# Soon to be Sort of Owner to a New Puppy!



## Fraido

Soooo! My dad and I went to choose a puppy and put a deposit down on Monday... SUPER excited! 
I don't live with my dad, but I'm going to play a major role in this puppy's life, so that's why I say I'll be sort of an owner.. 
He's an Akita and will be ready to go mid-April.


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## RatAtat2693

Absolutely adorable. Just make sure to get training and socialization started as soon as he gets home. Akitas are great dogs if you raise them correctly. But they're also the Japanese version of a pit bull, and any untrained dog is no fun. 

Any ideas for names?


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## Fraido

RatAtat2693 said:


> Absolutely adorable. Just make sure to get training and socialization started as soon as he gets home. Akitas are great dogs if you raise them correctly. But they're also the Japanese version of a pit bull, and any untrained dog is no fun.
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> Any ideas for names?


Yeah I've been reading a lot about them, and I worry my dad is not ready for this kind of dog, in my opinion he doesn't have the time to properly train the dog, so I've been on a dog forum and reading up as much as I can so I can be fully prepared. I technically work with my dad, as I'm just finishing up highschool right now and doing a four period coop at his work (I was there before him, I pretty much got him this job!), and I'm hoping the boss guy will let my dad bring the puppy with him to work so I can have him on my watch while my dad is working, that way I can take him outside to potty and work on some training throughout the day... this isn't your typical workplace, by the way, lol. It's a feeder breeder place, producing and distributing rodents and insects, it's a pretty grungy place, and I'm glad I don't work with any of the rodents. I work with reptiles! .... Ahem.... My point being that having a puppy there may very well not be a big deal, plus I'm free labor anyways, hahah.

Come June, I'll be living two minutes away from my dad and I'll be with that dog every minute I can spare when my dad is at work, taking it all around, getting used to new things, meeting new people and dogs. I know with Akitas they often don't get on well with strangers, even with training, but I am confident I can at least get this puppy desensitized to being around people. I don't like people either... So I dont mind telling people no when they want to pet him. Lol

It's nice that someone here is familiar with the breed! (It seems.) There have been many names suggested, like, a lot. I personally want to call him Shadowfax, as I love LotR. My dad pretty much dissed that though, because he's not a black dog... The name wouldn't work if he WAS a black dog! Sheesh, I thought he would remember Shadowfax. So he's thinking something Godly, like Zeus or Odin, well I suggested Zeus. He asked about different names from InuYasha, an anime we share a liking for. So I started naming off characters from that, and he really likes Koga, the name means Steel Fang, and Koga is a leader of a wolf tribe in the series. He really likes that name, and nobody has suggested anything since then, but he insists that he won't know until he has the little guy. 

My tops names are Shadowfax, Koga, Cujo, and Zeus. I really like them...


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## Fraido

I'm very impatient..... lol. I've had intense puppy fever since he told me he had the opportunity to get an Akita puppy. I wanted him to choose this little girl, though. She was the smallest pup there, and she gave me stinky puppy kisses so I was attached, and he did originally say we'd take her! We were just about done, and gave the deposit money, and at the last minute my boyfriend says.. I really like the white guy.. and my dad agreed, and I had to be all like, well I mean this is your dog if you really want the white guy then get him... so he switched last minute. ?


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## RatAtat2693

That stinks. And man, InuYasha. I haven't thought of that show in years, lol. (I used to have the biggest fan girl crush on Sesshoumaru in middle school. ) I'm partial to the Norse names, so Odin wins in my book. 

And yeah, I trained dogs before I trained people, and I trained people before I trained rats. (You'd be surprised how much overlap there is between the three.) Make sure pup gets to the puppy classes at a good trainer. (I always recommend anyone from Victoria Stillwell, since they focus on positive training.) Akitas are a lot of dog to handle and not good for the beginner. (It'd be like giving me, a completely inexperienced herp, a Fer-de-Lance.) Message me if you want help. I'll do what I can. 

I like the idea of bringing the puppy to work since it offers plenty of time to socialize, but since it's in a feeder shop, I would worry about his prey drive kicking in and killing some of the, um, merchandise. I'd also worry about any potential diseases that could be transmitted, though if he gets his boosters, it might not be as bad. 

Just remember that whatever you do, be firm and maintain consistency. Avoid trainers that use the term "alpha" or spout pack theory. Akitas, like many spitz-type breeds, are intelligent. You can't mess with them like a Golden Retriever, and you need to keep that brain ticking round the clock. It doesn't end well otherwise. (When I got my first husky mix, I lost two couches to boredom.) And try as much as you can to get your father to train him. The person who trains the dog owns the dog. This is especially true with an independent breed.

Good luck, and keep me updated.


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## Gribouilli

Unless your dad invest thousands in training, this isn't going to end well. My aunt had a neighbor with an Akita, worst dog ever if not properly trained. Very aggressive to stranger and other pets. Your dad need to go to training with him and be super firm because Akita are independent and strong willed, not to mention powerful. Does your dad has any experience with that kind of dogs?


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## RatAtat2693

Gribouilli said:


> Unless your dad invest thousands in training, this isn't going to end well. My aunt had a neighbor with an Akita, worst dog ever if not properly trained. Very aggressive to stranger and other pets. Your dad need to go to training with him and be super firm because Akita are independent and strong willed, not to mention powerful. Does your dad has any experience with that kind of dogs?


It could always be worse, lol. They could have gotten a Caucasian Ovcharka


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## Gribouilli

RatAtat2693 said:


> It could always be worse, lol. They could have gotten a Caucasian Ovcharka


I had to google it. Jeez, that dog could probably kill a bear. I saw a documentary about a prison in the middle of nowhere Russia, and those dogs were kept as guard dogs- they can tear a man to pieces under a minute. I didn't remember how they were called though.


