# Rats weened too early?



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

Hey this is my first topic here. I'm about to adopt (hopefully) my first two babies on Sunday from a lady off craigslist. She handles them so hopefully they're going to be friendly. The problem is she said they were born January 5th and they're already living on their own without mom. I worry if this is going to cause problems in the future. What do you all think? Should I go and see them and assess their physical and mental health and if it's okay go for it?


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

Here is a picture if it helps.
The two on the left and right are the girls and their brother is in the middle.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

This is the reply I got from her: Rats and mice can be weaned at 21 days. Ive never lost one yet. Ive always separated at 21 days , they eat and drink on their own. Id never rehome them as pets if I did not think they were ready.


----------



## Jenzie (Dec 26, 2012)

I've always heard that rats should ideally not be separated from their mothers until they are 5 weeks old, but I have very little experience with this so I'm not really sure.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

I guess I just want your honest opinions on if I should not even look at them and find another pair or if I should go and them them.


----------



## JLSaufl (Jan 20, 2013)

The reptile store breeds their own rats for food and sale (pets) and they always wean at 3 weeks, i think it's early too, but whenever I go in there, the kittens seem perfectly happy and fine.


----------



## Sarina1285 (Sep 15, 2012)

I just adopted a three week old male from a pet store here. We've had him for a week and a half now he's perfectly content. Super sweet... He's a little spastic jumping bean sometimes lol but he eats and drinks from his water dish and loves to be held and cuddled  


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Sarina1285 (Sep 15, 2012)

Ps those are Absolutley adorable babies! <3


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## iHayleyNorris (Jul 28, 2012)

I got my boys at 4 weeks. They're great.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

Thanks Sarina! The boy is quite adorable as well and might be living with my friend and her two rats. I fell in love with the two girls, those little striped faces! It's hard to say no!


----------



## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

Rat are physically capable of being weaned at 3 weeks old, however whether it is good for them physically and more importantly in my book mentally (in terms of development) is another matter. It does depend on the individual to some extent though. I’ll admit the babies I’m used to are relatively slow developing, they are still very much babies at 6 weeks old and we don’t rehome until 7 in most cases, however from my experience at 3 weeks old they are just learning to be rats. There mum has a lot to do with this process, at this age she is teaching them foods to like and dislike, teaching them how much they can get away with in rough play, , teaching them there manners and how to act around humans. They are like little sponges and learn lots. She also provides extra nutrition at this stage. Rat babies are growing at their fastest around 2-4 weeks, they shoot up, and so need a diet that’s very rich in protein and viatmins. Rat milk on top of a nice range of wet options is ideal for this. Of course you can feed them on their own to some extent but it’s not as good. I would expect them to not grow so fast, or be as ‘ratty’ or friendly if they came away from mum so young. The youngest I’ve split mum from babies was at 4.5 weeks (you need to split the boy baies away at 4-5 weeks from mum anyway), and this was because both mum and babies were getting a bit overly chubby and needed a bit less food (mum was getting fat eating the babies wet food, babies were getting fat eating their wet food and mums milk). It worked well, but even then they had a week where mum went back in with the girls in particular once a day (the girls were a little bit unsettled at first).

There’s also the fact it sounds like she’ll be homing them young, now the UK has very different standards on this to the US. Here its strongly frowned upon to take in rat babies younger than 6 weeks old, and that applies even in most pet shops. For me a baby rat has a lot extra to learn and grow in those weeks between 4 and 6 weeks old. They learn these things better in a large groups with good human attention. They gain a lot of confidence as well as even more ratty manners and how to interact with each other. I think this is important enough that I took my last litter to combine with a friends at 6 weeks old to spend a week with her (15 boys and 15 girls), as there was only 2 boys and 3 girls, so not enough to really learn their large group skills. This is a nice to have to be fair but I saw how much there confidence grew in that time and it’s lovely. It was even better as she had a couple friendly spayed does who visited the boys as well as the girls a few times to teach them your not allowed to suckle all adult rats (very valuable if you are going to move in with adult cage mates soon)

This isn’t to say that you will necessarily get nervous rats who don’t fully understand ‘rat speak’ and manners. However I do see more rats struggle with introductions who’ve missed out on this to some extent, and on average they are harder to socialise. 

It also isn’t to say you shouldn’t take them, that’s a personal decision, for me it matters where my rats come from, not because I’m a rat snob (though some might argue differently lol) but because when I get rats from somewhere I show them that I’m ok with what they do, and support it to some extent. So for me I could never get rats from a pet shop, or a breeder or rescue who I didn’t agree with the ethics of, even if it was clear I would be helping the individual rat have a better life (in a way I sacrifice the individual in the hope it helps the next generation not be born). That’s a hard line to tread though and not for everyone, plus here I have a lot of good options too. The uk seems to have a real abundance of good breeders if you don’t mind travelling a few hours.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

Oops, realized that weaned is spelled wrong. Forgive me everyone. hahaha


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

Thank you for your reply Isamu! That is really helpful. Sadly there are next to no ratterys where I live and so craigslist becomes the 2nd best option. This lady does keep some as pets and others are feeders or are sold so she probably doesn't care when they're weaned. However it's almost too sad thinking that they might be snake food if I don't get them. I can always go and decide against getting them, but it would be hard for me to do so. I do want healthy friendly rats. Decisions, decisions.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

"Ive looked into age as well. Visited many websites and also consulted my vet. Ive had no adverse affects from separating at 21 days. And when you breed every so often like I do. The moms need rest too. If the babies didnt eat and drink on their own of if was a really big litter, id keep them with mom a little longer so everyone has enough time to gain weight properly and learn to function on their own. I have 2 little rex rats that I got as soon as their eyes opened and they have done extremely well . They just need teeth and to be shown what to do. If I had any reservations about their age and rehoming them as pets, id wait to give them up. You are more than welcome to wait for the other babies and ill keep some until they are 5wks for ya. Its your choice. I already will have to go buy babies if these guys/gals leave, so it is up to you if youd like to wait."

