# Guilt



## Holly

If you are not familiar with the basics of my story of my first rat and best friend, Gregor Samsa, you can read what happened on the thread, "Gregor is very ill" in this section.

In short, he was so healthy that even the vet thought he'd live to be around 5. But "silent tumors" were growing inside of him, and he died young, never seeing his second birthday.

I had to euthanize him. (On Valentine's day.)

And he was the best friend I ever had.

I've never "euthanized" anyone before. Five vets advised me to.

And I was with him when he died, and I didn't cry then; I wanted to keep my voice and emotions as "normal" as possible, to give him something familiar to comfort him.

But it's a month and a half later, now, and I'm still crying and hurting as if it happened yesterday. Everyone says that I did what was kind for Gregor, but that's not how I feel.

All I can think is: _I killed my best friend. Who loved me. Who never did a single bad thing in his life. What kind of monster am I?_

I'm SO guilty!

Even though Gus and I have each other and love each other now, of course, it can never erase the pain of losing Gregor. It just gives me something in life to enjoy, a reason to be happy. I don't want anyone to think that I expect Gus to "replace" Gregor, or that I don't love him in his own right, for who he is.

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So, I'm pretty much suffering through this every day. I care about animals very much - especially the tiny innocents.

The people in my life don't "get" it. Reactions have ranged from, "Yuck, a rat," to, "Well, it's not as if you lost a person." I DID lose a "person." A tiny, furry person who loved me.

So...I thought I would express this here. Does anyone have any words of wisdom? Are there "pet loss grief" places that you can call? 

I've been working on it, but I don't think I'm going to get over this one without some help of some kind. I feel like a monster. I miss Gregor. I love him.

All I can say that is positive is that I gave Gregor (and am giving Gus) as good a life as I know how. They have their favorite toys, favorite foods, and plenty of play-time. I pay attention, to observe what they like best. So, it's a good life for a rat.

I'm curious to see what people advise.

Thank you for your help.


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## DonnaK

You gave Gregor everything you had, and when the time came to make that awful decision, you chose to not let him suffer. You did more than a lot of people would - how many people do you think would've taken him to *5 VETS?!*

You have to remember that it would've been worse for him to live in constant pain with the tumors, than to just drift off to sleep. You really did do the right thing.


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## Holly

Well...I hope I did...

I didn't want him to suffer. Of course.

But I didn't want him to ~die.~

Yeah, we tried a few different vets and specialists because I was hoping so much that somebody could save him.

He had tumors in his lungs and couldn't breathe. I had him at an emergency clinic on oxygen for a couple of days, but when they told me that his breathing was labored and painful even WITH the O2, I figured that HE would feel better. I tried to imagine what it would be like to gasp and fight for every breath, and have no chance of getting better, and so I chose to "put him to sleep." He seemed peaceful. I hope he was.


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## Night

I also had to euthanize my heart rat because of inoperable tumors. It's a heart breaking thing to have to do, but it's much better than watching them slowly dwindle and feel pain. I'm sorry about your boy


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## Holly

Thank you for the encouragement, Night. I'm sorry that you had to euthanize someone you loved, too.


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## twitch

i had to let go of Pocket a little over 2 years ago now and i will still cry from time to time. there was a lot of guilt involved in putting her down. she was older but nearly everything could ahve been fixed and the rest managed had i only had the money. i'll never make that mistake again and keep a can of money just for the vet bills. i try to keep it as high up as possbile too so i won't have to go through that again. it hurts, its hurts still even though i know there would be no way she would be alive now anyway. and at the time no one understood. not even my own mother who recommended that i drop a rock on Pocket's head because she was too busy to run me to the vet's. 

but i "got over it" as much as i could. i showered my other rats at the time (all of which have since passed as well) with love and we consoled each other. and i've gotten more rats since then. each are unique and not one of them, even for a momment, makes me forget about Pocket or replaces her. and each time i have to put another one down it tears at me. but i remind myself that it is better to fall asleep in a loved ones arms and not wake up then to gasp or quietly suffer in pain until they have no more energy for it. i wish it was that way with humans. i've had to watch family members scream in pain and gasp for every breath until their bodies finally let go, and i'll tell you, it took a LONG time. 

you can talk to us about it. we understand that these furry little bodies are more then just a "pet" or a "rat". they're your friends, you family. as much you children as your human ones. we understand the pain of losing them and how hard it can be for others to "get it". we're here for you. you're in our thoughts.