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## Fraido

RatAtat2693 said:


> That stinks. And man, InuYasha. I haven't thought of that show in years, lol. (I used to have the biggest fan girl crush on Sesshoumaru in middle school.
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> ) I'm partial to the Norse names, so Odin wins in my book.
> 
> And yeah, I trained dogs before I trained people, and I trained people before I trained rats. (You'd be surprised how much overlap there is between the three.) Make sure pup gets to the puppy classes at a good trainer. (I always recommend anyone from Victoria Stillwell, since they focus on positive training.) Akitas are a lot of dog to handle and not good for the beginner. (It'd be like giving me, a completely inexperienced herp, a Fer-de-Lance.) Message me if you want help. I'll do what I can.
> 
> I like the idea of bringing the puppy to work since it offers plenty of time to socialize, but since it's in a feeder shop, I would worry about his prey drive kicking in and killing some of the, um, merchandise. I'd also worry about any potential diseases that could be transmitted, though if he gets his boosters, it might not be as bad.
> 
> Just remember that whatever you do, be firm and maintain consistency. Avoid trainers that use the term "alpha" or spout pack theory. Akitas, like many spitz-type breeds, are intelligent. You can't mess with them like a Golden Retriever, and you need to keep that brain ticking round the clock. It doesn't end well otherwise. (When I got my first husky mix, I lost two couches to boredom.) And try as much as you can to get your father to train him. The person who trains the dog owns the dog. This is especially true with an independent breed.
> 
> Good luck, and keep me updated.


Lol, yeah my boyfriend likes Odin as well.

I will definitely shoot you a message if I've got a question, or perhaps I can just ask here and others may get to benefit from your knowledge? ?

If he comes to work with my dad, he will likely be in a mouse room until I arrive at 9, as my dad is the designated mouse guy, and the pup shouldn't end up having any actual access to the mice. Once I'm there, he'll probably be in the reptile room with me, and I'm certainly smart enough to keep him away from all snakes and the like! Diseases could be a possible issue, but he will always be up to date on shots, so it shouldn't be an issue.

I'm concerned, that since my dad works nine hours a day, from 6-3, he won't have the time or energy to train the dog properly. Someone on the dog forum suggested having multiple people working on training, I believe they mean everybody in the household should be taking part in training as to make sure that the dog realizes that people are above him. From what I've read, leadership is incredibly important, and of course I don't mean going all alpha-mode on him and mandhandling him, just confident and firm. I think I would have more time to spend properly training than my dad would.

My dad has a Siberian husky, she's three right now. She's a good girl and thankfully doesn't really chew anything she shouldn't. 

So, confident, firm, and consistent training is a must with these dogs. I'll highly recommend quality puppy classes to my dad, but me being the kid means what he says goes.

I will keep this thread up to date with photos and training and everything!


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## Fraido

Gribouilli said:


> Unless your dad invest thousands in training, this isn't going to end well. My aunt had a neighbor with an Akita, worst dog ever if not properly trained. Very aggressive to stranger and other pets. Your dad need to go to training with him and be super firm because Akita are independent and strong willed, not to mention powerful. Does your dad has any experience with that kind of dogs?


I don't necessarily think all is lost if he doesn't invest thousands into training. But I do understand why it is a highly recommended suggestion.

He's never had an Akita before, he's got a husky and a bulldog/boxer mix right now, and has owned GS's in the past. Luckily he is friends with the people who he's getting the puppy off of so he can go to them for questions and suggestions. Their dogs are well trained, and I do believe they trained them themselves.


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## InuLing

Lol Rhodesian Ridgebacks can be a lot of trouble too. Big, big thing with multiple people training him is you'll need to sit down and decide on rules and boundaries before you start training. Very important. My parents didn't and my dad felt that my mom and I were being too strict on his own so he stopped enforcing boundaries and rules, like dog not sitting at the side of the table when we eat. (He's big enough to swipe food just by turning his head when sitting next to you. I've lost food more than once.) This led to dog learning that every rule can be broken in different circumstances and we ended up forced to dog-proof the house and invest in sturdy dog gates... And when he got into something and ended up sick I was the one who got to clean up since I was home first. It all started when a single person decided to not enforce rules.


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## Fraido

InuLing said:


> Lol Rhodesian Ridgebacks can be a lot of trouble too. Big, big thing with multiple people training him is you'll need to sit down and decide on rules and boundaries before you start training. Very important. My parents didn't and my dad felt that my mom and I were being too strict on his own so he stopped enforcing boundaries and rules, like dog not sitting at the side of the table when we eat. (He's big enough to swipe food just by turning his head when sitting next to you. I've lost food more than once.) This led to dog learning that every rule can be broken in different circumstances and we ended up forced to dog-proof the house and invest in sturdy dog gates... And when he got into something and ended up sick I was the one who got to clean up since I was home first. It all started when a single person decided to not enforce rules.


Yeah, that is something I was going to say when I was talking about multiple people training. It's all got to be the same, and you all have to be enforcing rules. With rules, my dad and I pretty much always agree on them, it's the different commands that we often don't. He read somewhere that you can't use down to get off of things, or when they're jumping up, etc. if you're going to say "lay down" to lie down. Apparently it's too confusing for the dog? Never ever had a dog struggle with that. So, when we got Miikaah (husky), he wanted "ground" for laying down, "down" for getting off of stuff, and "off" for getting her to drop something. That way she wouldn't get confused between "down" and "lay down". I never liked it all, and some commands have changed. With this dog I'm going to have to make sure I do what he chooses, and that he also doesn't try changing anything a few months down the road.


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## InuLing

I know someone who taught "lay" for lay down and "down" to get off things and "off" when he jumped on someone


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## artgecko

I don't have any personal experience with them, but my aunt was a professional dog handler and had a handler friend who showed akita's. He left one of the akitas with his daughter during a show and it mauled her pretty badly (this only took minutes to happen). My aunt said that thyroid problems can run in this breed and that was what caused this otherwise well trained show dog to turn on the daughter. 

I don't know if they do testing for thyroid on dogs regularly, but might be worth asking. If he is buying from a good breeder, they should also have done testing on hips, etc. 

Akitas are great looking dogs, but too much dog for me. 