Yay it looks like I have options! She has some babies and she says she'll keep them with mom for 5 weeks. Sadly this keeps me from getting my babies sooner but it is probably the best option?!


----------



## SaraBRattie (Aug 29, 2012)

I was told not to take them away from parents till they are 6-8 weeks for mental reasons.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

I appreciate everyone's replies and am happy to report that I will adopted some from a newer litter and she'll keep them with mom for 6 weeks. I'll just have to have my rat fix by visiting friend's rats until then!


----------



## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

It sounds like shes breeding these rats quite close together, from her comment about mum needing a rest too. Its not particularly nice on the mums to raise one litter, a few weeks break, then pregnant again. Unless your churning out babies there are few reasons to use a doe more than once, and if you do at least a few months break should be minimum. Weve done it here a couple times with exceptional mums to different dads, to give us another option, but theyve had months between litters (closer to 6) and time to recover and enjoy life between litters, and never more than twice.

Sorry, im a bit over the top on this stuff, I find myself picturing one of my litters or there mums and get very protective lol


----------



## Korra (Dec 11, 2011)

I got one of mine out of the feeder bin at 3 weeks and she is friendliest, calmest, sweetest rat ever. She is turning 2 so she is healthy as far as rats go as well. So I say while it is better that ratties stay with mom longer, mine had no problems from being 3 weeks old and out.


----------



## jewels (Jan 31, 2013)

I was worried about this too but I got my girls at 4 weeks old and they have been great the week that we've had them. Are you getting a pair or just a single baby? Maybe getting a pair of babies would be the best option if you can do it. I never planned on getting a pair but my girls are so happy with each other and I feel better that they have a friend when I'm not around.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

I am definitely getting two if not three, don't worry!


----------



## Rumy91989 (Dec 31, 2012)

It's good to hear that she's willing to work with you!

If you ever get concerned about getting a young rat who might not have had the means to develop correctly, you can always adopt a young rat AND an older rat together. I got a girl who was barely 3 weeks old (long story) and she's done wonderfully, but she also lives with an 11 week old, a 5 month old, two 9 month olds, and a girl who is at least a year old. That's allowed her plenty of learning opportunities as well as playmates at different life stages. She's definitely our most people-oriented rat but she also LOVES following the older girls around and learning how to do what they do.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

That could also be a possibility. The only problem is I have no extra cages for introducing, the lady has a few 3 month olds but they probably don't know the young ones?!
I'm actually going to see the girls on sunday because they're very cute, but I won't take them if I think they're not right for me. We'll see I guess.


----------



## Rumy91989 (Dec 31, 2012)

I would ask to see if they've socialized at all, because 3 months would be a good age for an older rat that would still enjoy playing with and teaching a younger rat.  Keep us updated!


----------



## Rumy91989 (Dec 31, 2012)

By socialized, I mean if the older ones have met the younger ones, lol. I'm not very clear sometimes...


----------



## Kaliloca (Jan 24, 2013)

I got Armageddon at 4 weeks. He's 9 1/2 weeks now. He's grown "EXTREMELY FAST" He's larger than Holly, who's 12 weeks older than him. So, he's going to be HUGE. LOL. He's friendly and loves to be held. I'm not even sure if he's knows he's a rat. Even though he's live with the girls for the last 5 weeks..... He really doesn't like them. Holly will try and attack him. 

We got a critter nation cage yesterday. He's on the top level and the girls are on the lower one. He tried to go to the lower level and Holly chased him back up. LOL. I think it's time to keep them separated anyway. 

Anyhow, the point is. As long as they're "doing well" 4 weeks is the perfect age to get a new rat. They just bond more easily and forget their rats.


----------



## Jackie (Jan 31, 2013)

Rumy: this would be a good idea if they were socialized and I got the sisters and an older 3 month old. I'm afraid to ask because I think the 3 month olds were already fed as snake food ;-; wahhh!
I can't see much in the pictures but it seems like they had a lot of different cages so they probably never met each other.


----------



## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

Kaliloca said:


> I got Armageddon at 4 weeks. He's 9 1/2 weeks now. He's grown "EXTREMELY FAST" He's larger than Holly, who's 12 weeks older than him. So, he's going to be HUGE. LOL. He's friendly and loves to be held. I'm not even sure if he's knows he's a rat. Even though he's live with the girls for the last 5 weeks..... He really doesn't like them. Holly will try and attack him.
> 
> We got a critter nation cage yesterday. He's on the top level and the girls are on the lower one. He tried to go to the lower level and Holly chased him back up. LOL. I think it's time to keep them separated anyway.
> 
> Anyhow, the point is. As long as they're "doing well" 4 weeks is the perfect age to get a new rat. They just bond more easily and forget their rats.


I woukd definitly seperate them now, boys are perfectly able to impregnate girls at that age, and it doesnt tale long at all, I hope the deed hasnt already been done.

I expect part of why you dont think he knows hes a rat is because he was seperated from his siblings so young, he never really had chance to learn to be a rat. That fine if you want a rat that is very human focused and a bit deatached from other rats, but I prefer my rats to think and act like rats, and choose me rather than needing me.


----------