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## Holly

Wow!  I am so sorry to hear what happened to Pocket! She sounds like a little darling!

Smart idea about the "vet bill can" funds. I should do that, too.

Thank you for articulating how much my friends here understand. There is no place for me to talk about my feelings of guilt over Gregor, but here. I'm grateful for you guys.

You mentioned euthanizing other rats. Do they have to be euthanized often? 8O 

I don't have any human children...my dogs, cat, and rat are a very large part of my life. (Art/music is the other important part of my life.) Gus is his own guy, and he is very, very easy to love.

The other day, crazy as it seems, I "confessed" what had happened to Gregor, to Gus. (He didn't say anything, just listened.) I told him I wished that he could tell me how he felt, and what he wanted if the time came.

He again made no reply, but finished an "entrance hole" on a pillowcase, so he could go out the front AND the back!

This guy!


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## Stephanie

I am soo sorry for your loss i was crying as i was reading it i took my lovely little gir in for mass removal and he never pulled through i wasn't able to be there with him but i know that he knoew i loved him just as gregor knew you were completely devoted to him and loved you all the more for putting his well being before your emotions you did the right thing completely! *hugs* i am soo sorry


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## Holly

Sorry about your little girl! 

Thanks for the support!


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## Stephanie

LoL gir was a boy but thank you he was named after the little robot in invader zim he was a blue hooded and SUPER sweet the sweetest rat i have ever had the pleasure of loving. But this post is not about me it is about you and again i am very sorry for your loss i wish there was something i could say to help your pain but i know that only time will help that


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## Holly

OH! I get it! "Gir" is his name! I had thought that you meant to type "girl," but that the "l" never made it! (I have a hard time typing when I have false nails.)

I think I also thought that because I read that it's mostly the girls who get tumors. One book went so far to suggest that, if tumors concerned you, one of the solutions was to pick out boys, who have a much rarer incidence of tumors. Isn't it odd that both our little guys would get them?

Apologies to Gir, the lovely little BOY!

Everything that I read here is helping a lot. For instance, when I read about Gir, I found another reason to be happy for small favors. At least, I got to be with Gregor as he passed.

When people share their stories like this, it really does help in some way. I mean, it won't take the pain away tomorrow, or anything, but it does give me more perspective on the situation.

It's nice to be in a friendly "pack," with my friends here.

NIGHT - I've been thinking about it, and I really, really like your phrase, "heart rat."

[Edited, because I woke up in the middle of the night with ideas.]


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## ladylady

ive nursed people who are very ill and not getting better-they take a while to understand and accept it, then they want the people they love beside them and peace...


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## Starghoti

I've dealt with pet and human loss throughout my years.

In my opinion- and from experience- I feel far more guilt from having to sit by and watch my mother die (couldn't "euthanize" her) from failing health and Altzheimers, than from lovingly and humanely escorting suffering pets to the Rainbow Bridge. I had a dog many years ago, Gypsy, who was like an appendage. She and I went everywhere, and had many adventures, and amazing times. She was one of those special ones that could seemingly read my mind. That was 20 years ago, and I still get choked up when I think about her. But I know she will be there to meet me when it is my time to cross that bridge. All my "kids" will be there. They will be healthy and happy and glad to see me because I never made them suffer longer than they deserved.

Having to watch my mother slowly shrink away over a span of 5 years is far more guilt inspiring. I know she doesn't hold it against me that I have no desire to rot in jail for murder (tho it would have been a kindness to end her suffering)... but that doesn't make it any easier.

Just my $.02

Anna


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## ladylady

I was crying yesterday reading this and remembering when my dog was put down. My Mum felt very guilty, she'd made the call, but Bessie was very ill and to keep her alive would have ment a diazepam drip and living in the surgery. I think she was upset that me and her partner didnt get to say goodbye but she new we loved her and trusted my Mum so I think she would have gone peacefully. Theres never a good option, just a best one...


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## Poppyseed

*hugs Holly* I'm not sure what to say but I know Joshu was right there after Gregor and is probably playing with him right now. I know you gave him an awesome life. I also wish Joshu were right here, it just isn't fair that rats are so tiny and frail but perhaps with proper breeding some time down the road the average lifespan WILL be 5-7 *sighs*

I miss Joshu too, it just isn't fair.