Good luck to you and your dad... It'll be a lot of work, but Akitas can be great dogs when properly trained / handled.


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## Fraido

I've just always known dogs who were taught "lay down" and "down" and they always knew what was meant even though both commands contained the word "down", so I prefer to do it that way.
I've confirmed now that my dad uses "off" to make the dogs stop jumping up, and to get them off furniture, and to stop play biting. Which personally confuses me because how is using "off" for three different things any less confusing than using "down" and "lay down" for two different* commands.


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## Fraido

artgecko said:


> I don't have any personal experience with them, but my aunt was a professional dog handler and had a handler friend who showed akita's. He left one of the akitas with his daughter during a show and it mauled her pretty badly (this only took minutes to happen). My aunt said that thyroid problems can run in this breed and that was what caused this otherwise well trained show dog to turn on the daughter.
> 
> I don't know if they do testing for thyroid on dogs regularly, but might be worth asking. If he is buying from a good breeder, they should also have done testing on hips, etc.
> 
> Akitas are great looking dogs, but too much dog for me.
> 
> Good luck to you and your dad... It'll be a lot of work, but Akitas can be great dogs when properly trained / handled.


That definitely is not any good, I will ask about that.

Thanks, though! We'll be trying very hard to properly train and handle this guy.

I don't mind a dog that I have to be cautious with around people and other animals. That's just the way a lot of these guys are, so we'll just make sure we do our best to avoid any situations that may trigger any sort of aggression.

I don't know if I mentioned this in another post, but I'm currently learning from this website; akita-dog.com It seems very informative, although there are quite a few typos every now and then, I try not to judge people on that though.


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## Fraido

Updated photos! Already looking way less fluffy! Holy smokes, he looks like a polar bear. Haha My dad will be picking him up on April 4th, so excited! My dad is giving me the task of asking the Boss about him being there *sigh* he says I seem to always get what I want at that place! So I shall be asking him about that on Tuesday, and hopefully he'll be okay with it, it would only be until June, then I'll be out of school and able to watch him all day while my dad works.. I am very much looking forward to that. Unfortunately I'm unable to get into town for the first two weeks my dad will have him. (My dad lives in the city, but works in the smaller town I live in, about 25-30min away.) I was so hoping to be able to go with him to pick him up and everything.. darn it. 

Another thing that would be good about bringing him to work would be the fact that he's become accustomed to car rides.


And there's a photo of Miikaah, when I took her out and about today! ?


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## Fraido

The one image didn't upload. :z


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## RatAtat2693

You could also invest in doggie daycare since it's a young pup. Might do it a little good, though you have to be careful about where you pick and whether or not pup can handle it. They might be able to continue your training, depending on what's available. And if you can handle a husky, you won't have much more of a learning curve on the Akita. Just remember that the Akita has a much slimmer margin of error. And I agree on the thyroid issues. It happens in pit bulls as well, though very few attacks I've ever heard of were unprovoked.


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## Fraido

Yeah, I wondered if Puppy classes at the Local PetSmart would be beneficial, at the least, if that's all we've really got here? I'll have to do research on the trainers around here, I looked up trainers under that Victoria Stilwell lady and the closest trainer was in Detroit, which is not only across the border but hours away. Aside from that, we've not really searched for trainers before, my dad says that most trainers won't even work with a husky because they're so stubborn, so they obviously wouldn't work with an Akita. I obviously don't believe that or agree with that in any way, a good trainer will work with your puppy regardless. I don't think he ever even tried to find a trainer for our husky, so he really has no idea and I'm pretty sure he just read that online and decided he'd believe it. That's what's really frustrating about my dad, if I get advice off a forum and offer it to him, he gets all rude and says that everybody has a different opinion and questions that person's expertise. "Are they a professional trainer? No." Or if I find information online which, heaven forbid, contradicts what he has read I'm obviously the wrong one and I "can't believe everything I read online." He forms an opinion on a subject and when presented with information to the contrary, he gets all rude and defensive and tries to find some kind of "You know what, yadda yadda yadda" to go with it.

Another difference though is that huskies aren't often an aggressive, guard dog like an Akita, and we ended up slacking on Miikaah's training so she's not this great well trained dog, she's a good dog, and the slacking in training in no way caused her to think she's the boss and get aggressive in any way. An Akita needs the training consistent, clear, and kept up with always, because of that dominant trait. So that will be the main thing, we slacked with our husky but we can never do that with the Akita.


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## RatAtat2693

Fraido said:


> That's what's really frustrating about my dad, if I get advice off a forum and offer it to him, he gets all rude and says that everybody has a different opinion and questions that person's expertise. "Are they a professional trainer? No."


Well dear, I chuckled at this one because A) there are no nationally recognized requirements to be a "professional dog trainer" and B) with over 15 years of experience with almost every breed and mutt under the sun (and the client references to back it up), I feel it's safe to say that I am at least somewhat proficient in my field. I might even dare to call myself professional. I started studying at age seven, and started training local show dogs at ten. By twelve, I was the kid you called when you couldn't afford a vet or a trainer. But I hate bragging, so let's move on.

Petsmart/Petco/Big Chain Store Training is a sh*t-shot. You either end up with a decent trainer, or you end up with a dead dog.
http://www.examiner.com/article/english-bulldog-dies-during-training-class-at-petco
If there's ever a reason I got serious about training and grooming my own dogs, it was the horror stories I heard about big chain stores. (Plus the money I save on classes is amazing. More rat toys anyone?  )

Huskies are smart and high strung, capable of out-witting some people I know. BUT if your trainer refuses to work with a husky, you've found yourself either a pansy/dumber than a dog or a fraud and should move on. (Most likely it's the latter.) The majority of huskies I've met are total goof balls (including my mix), and while they can be a little - erm - mouthy, they're usually harmless. The only reason I would ever not work with a dog is if it posed an immediate threat to my or another person's life (other dogs included). OR if the owner is an unteachable jerk.

