# Tell him this is stupid please!



## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

So I figured I would post this here, then show my bf the responses to settle our argument here. 

Making a long story really short here. My boyfriend wants to solve our cage swapping issues (because I'm getting 4 new rats and the cage up at the lake won't hold all of them and my crew) by just taking the cages at home to the lake and turning his FN single story cage into a 3 story cage. He wants his ferrets at the bottom, my rats get the top 2 levels. His ferrets don't need 2 stories because when he's working (from home alot of times) his ferrets get free range of his office which happens to be 750 sq ft. of the house. They are only in their cage overnight for the most part. 

Seriously, housing ferrets right below my rats just sounds bad! My poor rats are going to freak out because they smell nothing but predator. He thinks the rats will eventually get use to the smell of ferrets and that it won't be a big deal. Ferrets are hunters, predators, they eat rats and mice. (Granted I doubt his would fight to get to this new found food source, but if given the chance I'm sure they would attack.) As it stands now his ferrets are on a different floor of the house so my rats don't freak out and so his ferrets don't try to "hunt" them. Now he wants to basically put them in one giant cage next to each other??


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

i wouldn't do that. he's right, they are likely to get used to the smell over time, my rats have with my cats. though twix is still scarred poopless during free range if a cat comes too close to her. she was raised with these cats from a 4-5 weeks old baby, she's 25 months now. neither cat has ever tried to harm her, sessho even tries to baby all the rats, views them as his little kittens (some of the rats like him, others don't). having the ferrets essentially sharing the same cage, even though the rats may get used to the smell eventually does not mean they will get used to the proxicmity. 

also, i would be TERRIFIED of an escapee. it has been known to happen the even a rat that you wouldn't think would be able to get out will get out of a FN. if they escape to below them, well i don't want to think about it. and just because the ferrets are natural predators doesn't mean that the rat won't be dumb enough to go near them. i have heard of a story were a rat escaped her cage and was found hiding under a hut in the ferret cage across the room. she was lucky that the ferrets weren't more determined to get her and that her owners were able to find her so quickly. 

personally i think its a dangerous idea and wouldn't do it. 

but aren't those levels removable? if you are going to have a 3 level FN why can't you take the 2 top levels and put them somewhere else? even if they don't have a base you could put it on a towel or something on the floor.


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

He wants 1 cage setup in the house instead of 2 cages in different rooms on different floors of the house. The FN cage will be covered in hardware cloth no matter what because my rats climb and they wont climb vertical bars. I can't take their climbing fun away from them. I don't see escape as an issue so much as I see them freaking out, not wanting to be in their home, and generally changing their personalities. Escaping would mean getting around hardware cloth with a million zip ties, then climbing down a vertical bar setup which they refuse to do. I do think Captain morgan wouldn't think twice about going into a ferret cage. He honestly believes no one can touch him and that he's invincible....


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

why does he want to have them all in one place so bad? its still going to be the same amount of work in cleaning the 2 spaces. i don't know, i guess i just don't see the point of taking the risk however slight or making the rats stressed out.


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

He wants them in the same place because having 2 big cages in the house is running into space issues. He has his ferrets downstairs currently, in the winter though that will become a problem because the basement is only partially heated meaning they might get too cold. My basement is finished, but the heat doesn't work well enough to keep his critters warm enough it keeps the hardwood floors warm enough in the winter, it makes it so the basement is bearable but if your spending any amount of time down there you really want the space heaters going. He doesn't want to run the space heaters 24/7 he sees it as a safety hazard. We have contacted the heating and cooling people about the issue and basically they are saying we would need a new furnace in order to heat the extra 1500 sq ft of basement. New furnace, new duct work= $4000. 

My rats are currently in the living room next to my computer desk. We can't use up more space in that room or we will have something on every single wall and I can't stand the cluttered look. I don't want them in the kitchen because of hygienic reasons even though there is space. The formal dinning room won't hold a cage along with the table that is in there currently and the fish tanks. (Although I'd love to get rid of the fish and their monster tanks, if I get rid of his salt water tanks that will be a MAJOR issue). The boys are in one bedroom with a triple bunk bed set and their dressers. I could put one of the cages under the loft bed, but either way the boys would be woken up as all of them are loud! There isn't room in our room and my boyfriend is a light sleeper. The other bedroom is filled with toys for the kids, a futon and entertainment center. Basically there just isn't room on the main floor. 