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## Holly

Thank you both for sharing this with me. Hugs to you, too.

When I think of my Gregor, I want to remember the happy times, and how much he loved me, and the fun we had together. I don't want to cry every time I think of him. 

The support I've gotten from my friends here has helped me to feel a lot better...even though I don't really "know" anyone here, and what I "know" about people here usually has to do with their rats. You guys have been great!


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## fallinstar

my daisy had to be put down nearly a year ago now and i still cry about it all the time i wasnt as strong as you wen we took her 2 the vets i was a right mess and daisy neverliked the vets she knew summit was up and when we had to put her in the cage she squeeked like mad and clung on to me (im cryin now just thinkin about it) she was always a quiet rat  i now (sounds a bit grim) have her ashes next to my bed so i say good night and good morning 2 her everyday, i was goin thu a very hard time when daisy had 2 pass on she was only 18months old and she was my 1st rat, my cat that i had had since i was 4 had 2 be put down a few days earlyer and a week before my great aunt died i still feel guilty about daisy but when i sit and think about it i no it was only fair on her as it relived her from her pain and now i no shes in a happyier place but shes still in my heart. xx


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## Holly

fallinstar:

I'm so very sorry to hear about little Daisy and the other tragedies! But I'm glad that her ashes are right there with you, so you never have tto say "good bye" all of the way. Any animal lover won't think you "crazy" to keep Daisy's ashes near you. (DO NOT SPILL THEM OR YOU WILL BE HEARTBROKEN!!)

Everyone:

I have read here how we all have experienced pain, loss, and even guilt - it's not just me, it's everyone. I really must thank you for all of the kind words. When I feel too sad, sometimes, I read this thread, and it makes me feel better.

When it's time to go, I hope that you and I and all of our families, animal and human, fall asleep peacefully at night, and pass away in a happy dream, without knowing fear.


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## OnlyOno

> I really must thank you for all of the kind words. When I feel too sad, sometimes, I read this thread, and it makes me feel better.


to be honest, reading this thread makes me cry, but i understand where you are coming from.  we've all had our unfair share of losses, but the most important thing is to give them the best life you can afford to give them and to be there for them when the time comes to let them go. only they know when it is time to let go, and they will let you know when they are ready. you are an amazing animal owner (and i hear you on that "my animals ARE my babies" thing) and i'm sure that your babies know this.


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## fallinstar

holly i wont ever spill them thery are in a bad in a box along side my cats ashes and also some of my aunts


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## Holly

Well, today is the two month anniversary of Gregor's death, and I'm not handling it too well.

I'll be absolutely frank about what's going on in my mind: I have certain, very severe, emotional problems like anxiety and depression, and these things called "personality disorders," that make it so I am dependent on others to help me get through practical things in life. I literally can't make it on my own. However, these same disorders put such a heavy strain on others that (as my mother told me a few hours ago,) I drive every other person away. She says that there is no question that I will wind up alone...and I don't mean like on the dating/marriage front. ALONE. With no one who even wants to be my friend. This is not an exaggeration. This is my life.

I had two root canals and some other work done yesterday, and, of course, it hurts.

In addition, it's "that time of the month."

So, when all of this gets rolled together, and comes to its acme on Gregor's Death Anniversary, all I can think of is, "You had someone who loved you unconditionally...but you euthanized him, and so you don't have his love anymore."

Working out to be a hard day.

Hope this isn't Too Much Information. I really just wanted people to understand why I feel extra vulnerable and sad.

Gus licks my tears...my one bright star in a clouded life.


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## Night

Not to be harsh, but your mother sounds extremely heartless, if only in this situation. She sounds as though she understands very little about psychology, human emotion, and pets.


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## Holly

Rats don't count as pets, to my mom. She won't be in the same room where one is out, even if the rat is not near her.

Mom is kind of heartless in this case, but also, she has lived with me my whole life, and I think she's kind of sick of my problems, so she's being blunt. I can't say that she isn't speaking the truth.


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## Night

What truth is there to speak? She's no psychic. I fail to see how she knows you're going to end up alone  That's harsh - you shouldn't say that kind of stuff to someone, let alone your child.


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## Holly

Well, as long as there are animals, I'll never be truly alone.