From the looks of it, your best bet might be to ask the breeder how he trained his dogs and see if he'll let you come over and start working with your puppy. Check out Petsmart, but, like I said, be careful. Try to sit in on a class and just watch. If the trainer uses prong collars or choke chains or an electric collar, leave immediately. If they try selling you a million items, just pass. If anyone hits or kicks a dog, or advocates yelling angrily at the pup, leave immediately. If they "alpha-roll" a dog or pin it or hang it, again, leave immediately.

I'm guessing you got the version that hits 100 lbs? Put it this way: if you don't think it's a good idea to do it with a hundred pounds of muscle, then don't do it with your puppy. Do you want to have to alpha roll, pin, hang, or potentially provoke a hundred pounds of muscle and teeth? I sure don't. 

I had a client who played with her Golden Retriever pup by letting him bite onto her knuckles and then swinging him around. He was only ten pounds of fluff. I saw the puppy video when I was called, and, yeah, it was adorable. But that's not why I was there. I was called because flash-forward 18 months, and this now seventy pound fluff ball was trying to grab onto his owner's arm with a full set of teeth. He'd get frustrated when mom wouldn't let him, so he'd nip at her fingers and bark. Then she'd freak out and exacerbate the problem by screaming. If I wasn't in my professional mode, I'd have broken down laughing at the train wreck that was unfolding.

Anyway, even if you can't find a good trainer in the immediate area, you can still read up on Victoria's site. It's a good jumping point, and she even has a YouTube channel so you can watch what she's doing. Just stay clear of Cesar Milan and his comrades. He has some good ideas, but he's also known for some, uh, questionable antics that are hard to discern if you don't know what you're looking for. Plus he'll try to sell you some quiet walk easy collar contraption that's really just a choke collar on stilts. The only thing an able-bodied person should need to walk the average dog is a flat collar/harness and a good strong lead.

Wish I could be more help, but training is one of those things that's best done in person.


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## Fraido

RatAtat2693 said:


> Fraido said:
> 
> 
> 
> That's what's really frustrating about my dad, if I get advice off a forum and offer it to him, he gets all rude and says that everybody has a different opinion and questions that person's expertise. "Are they a professional trainer? No."
> 
> 
> 
> Well dear, I chuckled at this one because A) there are no nationally recognized requirements to be a "professional dog trainer" and B) with over 15 years of experience with almost every breed and mutt under the sun (and the client references to back it up), I feel it's safe to say that I am at least somewhat proficient in my field. I might even dare to call myself professional. I started studying at age seven, and started training local show dogs at ten. By twelve, I was the kid you called when you couldn't afford a vet or a trainer. But I hate bragging, so let's move on.
> 
> Petsmart/Petco/Big Chain Store Training is a sh*t-shot. You either end up with a decent trainer, or you end up with a dead dog.
> http://www.examiner.com/article/english-bulldog-dies-during-training-class-at-petco
> If there's ever a reason I got serious about training and grooming my own dogs, it was the horror stories I heard about big chain stores. (Plus the money I save on classes is amazing. More rat toys anyone?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> )
> 
> Huskies are smart and high strung, capable of out-witting some people I know. BUT if your trainer refuses to work with a husky, you've found yourself either a pansy/dumber than a dog or a fraud and should move on. (Most likely it's the latter.) The majority of huskies I've met are total goof balls (including my mix), and while they can be a little - erm - mouthy, they're usually harmless. The only reason I would ever not work with a dog is if it posed an immediate threat to my or another person's life (other dogs included). OR if the owner is an unteachable jerk.
> 
> From the looks of it, your best bet might be to ask the breeder how he trained his dogs and see if he'll let you come over and start working with your puppy. Check out Petsmart, but, like I said, be careful. Try to sit in on a class and just watch. If the trainer uses prong collars or choke chains or an electric collar, leave immediately. If they try selling you a million items, just pass. If anyone hits or kicks a dog, or advocates yelling angrily at the pup, leave immediately. If they "alpha-roll" a dog or pin it or hang it, again, leave immediately.
> 
> I'm guessing you got the version that hits 100 lbs? Put it this way: if you don't think it's a good idea to do it with a hundred pounds of muscle, then don't do it with your puppy. Do you want to have to alpha roll, pin, hang, or potentially provoke a hundred pounds of muscle and teeth? I sure don't.
> 
> I had a client who played with her Golden Retriever pup by letting him bite onto her knuckles and then swinging him around. He was only ten pounds of fluff. I saw the puppy video when I was called, and, yeah, it was adorable. But that's not why I was there. I was called because flash-forward 18 months, and this now seventy pound fluff ball was trying to grab onto his owner's arm with a full set of teeth. He'd get frustrated when mom wouldn't let him, so he'd nip at her fingers and bark. Then she'd freak out and exacerbate the problem by screaming. If I wasn't in my professional mode, I'd have broken down laughing at the train wreck that was unfolding.
> 
> Anyway, even if you can't find a good trainer in the immediate area, you can still read up on Victoria's site. It's a good jumping point, and she even has a YouTube channel so you can watch what she's doing. Just stay clear of Cesar Milan and his comrades. He has some good ideas, but he's also known for some, uh, questionable antics that are hard to discern if you don't know what you're looking for. Plus he'll try to sell you some quiet walk easy collar contraption that's really just a choke collar on stilts. The only thing an able-bodied person should need to walk the average dog is a flat collar/harness and a good strong lead.
> 
> Wish I could be more help, but training is one of those things that's best done in person.
Click to expand...

Ahh, lol. We will just avoid PetSmart classes, seems like a gamble. 

You are certainly quite knowledgeable, it definitely shows, and have been incredibly helpful thus far. I will search up trainers in my area, and I'll start checking out Victoria's channel and reading up on her website. I've been reading a lot of this webstite; http://www.akita-dog.com/site/b11c6...ww.akita-dog.com/Akita_Dog_Training.html#2589


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## RatAtat2693

Thanks, I would hope so after all this time. ;-p 

It's not a bad page. (I didn't read the entire site - don't have the time, but I'm guessing it talks about establishing dominance and goes on about being pack leader.) All of the instructions are quite clear and follow good form. The only thing that irked me was it instructing you to stand on the leash if he won't stay down. It's nowhere near the "leave immediately" zone, but it still makes me cringe. Of course other things that make me cringe are taunting the dog, physical manipulation, and pack theory, but it's more like a, "Still? Really?" than a, "Everybody jump ship! The Captain's finally lost it."

