLove

If they really wanted the rats as pets they would take the new deal


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## RainyDays

Well I'll attempt it
Gah
This boy that wants a rat is barely understandable at times with his typing
Apparently he can't pat $16 for two rats
I don't think this kid is getting any..


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## JennieLove

Well if he didnt even have enough money to buy the rats at that low of an amount, then he wouldnt have been able to take care of them.


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## RainyDays

He says his mom will buy their food and bedding


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## Stephanie

And what about emergency vet care? and what about a spay or neuter if needed? You need to make sure that his parents are willing to provide for everything imaginable. I would be talking to the parents if they are going to be the ones forking out the money. Make sure that they are in agreement that if anything happens where they need vet care they are willing to pay the bill.


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## RainyDays

Yes


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## RainyDays

So nutro isn't a very good dog food. A lady who owns a rescue in Alberta and is VERY knowledgeable and all won;t feed it to her animals.
She obviously doesn;t have rats though so it could be fine for them but not for dogs.


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## Stephanie

wait yes what?

And as far as the nutro goes there have been many discussions about it elsewhere and it has been determined to be one of the best dog foods to give a rat.


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## Kimmiekins

There's a "crap" version of Nutro you may be thinking of. Nutro Max, I believe it is. The "normal" Nutro's aren't high quality. The Ultra is. It's silly, but you have to compare ingredients and research. We used to feed our dogs Authority Natural Harvest Baked (we feed Wellness to all our animals now), but I'd NEVER touch the "normal" Authority... It's 100% crap. Don't get why companies do that, but they do. I've never used Nutro, but I do believe the Ultra is very much okay.

We use Wellness Senior. Innova Senior is a popular one for rats as well.

The biggest thing to look for, other then high-quality and GOOD ingredients, is low protein. Rats need lower protein then dogs, so you need to go with a dog food that's a senior or light version most of the time.


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## JennieLove

Yeah, I dont think you are looking at the correct food RainyDays.


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## mopydream44

http://www.nutroproducts.com/ncdry-sblite.shtml

this is the one that's good for rats correct?


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## JennieLove

Yeah, that one or the one that looks just like it, but has a bigger dog. I think the only difference was one 1 more % of something....I cant remember if it was crude fat or what, and then that one is the "small bites" of course for smaller gods. I have the one with the big dog on it, other than that its the same and it IS good food for rats and dogs.


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## dkirschling

I recently found homes for 23 baby rats. I did not charge. I posted on the forum, Cragslist, MySpace, and told all my friends and both my vets offices I was looking to re-home. I turned some folks down, a few I thought would not be good owners and one person that said he would take all of them. All the rats went to people who already had rats or had rats in the past. I have contacted several of the owners and I am confident that they are all in good homes.
Where there's a will, there's a way. You can for these rats before they have new homes. Of course, high quality food is the best, but HAVING food is what's most important. Of course, well ventilated cages are best, but in a pinch Rubbermaid containers and chicken wire will do. Post EVERYWHERE and tell everyone you are homing these rats. Just do your best for them and try not to get frustrated. 

D


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## trisnic

I have not read this entire thread but I signed up to this forum just to talk with you. Please, please make sure to seperate the male and female babies at 5 weeks old (I just read the thread and saw that you did, that is great).

Where do you live in BC?

I am in BC as well. I overheard someone talking about a situation just like this at my workplace a few weeks ago.

Also you may want to talk to SARS BC, their website is http://www.smallanimalrescue.org/ I know you said that you do not want to contact a rescue group but these people are great and they will screen the homes and have lots of contacts. It is easier to rehome a young rat then an older one.


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## mopydream44

> Yeah, that one or the one that looks just like it, but has a bigger dog. I think the only difference was one 1 more % of something....I cant remember if it was crude fat or what, and then that one is the "small bites" of course for smaller gods. I have the one with the big dog on it, other than that its the same and it IS good food for rats and dogs.


Good I was starting to get nervous that I had bought the wrong food even though I researched it when a member (you?) told me it was an alternative to Innova senior. I'm PARANOID!!!! I bought the larger bites the first time but they didn't have it when I went to the store, so I looked at the small bites and didn't notice any difference other than size but I might have missed the 1%

I think they like the small bites better than the large but if they're not as good I'll switch back! 



> RainyDays


 when I needed to switch food I researched a bunch of different foods, and I used Harlan Teklad to compare with. Nurto Natural Choice came the closest to the proper %'s but if you're really nervous about it you can try Wellness Senior as others recommended or you can go to an organic foods store and find a brand with the right %'s and ingredients. 

I was using Holistique Blendz for a while.


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## RainyDays

The foods must have been mixed up then...

I live in Langley.


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## mopydream44

no worries. 

I think you should try a few different brands with the right % anyhoo. I think it's good to switch things up for your ratties, so they don't grow tired of anything! 

I might give Wellness senior a shot next, if I can find it!


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## twilight

Good information everyone.  RainyDays~ I must admit I'm interested by your logic. Taking the rats to the SPCA is irresponsible (in your opinion) but letting them go as snake food is not?


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## chrisstrikeagain

"Unless I absolutely can't find good homes for the rats I won't be taking them to a shelter because that's irresponsible"
-Thats good to think that...because many dont care for rats as much as they need to be cared for.

I really hope you find them all good homes. I'm not bashin you by this comment, but your sister is really irresponsible about her rats...Why does she want them if she treats them like this? 

And it really sounds like your tryin to handle this with responsibilty...

Nutro isnt the best food for dogs...but its is a heck lot better than iams, eukenuba, beniful, and foods at the grocery store or walmart/. And i personally wouldnt feed ti to my dogs or rats, but i wouldnt say it is bad. its fine for them.


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## RainyDays

So I talked to my sister about her rats and she just doesn't listen and pretended like she gives them a lot of attention. Arg..