I have phobias - one of them is a phobia of throwing up. I'd want a human there in that case, but I suppose I could always pay someone to sit with me when I was sick, if it came down to it.

I'm sure this is probably too much personal info for a forum, but I feel better for getting it off my chest, and from the points you have made. I've stopped crying, at least.

Sorry for the big rant up there. Bad day, kinda lost it a little.


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## ladylady

Holly i think my partner/expartner has Borderline Personality Disorder-ive been on tons of forums trying to work things out. hes a nightmare but theres alot of good in him too. He dosent have may friends but I love him and understand him some what-hes not talking to me much at the moment but thats nothing new time will tell. Ive been in touch with a woman who is in a very similar situation to me. You seem very lovable to me-i think you just need somone who would call your bluff sometimes. Look for support with your peers on some of the mental health forums there nice places


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## Poppyseed

With great problems and disorders come great talents and gifts as well. You may just be a highly sensitive person and this causes your anxiety and depression. I KNOW all about being a HSP D: It's rough because it's like everything around you is multiplied by 100 from what a person with a 'normal' nervous system would feel.

It's really hard to grow up all your life with people telling you are too 'sensitive'. Just holding a part time job is hard for me, I doubt I can hold a full time job long without breaking down. Luckily I have my boyfriend helping on the rent so part time is enough but it doesn't give things like medical, dential, ZOLOFT (Been off Zoloft for like nearly half a year now because I can't afford it, but I think I've been doing alright) etc D: So yeah I know how you feel, I might be as severe as you are in the disorders but I can TOTALLY relate. From the post here, I can tell you are even more sensitive then the average HSP and therefor your gifts are more profound, such as talking to your pets at a level which I find AMAZING but you also seem to have great obstacles as well. When you feel bad about the obstacles just think of all the things you are totally awesome at! That should help.

This part of the forum is about helping eachother through grief, part of that can be knowing the emotional problem as well. I don't think you killed Gregor, I think you helped him. Joshu slept in bed with me before his death, he was in great pain and trauma, he had panic attacks that sent him running while he was huffing. I had to do everything in my power to keep him calm and tell him it was alright to go and in the end he STILL did not want to go, he struggled a GREAT deal before he finally was overtaken by pain and passed. You saved Gregor from that pain before death, that traumatic way to pass to the other side. I just wish I had saved Joshu from that pain, but he passed in the morning before he could be euthanised that day. I feel guilty I didn't give him that D: You just can't win with death can you?

Just think of that, and know death may be an end but it's not THE end, nothing can kill spirit. When a spirit makes it's journey peacefully, it's easier to deal with whatever lay on the other side. A journey made in pain and with struggle makes their next obstacles much harder. You did what was right for him, you made that journey easier to take and it was going to happen that day or maybe a short while after that but you knew it would happen soon. It wasn't you that killed him, it was the horrible breeding through generations and generations of rats that killed him. You took him in and cared for him as much as possible and in the end you knew it was time to go and helped him.

Grieving is fine, it's natural but you NEED to let go of this guilt that isn't yours to have. That should help you. Just know it wasn't you, it was the bad breeding. Hopefully rat owners everywhere will help to evolve our pets past this.


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## Holly

Thank you, Poppyseed. Everything you said is 100% correct.


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## Night

Beautifully put, Poppy


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## Poppyseed

Thanks, hope it helped D: Are you feeling better today Holly?


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## Holly

Much, thank you.

As I've said before (but it bears repeating,) if I start feeling down, I just reread this thread, think about the situations of others, or their insights, or even just that there is a group of people who won't judge me, even if I'm a little rat-crazy.

My mom didn't understand this, but you guys will: Gus has the most beautiful hair/fur I have ever seen. (The "brown" part.) Actually, each strand is a different color: grey, blonde, tan, dark brown, light brown, red, black...ALL colors. Each strand is different. And he never looks exactly the same from week to week.

I'd like hair like that, but you can't get that kind of beauty from a salon. Nature has to be involved.


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## Poppyseed

Awww! That DOES sound beautiful!

My mom HATES rats, she claims it's their tails *eyerolls* Oh well. We never really had a hamster either growing up, from what I can remember. No cats either because Bill (my step dad) was allergic but we did have a guneia pig for a VERY long time.