Pack theory is super outdated, and anyone who has really watched a wolf or dog pack will notice that the whole pack order is pretty relaxed. And physical manipulation makes it so that the dog relies on the manipulation as part of the cue/command. Additionally, if any of your other dogs know these commands, bring them in to the training session and have them do it with pup. Just like with people, dogs watch and learn.
http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/14_12/features/Alpha-Dogs_20416-1.html


Start holding the down position at short intervals. (For staying.) You can determine your starting time by just seeing how long he holds it on his own. Subtract 2 seconds from this starting time and reward him then. Use your best judgement, but after doing this consistently about 3-4 times, increase the duration between rewards by about 3-5 seconds. Keep going until he holds it as long as you like.

This works best if you do some research on Impulse Control. 

If you catch him going into a laying position on his own while out of training, tell him to lay down. And once he's down (followed your command), toss him a treat/toy or whatever motivates him. Same works for sit or any other behavior you're working on. Training never stops - only slows. Even when my husky isn't pulling on harness, I'm still giving him the left and right commands while we go walking.

If he's not interested in the reward, you need a better reward. For starting off, I like to take a cheap hotdog and slice it up in dime size intervals, then microwave it until they get puffy and crispy. Freeze them to cool them off, and voilà, easy cheap high-value treats. It's how I sled-trained my husky.

The reason I stress the positivity while training potentially aggressive breeds is because many people gets these breeds to be macho. Not saying that's you or your father, but it's true. While you might think that an "aggressive breed" would need a heavier hand, really they just need a more consistent one and one that can outwit them. I can usually tell a client's maturity level during consultation when I ask them to show me how they lead their dog.

You also save yourself a lot of physical work by not having to later shove around a gigantic dog. Take advantage of his current size. It's easier to correct leash pulling now than when he's a solid slab of muscle. Brains beats brawn when it comes to training anyone. (Including humans.)

Anyway, here's the picture I give my clients when explaining being a "pack leader". (Milan ruined that term for me. Lol.) Just don't be bossy. Even the musher who is driving a team of dogs (6-18) pushes the sled and listens to his/her lead dog.


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## Fraido

RatAtat2693 said:


> Thanks, I would hope so after all this time. ;-p
> 
> It's not a bad page. (I didn't read the entire site - don't have the time, but I'm guessing it talks about establishing dominance and goes on about being pack leader.) All of the instructions are quite clear and follow good form. The only thing that irked me was it instructing you to stand on the leash if he won't stay down. It's nowhere near the "leave immediately" zone, but it still makes me cringe. Of course other things that make me cringe are taunting the dog, physical manipulation, and pack theory, but it's more like a, "Still? Really?" than a, "Everybody jump ship! The Captain's finally lost it."
> 
> Pack theory is super outdated, and anyone who has really watched a wolf or dog pack will notice that the whole pack order is pretty relaxed. And physical manipulation makes it so that the dog relies on the manipulation as part of the cue/command. Additionally, if any of your other dogs know these commands, bring them in to the training session and have them do it with pup. Just like with people, dogs watch and learn.
> http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues/14_12/features/Alpha-Dogs_20416-1.html
> 
> 
> Start holding the down position at short intervals. (For staying.) You can determine your starting time by just seeing how long he holds it on his own. Subtract 2 seconds from this starting time and reward him then. Use your best judgement, but after doing this consistently about 3-4 times, increase the duration between rewards by about 3-5 seconds. Keep going until he holds it as long as you like.
> 
> This works best if you do some research on Impulse Control.
> 
> If you catch him going into a laying position on his own while out of training, tell him to lay down. And once he's down (followed your command), toss him a treat/toy or whatever motivates him. Same works for sit or any other behavior you're working on. Training never stops - only slows. Even when my husky isn't pulling on harness, I'm still giving him the left and right commands while we go walking.
> 
> If he's not interested in the reward, you need a better reward. For starting off, I like to take a cheap hotdog and slice it up in dime size intervals, then microwave it until they get puffy and crispy. Freeze them to cool them off, and voilà, easy cheap high-value treats. It's how I sled-trained my husky.
> 
> The reason I stress the positivity while training potentially aggressive breeds is because many people gets these breeds to be macho. Not saying that's you or your father, but it's true. While you might think that an "aggressive breed" would need a heavier hand, really they just need a more consistent one and one that can outwit them. I can usually tell a client's maturity level during consultation when I ask them to show me how they lead their dog.
> 
> You also save yourself a lot of physical work by not having to later shove around a gigantic dog. Take advantage of his current size. It's easier to correct leash pulling now than when he's a solid slab of muscle. Brains beats brawn when it comes to training anyone. (Including humans.)
> 
> Anyway, here's the picture I give my clients when explaining being a "pack leader". (Milan ruined that term for me. Lol.) Just don't be bossy. Even the musher who is driving a team of dogs (6-1
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> pushes the sled and listens to his/her lead dog.


I never noticed it saying to step on the leash, I must have missed it when I was skimming. From what I've read, there actually isn't any sort of dominate your dog sort of suggestions, I have not come across anything that even implies putting your hands on the dog or getting mean. The only thing that I noticed was when the puppy nips to hold his mouth shut and say no, and then I believe ignore him.

I plan to take Miikaah and the puppy to a local park often and train a bit there, Miikaah may not be the perfect dog to learn from but she is good for the simple commands and it will get me more motivated to work on Miikaah as well. 
I understand the positive thing completely. The Akitas are also so sensitive, you get too rough and he might take it out on you or just lose all respect and never listen.

Thank you again for all the tips.?


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## Fraido

Got a solid "I'll have to think about it" from the bossman. Feeling hopeful!


