# Starving rat, in desperate need of help



## RattieLove* (May 1, 2013)

I really need some help and I've found lots of valuable information on this forum when I first became a rat owner so I'm hoping I can find some help once again.

One of my 3 rats has recently had a harsh drop in weight. She is just over a year old at this point, so it's not really from old age. It's gotten to the point that she is very literally just fur and bones. Her hips and ribs and spine stick out, she's like a feather to pick up and from what I've seen she moves rather lazily. She's not as active as she used to be. From what I can tell, I believe it has something to do with the pack. My other 2 rats are very healthy, in fact the youngest, my black berkshire who was an unexpected addition to the group, is rather fat, though not in a way that would endanger her health. I notice they pick on Ellie, the one who is starving, a lot more. It seems Kairi, the black berkshire who is also the fattest but rather small in size is more of the alpha in the group, then Noelle, who is Ellie's sister, comes after her in 'ranking', and Ellie seems to be the weak link/submissive one, if you will. I think the matter is that they've been depriving her of food, stealing it from her, etc. which is why she's gotten so thin.

To try and fix this, I've put her on her own in a spare cage, away from the other two. I went out and bought some fattening seed mix, a kind that markets itself by saying it has treats and food all in one which of course is a terrible idea for your rat's every day diet but in this case it seems perfect. I also bought Oxbow, which is what I typically would feed them except for my last run for pet food as it was sold out, I got them some brand of lab blocks instead, but I think both they and I prefer Oxbow, so they have that again. I also bought some seed block treats, and some baby food, and a water bottle to put in Ellie's separate cage. She's been in there on her own for the past few days with a bowl of seed mix, a bow of oxbow, and ample amounts of treats, but my main concern is that she isn't really eating, or if she is, it's very peckish. There's barely been a decrease in the water level of her bottle as well. Normally she'd be attacking seed mix and treats non stop. I try and feed her the baby food whenever she'll take it, something she used to go crazy for and eat table spoons at a time within seconds, but now she barely takes half a tablespoon.

When she's alone, she doesn't seem to want to eat. When she's with the other's it appears she has a better appetite but the problem is, the others won't let her eat. So I'm confused and pretty afraid because it looks like it's endangering her health and I have no idea what to do.

Does anyone have any advice at all? Are there any foods that will help fatten her up more that I haven't gotten yet? How can I get her to eat in the first place? Is there any way I can get the others to stop picking on her? I want to keep her separate until her weight is up but that's the biggest obstacle right now. getting her weight up. Any advice is appreciated, thank you guys so much.


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## Aeyna (Jun 16, 2014)

Honestly, if it was me, I would take her to the vet. There might be something internally wrong with her that has stopped her appetite, especially if when alone she still won't eat. If her body condition is already really bad, then it might be too late to try other things, but the vet might be able to give you something to get her health and weight back to a good level. Good luck, let us know what happens.


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## inod3 (Jun 13, 2014)

I'd 2nd that vet recommendation. 

Now that she's on her own, have you observed her eating at all? Will she eat scrambled eggs or soft noodles?


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## ratbasket (Apr 26, 2014)

You could try adding puppy or kitten Nutrical


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## RattieLove* (May 1, 2013)

The problem is that I'm a 16 year old high school student who's struggling to find a part time job. My parents don't exactly find a pet rat worth the price of a vet bill, which frustrates me endlessly. If I had the money I wouldn't hesitate, not for a second. She is worth it and more to me. However my older, adult sister understands my connection and love for her so she's volunteered to help me and get her to a vet. I've heard and seen amazing things about Greenwood Park Animal Hospital in Toronto, the doctor there deals with rats among other exotic pets all the time, he's done eye surgeries on rats, removed masses, among a whole host of other procedures and he is very reputable. I'm just hoping it doesn't surpass what we can afford...