My solution... send the ferrets to live with my friend for the winters. She has 6 ferrets at her house, tons of space for them and his ferrets get along with hers really well (surprisingly). He doesn't want to leave his "babies" somewhere for that long, he suggested I get rid of the rats... Ummm yeah right! His ferrets are new, my rats have been here forever. I explained awhile ago when he was talking about getting them that this would become and issue. He said he would work it out... ok fine. Yeah this is how he wants it worked out!!!!


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## Poppyseed (Feb 1, 2007)

that and even if all goes well, there is the irritating smell of ferret urine and feces that the rats would have to deal with. Even if you clean everyday they have a very strong smell to their excrement. I agree with separating the cages.

How many ferrets does he have? If it's just two one level will be fine but if it's more than that I would do two levels personally. Even if all they do is eat, sleep and poo in their cage they need to be able to sleep far enough away from the level the poo in.


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## JulesMichy (Apr 8, 2007)

lovinmyworm said:


> I don't see escape as an issue so much as I see them freaking out, not wanting to be in their home, and generally changing their personalities. Escaping would mean getting around hardware cloth with a million zip ties, then climbing down a vertical bar setup which they refuse to do.


I would be very worried about escaping. Zip ties can be chewed through, hardware cloth can be pushed/pulled away. We've had people here whose rats have escaped hardware cloth covered cages before. Which is to say nothing of how determined the ferrets might be to get to your rats.


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## 709Juggalette (Jul 20, 2008)

I wouldn't do it!

I used to have a friend who would take his ferret over and let it run around.The ferret would go nuts trying to get my rats! Even when we closed the room the rats were in off,the ferret smelled them and went nuts trying to get to them.


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## phaidraft (Apr 9, 2008)

JulesMichy said:


> lovinmyworm said:
> 
> 
> > I don't see escape as an issue so much as I see them freaking out, not wanting to be in their home, and generally changing their personalities. Escaping would mean getting around hardware cloth with a million zip ties, then climbing down a vertical bar setup which they refuse to do.
> ...


Ditto.


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## A1APassion (Jul 29, 2007)

this is a very bad idea

I have ferrets & they are kept on different floors of the house.

My ferrets get free range time as well & even though the rats are upstairs in a bedroom... they know they are in the house. One time I was looking for one of the ferrets that had ran upstairs & guess where I found him.... yup, running circles around the base of the rat cage trying to figure out how to get a better look at the rats that are elevated a few feet off the floor. I can only imagine what I might have found if my cage was set on the floor.
<shudders>

I always make sure to close doors but this one time I was unaware that my daughter was home & sleeping when I let the ferrets out. She had woke up & went to take a shower so she was completely unaware that the ferrets were out. Our standard practice now is that I check the room where the rats are before letting the ferrets out each & every time & even if she is in there sleeping, I'll wake her to let her know the ferrets are out.


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

I check the zip ties on my other cage daily, count them actually. The hardware cloth would need to be pulled away and that's a bit hard with that many zip ties. I went through over 100 zip ties on my current cage to make sure it's on there good. Rats don't free range anywhere near the ferrets. Ferrets go in the basement and that is the only place they are allowed to go. Basement door is closed at all times if anyone is down there (don't want any kids to fall down the steps). 

That said, I just don't think it's a great idea to have ferrets housed right next to the rats because of the smell. Rats will smell nothing but predator, how are they suppose to be comfortable living in their cage? I wouldn't be comfortable with lion living in the backyard next to my house!


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## JulesMichy (Apr 8, 2007)

lovinmyworm said:


> I check the zip ties on my other cage daily, count them actually. The hardware cloth would need to be pulled away and that's a bit hard with that many zip ties. I went through over 100 zip ties on my current cage to make sure it's on there good.