My grandma claimed to hate rats too, but then I got Joshu and she thought he was adorable. My grandma is awesome, I love her. She understands me a lot better. Still she shouldn't keep any animals as she never learns proper care...


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## Nazarath

So sorry about your boy Holly!!  Fallinstar told me about your post . I hope you feel better soon . Tell Gus I said hi and to give his mommy a big hug from me.


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## Holly

Thank you Naz (and Fallinstar!) Gregor was my first rat, and we really "connected," y'know? He taught me about rats, and I taught him about "giants" (people.) 

I really miss him, but I don't feel as guilty, after reading what folks said here. I'm sorry his life was so short, but I'm really blessed that he was a part of MY life.

Even though he's a Big Boy, Gus is still young...not quite a "zooming fuzlet," but at least a "zooming streak!"  He's taking care of me while I'm sick and in bed. He is a real personality! Also, in the "brown" part of his coat, he really has all different color strands of hair. It's amazing - he is the most beautiful sight I've ever seen.

Gus just stuck his nose in your ear!


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## Nazarath

LOL, you shouldn't feel bad or guilty. You did what you could for him and we all know that he had a fantastic life with you and knowone can say different.


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## zemiq

Don't feel guilty. I can totally understand though. I had to put my 15 year old cat to sleep a little over a year ago. It was the hardest thing I had ever done. I had been with another cat (my step-mom's) when she was euthanized, but I had never had to make the decision myself.

It's a little different, seeing as Gregor died young. Cecil lived a full and pretty long cat life. But I can understand the grief, and the guilt. He loved me very much, and he was in pain and misery, and he would have clung to life every single day just for me, despite it all. I don't even fully know what was wrong with him. I wracked up a tremendous credit card bill taking him to vets and trying medicines. Finally one night he sat on the counter and cried and meowed for hours. I knew it was time. I pampered him as much as I could on his last night, but it was hard because he felt miserable. I had some friends go with me, and had him put to sleep. I carried him in the car, I carried him in the vet, I held him as they did it, and I couldn't stop crying the whole time. Even the vet teared up, and she has to do that every day. 

I asked myself and my friends and family for days, "Did I do the right thing?" They all kept saying that yes I did. I still wonder sometimes if I did. Maybe if I'd gone to one more vet, maybe if I'd tried one more medicine, or waited 5 more days. I think now he understands I did it with love. But it doesn't make it any easier. I visited his grave and cried on the anniversary of his death. I still miss him terribly. It the price we pay as animal lovers and caring pet owners. You let them into your heart, but when they get sick, sometimes you have to make the choice for them. It's a merciful decision, but still very hard. 

I am glad though that you seem to be feeling a little better. I just wanted to share my little tidbit of knowledge because I can totally understand the doubt and the guilt.


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## Holly

zemiq - thank you for the post, and for understanding. So sorry about Cecil!


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## zemiq

Even though I still can feel guilt and doubt sometimes, in general I feel I did the right thing. I have other cats and I love them dearly, but I'm not sure the bond I had with Cecil can ever be duplicated. I'm only 24 years old. He was my best friend while "growing up" (I don't feel grown up  ), through good times and bad. I've read many posts about rats trying to comfort their sick owners, so I know it is easy for everyone to understand how we can love our little friends so much!

I never had anybody say to me, "He was just a cat. At least he wasn't a person." Everyone knew how much he meant to me. Heck, I get sad when one of my fish dies, and I wouldn't say I have a really strong bond with my fish. I'm not devastated, but I am sad. 

I knew that what everyone else had said had made you feel better about the whole thing. But I wanted to tell you my little story because it can sometimes be hard, even months or years later. and sometimes they have such a strong will to live that they would continue to suffer for however long they could, and in those times, we have to help them let go. Or that's my view anyway.


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## SamsterAndRocky

my flashy girl hamster died like at least 3 years ago and im still crying about it sometimes....she was my best friend through some of the toughest stuff of my young adult life (abusive b/f, no friends leaving abusive b/f, returning to abusive b/f and moving father, leaving abusive b/f for good, dealing with those feelings........theres a ton of stuff, but i'm not totally comfortable saying what they are)........like 2+ years of total crap.......and i still miss her, she was the best friend ive ever had, thats why i cant really read any thing in the rainbow bridge section, cuz it still hurts so much sometimes.


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