The mommy had a litter of 12 this afternoon. She's tired but doing well and enjoying her eggs.


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## JennieLove

Have you gotten Momma rat her new food? 

At this point its really not up to your sister, its something that your mom needs to deal with...your mom is the one paying for everything and if your sister is living in her household, then your mom has the last word. You need to talk to your mother about how much of a bad rat owner your sister is, and your mom needs to come to the fact that shes never going to change. It seems your sister is a bit out of control, and she thinks she can get away with it.


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## RainyDays

My mom hasn't gone grocery shopping yet so we're waiting until then. I've been mixing some of the stuff in with their food though that we already have. Such as oats, dog food, whole grain pasta, healthy cereal...
My sister is quite out of control. My mom just tries to choose her battles now.


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## Hippy

Congrats on the babies being born with no troubles.
If you want to make sure the mother is feeding the babies nice and healthy then you can check their bellies to see if you can see water drop size bands of white under their skin, seeing its so thin. Those are the milk bands, and if you see milk, you see a good mamma doing her thing.


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## RainyDays

When I changed her bedding from the bloody bedding to fresh bedding a while after she had fully given birth they seemed to all have milk bands. 

So I am having A LOT of trouble finding homes for rats. I have no clue what to do. I've asked everyone and messaged SO many random people on this website and no one seems to want any.


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## Stephanie

Where have you posted that you have babies available? How far are you willing to travel? Are there any rescues in your area that could do a courtesy posting for you? With Rattie Ratz we do couresy postings for people in your situation where they are willing to raise and foster the babies untill homes are found.


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## savveth

craigslist.com is a good place to advertise. Also, petfinder.com, I think you can do that but im not sure. ummm. Forums, just go all out and post in as many places as possible. =)


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## RainyDays

I've asked many people on a teenage web site that has tons of people on it everyday.
I've also advertised them on buysell, and petfinder. I'll try craigslist and I asked a shelter and haven't gotten a reply


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## chrisstrikeagain

If your goin on a teenage site, I'd scan the person extra careful. Most teens dont have money, get sick of the animal or mistreat them. I know teens who'd "smoke up their animals"...needless to say i am no longer talkin to them.


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## Matt

Im a teen...lol...I LOVE my animals. I wouldnt ever do ANYTHING to harm any of them.


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## chrisstrikeagain

I, by age(not maturity), am a "teen" as well. And i take excellent care of mine too. I also have exstensive experiene wit animals nad work at a pet store and inspire on bein a vet. You deal with rats thru your ways...So we have out ways of knowin proper care. Also, Matt, at first, you did things wrong at first, as did i. We learned from this forum. 

Not all teens are willin to come on here and learn proper care. I see it all the time.


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## taralyncouture

Amen to that. I'm a teen. and gosh if you read half of my posts someone has corrected almost everything i've done. =] But then agian i'm probably the youngest one. I am 15. but I have experience with animals,dog showing,natural animal lover, and such. =]
it kind of amazes me how snippy people can be regarding advice. if you're doing something wrong be thankful there are people more knowlegable to help you.


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## chrisstrikeagain

I see it at work, all the time, people cannot admit they did somethin wrong with their pets. its like tellin a mom shes takin care of hr kids wrong.

rainydays, if any of the takers are under 18, I'd require a parent present to ensure they are allowed to have rats. and make them take no less than two(unless they have rats).


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## trisnic

RainyDays if you are still looking for homes when this newest batch grows up email me. I should be able to take one girl. What do they look like by the way?


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## Matt

taralyncouture said:


> Amen to that. I'm a teen. and gosh if you read half of my posts someone has corrected almost everything i've done. =] But then agian i'm probably the youngest one. I am 15. but I have experience with animals,dog showing,natural animal lover, and such. =]
> it kind of amazes me how snippy people can be regarding advice. if you're doing something wrong be thankful there are people more knowlegable to help you.


Nope your not youngest. I am, Im turning 15 in a few months.

Also, I have Plenty of experience with animals seeing as 
1, We have the animal Buisness. 2, I have had animals since I was Born.
3, I come to a site like this and learn about the animal before I get it.


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## RainyDays

trisnic, where do you live? There is two champane, three black, three white with black hoods and stripes.

I made sure everyone would take proper care of the rats. The people I gave them to already had rats and wanted some more.

I asked a small animal shelter in my area to put up the rats for adoption and she has.


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## Mana

You should post in "Rats Needing Homes". Also, if you go to goosemoose.com to the Rats Rule forums, there's a section to post in for rats who need homes.


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## RainyDays

I did.

So today my sister wanted to give a rat to her friend that only wanted one when I already have a good home for both of the sisters(I want them to stay together). Her friend isn't forsure taking one either. She's been waiting two weeks. The girl I have is forsure coming to get them tomorrow. I told her I want them to go to the girl because she knows a lot about rats already and is going to give them a good home and I told her that the guy obviously doesn't know much at all about them since he wants only one. She also still thinks it's okay for rats to be alone. Then she started going on about how she knows a lot about rats and has more experience with them(she had ONE rat before I got any) and she didn't even know that rats can't live in cedar/pine shavings. She hasn't done ANY research and I've done a lot. She would also feed her rats unhealthy things. It's ridiculous.


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## twitch

it sounds like one of the moments where you just want to slap her and go bang your head off a wall for a while... 

so what happens with the girls? do they go to the home you lined up or is your sister going to make one go to the guy if he decides he wants one?


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## RainyDays

Well I think that they're going to the girl.


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## KimmiesGuineas

I hope so. Sneak them out and make it look like they got out or something, but they can't go to him. The girl is obviously a better home.


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## RainyDays

Definately.
She hasn't said anything about it to me since then so they'll be taken by the girl.


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