Let me tell you about the time that my rat, Lilah, chewed through a 1/4 inch thick hard plastic cat carrier in the time it took me to rinse her cage out in the bathtub. You sleep, don't you? They could easily work through enough zip ties to pull away a section of the cloth large enough to squeeze through within a few hours.

In other words, the possibility is there, so don't even risk it.


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## pauline (Jul 19, 2008)

i've had ferrets in the past as a child on one of the islands in scotland and we used to take them ferreting to catch rabbits yes i've eaten rabbit. the ferret often came out worse if the rat had got a hold of it, this was a wild one but i don't think it would be a good idea housing the ferrets and rats in the same area as this may cause a few arguments you could als=ways try sitting there cages next to one another for a few days and see how htey get on but it would be a risk but then some animals get on with one another. i have 4 rats and they get on fine with my cats the rats are the boss!


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## geebus (Jun 23, 2008)

Im not reading it correctly maybe - but its sounds like the problem
is actually you getting the four new rats? - how about you don't get them...

And "up at the lake" ........ are you talking about a lake side holiday home?


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## geebus (Jun 23, 2008)

Also, if your worried about zip ties - change over to metal wire ties
then no risk of chewing them off -


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

I'm getting the new rats, there is someone on this board who's rats they are. She can't care for them anymore. She really has no one else unless she wants them to become snake food. 

Up at the lake means yes out summer cottage. I'm not really worried about zip ties much, I just think it's a stupid idea to keep ferrets next to rats!! I don't even take them to the lake in the same car let alone let them live together in basically the same cage with a few metal bar separating them. Currently they aren't even allowed on the main floor of the house! The main problem in the entire situation is that his ferrets will be cold in the winter. I pointed that out to him before he got the stupid things, but he waits till now to go "O wait this might a problem" when I start talking about a bigger cage for the rats. I could keep my current cages and the cage the new rats will come in and just switch the cages up at the lake (his ferrets take the superpet cage with some modification, and mine take the 1 story FN). Anyways, thank you all for voting, I'm going to show him that tonight.


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

geebus said:


> Im not reading it correctly maybe - but its sounds like the problem
> is actually you getting the four new rats? - how about you don't get them...
> 
> And "up at the lake" ........ are you talking about a lake side holiday home?


she had the rats first, she's not talking about getting new ones. the ferrets came later. i'm not sure about the lake house actually.... but i don't htink it matters. it seems like she's talking about permanent living arrangements.

in any case there have been a lot of comments to discourage having the rats and ferrets living so close together. between stress on the rats, stress to their immune system with ferret odor and the possibility of an escape gone REALLY bad, even if its remote. i think that should give teh BF enough pause before going ahead with this plan. even if it means an eyesore in the living room or a compromise somewhere else in the house caging them clsoe together such does not seem like a smart thing to do, a different arrangement needs to be made. 

could you move the fish tanks to the basement and the ferrets to the dining room? the tanks have their own heaters so they shouldn't be affected by the temperature change in teh basement during the winter. it would be a pain to move but it may be a better solution then having the ferrets and rats together.


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

I thought about moving the tanks, but that would make cleaning the tanks really hard, plus I worry alot about water damage. 2 years ago we had a tank spring a leak. Granted these are new tanks it could still happen. Upstairs is easy to clean, downstairs will be going through tons of carpet and padding and need replaced possibly causing water damage on the new walls downstairs too. Also, his hoses and such won't reach upstairs and you can't get good connection on the utility sink in the basement. 

The lake house matters because with these new rats coming in I need more space for them up at the lake. I would be fine with these cages we have currently in the house, but I started talking about the 151 being used for my rats up at the lake and the superpet being used for his ferrets up there. He thought about moving my current rat cage to the lake (which would be adequate), then taking that 151 and bringing it home and adding the other 2 to the top of it, and bringing his current cage to the lake for his ferrets. 

I talked about switching 2 cages... he talks about moving everything around, purchasing new cages and putting his stupid ferrets next to my rats.. all this because he's too stupid to think about winter time and the need for heat downstairs where he houses his stupid ferrets at home. Instead of thinking this through BEFORE purchasing the ferrets, he waits till I talk about switching 2 cages and then wants to think of a plan for winter. 