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## RatAtat2693

Fraido said:


> Got a solid "I'll have to think about it" from the bossman. Feeling hopeful!


Awesome, I hope he means it. 

Oh, and instead of grabbing the jaw, you just tell them "No" and give them a toy instead.


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## Fraido

Sorry I never saw your response!

The website I was reading mentioned never to let the puppy get away from touch. So if he were to nip you because you are trying to teach him it is okay to be touched on his face (for example) for like, teeth inspection, would it not be a bad idea to reward him with a toy? It makes sense if he is trying to play and nips, though.


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## RatAtat2693

Sorry if it was confusing. This is where training gets a little more complex. 

This isn?t rewarding, it's redirection. We do it with toddlers as well. If your toddler starts drawing all over the walls, instead of just yelling, "DON'T DO THAT! YOU'RE RUINING THE WALLS!" You tell them "No" and then take them to a place that they can draw all over, like a chalkboard or large paper pad.

So if puppy tries knowing on your fingers, you tell him No, and then give him something to knaw on instead. It's easier to tell someone, including your dog, what they're *supposed* to do than to tell them what they aren't. 

Anything they do something you don't want them to do, tell them what you want them to do instead. "Sit" is my personal favorite, and my one dog does it from a mile away. 

In the case of a dental check up, you still don't want to grab onto his jaw. Doing so will most likely make him unwilling to let you in his mouth. (Think face-shy.) Generally speaking, however, most of the dogs I know will let their owner, the one they are most comfortable with, stick their hands pretty much anywhere. The key is to start doing it while they're pups. On few occasions growing up, we had "oops" litters of puppies. The first thing I did when they hit 2-3 weeks old was start pulling on anything and everything. I grabbed their tails, tugged their ears, held their paws, put my fingers in their mouths, and continued doing so well into adulthood. I can still pull on my dog's tail without retaliation. While I wouldn't advocate for it, it's saved his butt on a number of occasions since his tail works as a nice handle. (Again, NOT something I would recommend, but between pulling his tail and him getting hit by a car, I'd rather yank his fur.)


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## Fraido

Okay. I didn't mean like, grabbing his jaw, just meant playing around with his lips to look at his teeth and stuff. I see what you mean though!


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## RatAtat2693

Fraido said:


> Okay. I didn't mean like, grabbing his jaw, just meant playing around with his lips to look at his teeth and stuff. I see what you mean though!


Oh, sorry. There's this technique a lot of people use(d) where, if the puppy nipped you, you would shove your finger in his mouth and then grab his bottom jaw until he squealed.


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## Fraido

All good! Just clarifying I wouldn't just grab is jaw and pry it open, lol. I think I've seen someone do that before, though they were just messing with their dog and did it because they won't close their mouths when you do it?


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## Fraido

Here he is this weekend!


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## RatAtat2693

Now I want a puppy.

He's too cute.


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## Fraido

I have some mad puppy fever going on because of him. Can't wait until the day I can get my very own puppy! My dad is supposed to be picking him up on the fourth of April or the following Thursday, super excited. Gonna talk to the boss man at the end of next week and see if he thought about him being there.


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## Fraido

What a shame, the bossman said no. :c


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## Gribouilli

Fraido said:


> What a shame, the bossman said no. :c


I know you are disappointed, but any puppy, even more so an Akita in a warehouse full of feeder rats and other small animals was a disaster about to happen. Akitas have a quite strong hunting instinct, and are well known for not being good around cats and small animals. It is probably better that way.


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## Fraido

He wouldn't have actually been around the animals here. Oh well.


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## Gribouilli

Yes in theory. But soon or later he would have escaped, unless of course you would have kept him in a crate which wouldn't have done him any good as far as socialization goes anyway. There are diseases that a dog can pass on to rodents that are deadly to them. Also you need to understand that if your boss would have said yes to you, he would have had to say yes to everyone else wanting to bring their pets with them to work. Those are probably some of the reasons your boss said no. Did your boss said you why he didn't want you to bring your puppy to work?


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## Fraido

It would have been fine. I don't know his exact reasons, "Nah we can't have a dog runnin' around the place." He knows he would be confined to one room, so that was kind of a joke reason. I'm not going to argue with my supervisor, though, so whatever the reasons are don't really matter.
Trust me, these rats probably have all kinds of issues already. It's not a pleasant place for them here, that's why I don't work with them, there is really no care for the general well being of the rats, and when a rat gets loose there are many different ways the people here deal with them, none of them good. I'm not going to talk about that though, since I signed confidentiality agreements.
I only wanted to bring him here for the socialization and minor training, since my dad works 9 hours a day, so you can imagine how poorly training will go.


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## Fraido

I just hope my dad is serious about training during the time that he is home.


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## Gribouilli

He will probably be very tired after a 9 hours shift


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## Fraido

Yeah, unfortunately; however, he better suck it up or he's an idiot for getting a puppy. -______-


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## Gribouilli

It breaks my heart thinking about all those poor rats at your place of work. I have seen undercover videos so I know how bad it is no wonder pet store rats are more often than not sick or have behavioral issues or both


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## Fraido

It is pretty upsetting, there's no excuse for it, I understand why these kind of places need to exist and that they need to produce massive quantities, but at the least I wish they kept them clean properly clean and treated them better overall. A week with so many rats in a bin is far too long. I know why they take such drastic measures to kill loose rats though, the death of that one rat could save plenty more because the loose guys chew the water lines which can potentially drown and entire bin. I've seen it happen. It's really sad. I try to go to a few bins every now and then and give them some love, though.


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## Fraido

Wooo! My dad made an awesome suggestion (since the puppy can't come to work) when he dropped me off at home! He said something else we could do is have the puppy at my house, occupying my room during the day, that way not only do I get puppy cuddles in the morning, but my dad can come and take him out for potty at lunch time, and I can before I leave (since I don't leave until 8:30am; my dad would be dropping him off just before 6:00am). Obviously he's just a pup so chances are I'll be cleaning up accidents, but that's okay. We just have to talk to my Granny and see if it's okay, make sure she knows that puppy will not be living here or anything, he'll just be here during the day. Let's hope she says yes! This is one way to get motivated to have an immaculate room and put stuff away.... Hahaha

Oh and I think my dad is pretty set on naming the puppy Koga.