As an update, I was bathing her just a few minutes ago because she really really needed it, and she is my calmest when it comes to bathing so it didn't stress her out thankfully. However, I find several scabs and cuts on her body, a large one on her back that stood out to me the most. This is affirming my suspicion that it's her cagemates bullying her into starvation and bullying her in general. Is it possible that this is some 'survival of the fittest' kind of thing? That once she got sick, they started picking on her? Or did they bully her into sickness? I'm not sure but I feel terrible about all of it...

Also, where can I find cat/dog nutri-cal? I looked it up and it seems like it would be a great help. Can I find it at pet stores? Or do I have to go to the vet? Please let me know, thanks guys.


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## cammipooh (Apr 26, 2014)

Nutrical is at the pet store.

Love, Cameron and Sneezes


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## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

that dramatic weight loss is normally a sign something is seriously up. If you cant get her to the vet i would by some human urine dipsticks (they cost about £10 here online), get ones that test for blood and protien levels. Test her urine and see if either are present, that will tell you how to treat her. Poriten means a kidney issue and you can use diet and calicum carbonate to treat that relatively well (though ideally a diuretic too). blood means a uti or pyo, both which needs antibiotics which you can get online in the states. Nothing means its either heart or cancer in all liklihood, one need ace inhibitors and diuretic, the other needs pain killers.

To be honest id put her on some childs ibuprofene suspension in the short term just in case shes in pain from something, this often goes from a decrease in eating


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## RattieLove* (May 1, 2013)

She will be going to the vet this Saturday. I'd like to get her there sooner but I have no choice, that's the soonest I can get.

In the meantime, I purchased some Nutri-Cal for cats like one user suggested. Does anyone know how much I should give her? I don't want to over do it. Please let me know ASAP.


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## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

if she is dangerously skinny id give her what she will eat, but if not a blob about 1/2" isnt a bad starting point.

Advocardo, bannana and coconut are also great fattening foods


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## RattieLove* (May 1, 2013)

I just want to say thank you for your help everyone, unfortunately this update isn't what I was hoping to come back with at all...

Ellie was taken to the vet this past Saturday. She was initially supposed to go the Saturday prior, on the 12th, but the vet became ill and my appointment was cancelled, so I was forced to wait an extra week. On the way to the vet, her condition worsened harshly. She couldn't hold herself up anymore and her breathing was heavily labored...when we got there and the receptionist saw her they immediately put her on oxygen. The vet came to me and said she was afraid to take her out of the incubator for the examination because she looked like she could die on her as soon as the oxygen was taken away.

I was hopeful and determined that once I got the medicine for her, she would be able to recover..I was just so sure, I didn't allow myself to think of any other options. Skip forward to being home, I gave her her dose of antibiotics, and was syringe feeding her as instructed since her breathing was so labored, she wouldn't eat as it would make it even more difficult to breathe. She was limp in my hands and on the table, at one point she stopped swallowing completely and the food was spilling from her mouth..When I was trying to clean her up she was still struggling to chew and I accidentally pushed my thumb into her mouth where she bit down hard, oddly enough I didn't feel it although the cut is very deep and I was bleeding heavily, I wasn't upset though, it was my mistake. I gave her her second dose before leaving home for the night, my close friend was having issues and needed me, but I couldn't stifle the guilt of leaving my sick baby at home the whole night, although I was convinced that the antibiotics would kick in and help her.

Painful story short..I came home to my sweet baby laying dead in her cage..I truly can't remember the last time I cried so long and hard. I'm still not fully grasping it. I can't explain it enough, Ellie was truly one of the sweetest rats you'd ever meet..she was one of those that would lick you non stop, showering you with kisses, and she was very affectionate..I can't really talk about it in depth without getting upset all over again. Soon I want to make her a post in the Rainbow Bridge section to honor her, because she deserves that and so much more..

I'm so sorry baby girl. I'm so sorry I wasn't there with you, I'm so sorry you had to suffer..

Thank you for your help everyone, I truly do appreciate it.