I told him it's not going to happen, he wants to argue. I told him I would post it here and that if the majority says yes then fine I would do it. (Knowing that you guys aren't idiots and would never vote his way) He will see the results, see as per our agreement that the majority says "bad idea" and drop it and I get what I want. You guys are just basically settling and argument for me. I'm soooo glad he isn't this stupid when it comes to other things!!! He's usually really level headed, I've never had him argue about something so stupid before in my life but I think he's just desperate for a winter solution (which is his problem, his pets his problem).


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

so, he's going to be reading this? then is really a good idea to admit that this is kinda a setup to get your way (though i agree with your way)? and do you really think calling him stupid repeatedly (even though the idea was away out in left field here) in a public forum is a good way to go? if i were him i wouldn't take very kindly to it all.... which would likely start another argument... just saying, you may want to edit your posts a bit before having him read.


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## geebus (Jun 23, 2008)

Everything is mildly less confusing now thanks -


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

No, he's ACTING stupid, never said he WAS stupid... big big difference! He's a really smart guy, but think about it even smart people have dumb moments. I was talking to him last night about this and told him that in all the years I've known him that this has got to be one of the stupidest things he's ever said or even suggested and that I don't understand why he would suggest it. Trust me it isn't hurting his feelings, he already has the link to this post and already has read it and everything I've said. No argument whatsoever, he's actually seeing that perhaps it was a stupid idea afterall. 

Yes it's a set up, told him that before I started this post that he wasn't going to ever win this argument especially on a forum of rat lovers, but if he wanted some real opinions and other people's votes (because he honestly believed he was going to be in the majority here) that I would post the thread. 

I don't tip toe around my boyfriend, if he's acting dumb I will call him on it and I expect him to do the same for me.


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## geebus (Jun 23, 2008)

God this could get awkward!


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## JulesMichy (Apr 8, 2007)

lovinmyworm said:


> No, he's ACTING stupid, never said he WAS stupid...


Yes you did.



> ...all this because *he's too stupid* to think about winter time and the need for heat downstairs...


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## twitch (Jan 4, 2007)

JulesMichy said:


> lovinmyworm said:
> 
> 
> > No, he's ACTING stupid, never said he WAS stupid...
> ...


in either case she seems to have explained herself on that matter. and it appears that her BF is not taking offense so i guess it doesn't matter one way or the other. 

so, putting the ferrets and rats together is obviously out but you're still having spacing issue. what are you going to do? for curiousity sake, if you don't mind answering


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## geebus (Jun 23, 2008)

I have a serious suggestion (i know shock horror- )


Instead of heat the entire air space which appears to be a financial
hold back - how about moving either the rats or ferrets into the
basement but creating one heated area with the cage... considering
winter chill being the primary concern from what i can gather..?

This could be established with a cheap and *extremely* versatile product
called "heat cord" with some creativity to heat a hide (plastic tub etc).. or
failing that and perhaps easier would be to install a radiant heat panel.

Heat Cord:









Heat Panel:


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## lovinmyworm (Feb 18, 2008)

It's not so much a financial reason for no heat downstairs (ok it is because I'm not dropping that much $ on a separate furnace just for the ferrets). The space heaters though scare me, they are a fire hazard! I don't mind them when we are downstairs watching a movie, but I don't want them on all the time! The last thing we need is the house catching on fire! He read through this thread last night and finally agreed that they can't be together (duh) and that he has to figure out a solution. I just called him to tell him you posted about that heat cord and heat panel. If all else fails he's going to have to give them to my friend for the winter to hang out with her ferrets. Yes I called him stupid about not thinking about this sooner. Honestly, it's like getting a new pet but forgetting to purchase it toys, or a cage. Just not thinking it through all the way. I knew a solution in my head (taking them to my friends house for the winter) so that's the only reason why I agreed to let him have them in the house to begin with. Anyways, that part doesn't matter me and him don't really let alot bother us and this i no way would start a fight. (other than him wanting to put the ferrets next to my rats anyways). I don't sensor myself around him, he doesn't sensor himself around me. It all works better that way!


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