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## RatAtat2693

Fraido said:


> Wooo! My dad made an awesome suggestion (since the puppy can't come to work) when he dropped me off at home! He said something else we could do is have the puppy at my house, occupying my room during the day, that way not only do I get puppy cuddles in the morning, but my dad can come and take him out for potty at lunch time, and I can before I leave (since I don't leave until 8:30am; my dad would be dropping him off just before 6:00am). Obviously he's just a pup so chances are I'll be cleaning up accidents, but that's okay. We just have to talk to my Granny and see if it's okay, make sure she knows that puppy will not be living here or anything, he'll just be here during the day. Let's hope she says yes! This is one way to get motivated to have an immaculate room and put stuff away.... Hahaha
> 
> Oh and I think my dad is pretty set on naming the puppy Koga.


Awesome. Any of that is better than sitting home alone.

And Koga was pretty bad ass.


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## Fraido

Well, he'd have the other two dogs there, but he'd be crated. I read that they are better off being confined to one room when you're not at home, rather than being crated, because they tend to be claustrophobic. Plus, who wants to be stuck in a crate anyways? 

I'm waiting to talk to my Granny about it until my Grampy is not around, he is the all around animal hater and the one who will find an issue with something, whatever it is. What Granny says goes! Sucks though, he's been laid off so he's ALWAYS home... maybe I'm a horrible person, but I like it better when he's not around.. he's just a miserable person.

I feel like it'll be weird to call him that, hahah.. that's my anxiety kicking in, worried what people will be thinking when I say his name is Koga, I guess I just feel lame for having watched Inuyasha? Like maybe people will think it's dumb, I donno. I like it though, and the controlling side of me is pleased because it was my name suggestion, heh heh.


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## Gribouilli

Fraido said:


> Well, he'd have the other two dogs there, but he'd be crated. I read that they are better off being confined to one room when you're not at home, rather than being crated, because they tend to be claustrophobic. Plus, who wants to be stuck in a crate anyways? I'm waiting to talk to my Granny about it until my Grampy is not around, he is the all around animal hater and the one who will find an issue with something, whatever it is. What Granny says goes! Sucks though, he's been laid off so he's ALWAYS home... maybe I'm a horrible person, but I like it better when he's not around.. he's just a miserable person.I feel like it'll be weird to call him that, hahah.. that's my anxiety kicking in, worried what people will be thinking when I say his name is Koga, I guess I just feel lame for having watched Inuyasha? Like maybe people will think it's dumb, I donno. I like it though, and the controlling side of me is pleased because it was my name suggestion, heh heh.


Why do you think people would think about the name Koga?


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## Fraido

Sorry, pardon? Haha


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## RatAtat2693

Personally, I crate my dogs, especially puppies, when I'm not home because it keeps them safe, much like we keep our rats in a cage when we're not home. Plus it helps with potty training, if you do it correctly.


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## Fraido

Understandably.


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## Fraido

Got the go ahead from my Granny! Yay! I'm excited now, knowing I don't have to wait another two weeks to see him and play with him, haha.


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## Fraido

Puppy, anyone?


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## Fraido

He's already pottying outside really well! He has not had any accidents at my house the last two days. His last time to go out is 8:15ish, then he holds it until 11:00 when we come back during lunch break, then he holds it until 3:00. Such a good boy! He gets very focused on sniffing around outside, so he doesn't always come when called yet, but that's okay, he is only eight weeks! My yard isn't fenced in, so when he starts to go off bounds and won't come back I just grab him and go inside, next time we come back out we use the leash. I'm thinking we'll put the leash on and walk around the edge of the yard.


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## Fraido

Some photos from this morning.


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## RatAtat2693

Cuteness overload.

You can get a 30 ft cotton training line from the pet store. (Mine is from Petco.) I used mine for sled training. 

Pet stores are atrocities in regards to small animals, but their dog stuff is usually pretty good.


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## Fraido

I never even saw that you posted! That's a good idea, my dad has a long leash, he never brings it though. I never thought to tell him he should since it's just a couple hours in the mornings, which we spend most of the time inside. Lol Once I get back to going in on the weekends, I'll make use of it with him.

He's 10 weeks now, starting to become a little turd! I was in town last weekend, we went on a couple walks, he is getting more confident. A week before he was terrified of walking down the highway, since big trucks and cars make scary sounds (people were also very scary), but last weekend he did very good. We stopped at the pet store and there were lots of people in there that he got to meet and he walked around without fear of anybody. He met a bunch of children, he seems to like children, puppy sized people I guess? Of course, we still have to watch because he gets excited and tries to play with those sharp teeth of his and I don't want him unintentionally hurting a little kid and causing some chaos, we're working on it though.

Then we went to a park/path where we walked by more people, and even people on bikes! No fear, but when the bikes would go by he would stop and look back at them. He met a couple dogs, too, he's nervous of them at first but warms up very quickly. 

That was a good hour, then we went to the zoo, well sort of. No pets allowed in the zoo so we went to the lower area where people picnic and play Frolf. Apparently there was a tournament going on, but there wasn't an abundance of people playing. Regardless, we walked along the water and at this point I dropped Koga's leash. He was so good! Followed right with us the whole time. We walked to a little island type thing, there's a puny bridge to it, and nobody else was there so I took advantage of the small island and dropped Miikaah's leash as well (she's the husky, technically my dog, and she's not off-leash reliable). She was such a good girl. I took a bunch of photos and I'll have to use Photobucket or something because I've posted too many... lol


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## RatAtat2693

Hahaha. Upload it to a Google pics.


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## Fraido

I just uploaded them all to Photobucket, lol. Now to figure out how to share them.....