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## thenightgoddess (Apr 2, 2014)

I am sorry for your loss but for future reference
I would have either found another vet to take her to or at least an emergency vet because getting her meds even a week earlier might have changed the outcome. I thought my boy was close to death and wouldn't last the week but both baytril and doxy twice a day brought him back and it has been about a month sense then. He is old almost 3 years old and was gasping for breath most of the time now he is breathing a lot better and will be getting the meds till he finally passes.


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## katwoe (Jun 2, 2014)

I'm so sorry for your loss, I just lost one of mine yesterday as well. It's a heartbreaking experience. Take care.


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## Maddie (Jan 13, 2014)

thenightgoddess said:


> I am sorry for your loss but for future reference I would have either found another vet to take her to or at least an emergency vet because getting her meds even a week earlier might have changed the outcome. I thought my boy was close to death and wouldn't last the week but both baytril and doxy twice a day brought him back and it has been about a month sense then. He is old almost 3 years old and was gasping for breath most of the time now he is breathing a lot better and will be getting the meds till he finally passes.


I think hinting to someone after their pet has passed that they could have done better is a little tacky. The OP mentioned being younger and having the money and being able to go to the vet was an issue. An emergency vet wouldn't be an option for someone on a budget.I'm sorry for your loss dear, and anyone can see you loved your girl and really tried. Sorry things did not turn out well for you.


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## thenightgoddess (Apr 2, 2014)

Maddie said:


> I think hinting to someone after their pet has passed that they could have done better is a little tacky. The OP mentioned being younger and having the money and being able to go to the vet was an issue. An emergency vet wouldn't be an option for someone on a budget.I'm sorry for your loss dear, and anyone can see you loved your girl and really tried. Sorry things did not turn out well for you.


If she still owns rats it is something that needs to be said if she had the money for the one vet then they could have used that for a different vet that could have seen her right away.


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## Jaguar (Nov 15, 2009)

Unfortunately, antibiotics given orally take 4-5 days to build up to an effective level in the blood stream. It's why we stress getting them to the vet as quickly as possible - rats are very good at hiding symptoms of illness and by the time they're off eating and drinking, 4 or 5 days could be too long to wait. I would have suggested the vet give her an injection in this case, but even then, it might not have helped. You did the best you could though, and I'm sure she appreciated that. So sorry for your loss.


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## RattieLove* (May 1, 2013)

> I am sorry for your loss but for future reference
> I would have either found another vet to take her to or at least an emergency vet because getting her meds even a week earlier might have changed the outcome. I thought my boy was close to death and wouldn't last the week but both baytril and doxy twice a day brought him back and it has been about a month sense then. He is old almost 3 years old and was gasping for breath most of the time now he is breathing a lot better and will be getting the meds till he finally passes.


What you said is something I understand. Unfortunately, as I said I'm a 16 year old high school student, who cannot drive, is an amputee, is not employed, and had no means to get to the vet during the week. My sister is the one that took me, and paid the 230+ dollars bill from the vet, and she works until 7 every day except weekends, which here, at that time, all vets are closed, which is why my only option was the weekends. I couldn't afford or get to an emergency vet and quite frankly, after crying over this for days, and after all the 'if only's, I'd rather not have strangers reminding me even more what I could've done when I very well know. If it were up to me, and in my complete power, she would've been seen the moment she started losing weight.

To everyone else, thank you for the condolences. I really truly appreciate it. The only thing that's helping me not burst into tears over this each time I think of it is that I know for a fact that a majority of rat owners (of course not the lovely people on here, but ones who are uneducated in rat care) don't even think rats are worth the money for quality food, or the right size cage, but my girl, she was treated like a princess. She was taken to the vet when I know, again, a large majority of people don't think rats are worth that. Those people are deadly wrong, and I pity them. Rats are just as precious as cats and dogs and any other beloved pet. It's the bond that makes the value in a pet, not their price tag in a pet store. She was sweet, and she deserved even better. I know that. And I won't forgive myself for not being able to maybe save her sooner. But I am not a bad owner and I know she knew that.


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