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## Fraido

Uhm, you can just creep me if you wanna see? Lol

http://s77.photobucket.com/user/Fraido/profile/


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## catty-ratty

To paste from photobucket, click on the pic you want to share. Look to the right and you'll see 4 options under "Share this photo". Click on IMG, the last option. You'll get a message that the link has been copied. 

Paste it into the body of your post.


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## Fraido

Well thanks! Lol


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## Fraido

Is this how it's done!?

Hooray! This is my favourite photo, Miikaah's my girl.<3


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## catty-ratty

She's beautiful! 

I sort of had a husky. She_ should _have been _my dog_. It disgusts me to think about how her owner treated her. He had her benign tumors removed, but did nothing for the blackened rotting tooth. 

I actually thought about how I could take her........Wouldn't have worked, otherwise I would have, if I'd had an accomplice. That guy should never have pets, AT ALL! 

Makes me sad to think about her.


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## RatAtat2693

They're a TON of work. Or at least a happy one is. I love my mix, but I don't ever know if I'd get another one.


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## Fraido

That's upsetting, there's too many people out there who shouldn't own animals.

I want to take Miikaah back home with me, as she's not really getting enough exercise. They go on big walks on the weekends, but throughout the week it's really just outside to pee and poop a few times a day. I'd give her those long walks every day, but my grandparents won't let me take her back.:/ It's just my grandfather, really. If it wasn't for him I'd at least take her for a sort of vacation for a week. When I move back with my mom, I'll be able to take her for a walk every day, I can't wait to get back to seeing her every day. Did I mention in my last post that I still consider her my dog, and that my dad even thinks she agrees! God I love her. She's a crazy, loving girl. She's my roughhousing dog, I love being able to play rough with my dog, I'm a little sad that I can't do so with Koga, but I've got my Miikaah!

In the beginning, Miikaah was bought for me, but my dad kind of stole her. She was only "mine" when she had an accident or needed to go outside. -_- Oh well I guess, but I wish I could have her back. I'd just take her when I move in with my mom, but my mom also hates animals. *sigh* I might fight back about that, though. It took a lot of convincing but my mom agreed to the dog, since I would have been bringing her with me every weekend, she got lucky that I never brought her on the weekends, my dad just watched her. But she can't just pull out of her agreement, she knew she was mine, sooo. 

If issues arise between Koga and Miikaah, she is coming to me without a doubt. My mom will have to just suck that up.. I think it makes me a bad person, but I'm kinda hoping issues pop up. I want her back! :$


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## Fraido

Took a couple pictures of Koga the other day.. and a bunch of bonus photos.


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## RatAtat2693

You could always trying bikejoring. Miikaah was born for it, literally.

http://www.ratforum.com/showthread.php?319554-First-Bike-Ride-of-the-Season


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## Fraido

I'm not sure that Miikaah is trained enough for that.. lol. Which would just mean it's something I'd have to work on with her.

I don't think there's anywhere for me to really do something like that, though. I mean, there is but I don't know if I could get there on a regular basis. I don't drive, and honestly don't plan on it, scares the crap out of me. We have the park we go to, which is about a 20 or so minute walk from where my dad lives and also where I'll be living (since my mom lives pretty much two minutes away from my dad, lol) at the end of June. I'd need to invest in a bike and whatever else for Miikaah... my plan is to start jogging with her, and I think that's a good place to start if I want to bike with her? We never taught her to pull/stop pulling and stuff, so she would have to learn all that, since once we start jogging/running she is difficult to stop. Haha

Regardless, the jogging is definitely happening. I could use the exercise!


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## Fraido

On a side note I really want to take Miikaah to get groomed. She's looking pretty rough, then I can start brushing her more regularly, she has ALWAYS absolutely despised it and will whine and yelp and try to get away the entire time, no matter how gentle you are, so she doesn't get brushed as often as I'd like her to be. Plus, she just got moved into a harness the last couple weeks, she had one of those choke chains, and the links messed up her fur and gave it a grey colour. Not sure if there's anything that can be done about thay except let it grow out, though.


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## Fraido

Such a cutie. He's huge already.


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## RatAtat2693

Awww


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## Fraido

You can tell his little ears are starting to go up.  One more than the other... but oh well.. lol. He'll look less like a square white lab when they do finally get up! Him and one other littermate still have yet to have upright ears.


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## Fraido

Squishy puppy face, lol.


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## comprar

I didn't mean like, grabbing his jaw, just meant playing around with his lips to look at his teeth and stuff. I see what you mean though!


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## Fraido

He is already fifty pounds!








And some photos of Miikaah, because obviously.


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## Ratloved

Beautiful dogs, beautiful land and scenery, I want to live there, lol. I could fish daily!


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## Fraido

The three with my husky on the hill are at a place where we like to go hiking, it's great! The rest are right beside out local zoo, haha. 

Sent from my LG-H812 using Tapatalk


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## Ratloved

Lol ok, well maybe I don't want to live there, haha. From some of the pictures, it looks like beautiful secluded countryside. Anyway, pretty puppies, especially like the husky.


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## catty-ratty

I used to sort of have a husky. She sort of thought she was mine. We both sort of wished she was.


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## Fraido

Lol, yeah maybe not! I'd love living out in the country, but alas... I must remain in the city. I must agree I am quite partial to my husky girl... she is technically mine, so! 

I remember you mentioning that, Catty. They're such wonderful dogs, if only she really was yours!

Miikaah went and got a little grooming yesterday, very much needed! She is such a perfect girl, so beautiful.


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## comprar

I like the idea of bringing the puppy to work since it offers plenty of time to socialize, but since it's in a feeder shop, I would worry about his prey drive kicking in and killing some of the, um, merchandise. I'd also worry about any potential diseases that could be transmitted, though if he gets his boosters, it might not be as bad.


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## Fraido

I've gotta take some more pictures of Koga... but in the time being, look who's finally at home with me! 😇







Unfortunately, I think the girl has a UTI, so she's gotta get checked!


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## comprar

Unless your dad invest thousands in training, this isn't going to end well. My aunt had a neighbor with an Akita, worst dog ever if not properly trained.


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