# My rat just growled at me.



## HeatherElle (Aug 16, 2012)

No joke, he growled just like a dog. I had no idea rats could even make that sound. Please tell me someone else has seen this, because I feel like I'm going crazy! 

Monty is my problem child, he only gets along with one other rat, the one he came with- we have 5 total. Any time we've tried to introduce him to the other guys he starts crabwalking and attacks- he's drawn blood twice so we've kept them separated since. He has cage aggression issues too, he'll bite through the bars if you get close enough and he's _fast_. This morning he bit me when I tried to give him a treat and just now, he literally jumped away and growled at me when I tried to pick him up. Is 20 months too old for a neuter? Would it even help or is he just a psychopath? The boy he came with is super gentle and sweet, so I'm fairly certain it's not his background.


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## HeatherElle (Aug 16, 2012)

Oh and we've had him for almost 3 months now and have seen no improvement despite regular handling. Just not sure what to do with this guy!


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## Jokerfest (Sep 25, 2012)

20 months is not to old so long as he is in good health.
He sounds like he's got hormonal aggression issues, My boy Romeo acted a lot like you're describing before his neuter. He'd attacked my hands on several occasions and had me gushing blood everywhere.
He attacked his cage mates regularly and had to be separated when he couldn't be watched.
He was around one year old when we got him neutered and it's been about a month now and he is a totally changed rat.
He lives with my other boys without issue and even grooms and snuggles with them now.
He's still skittish but his aggression is gone and he's warming up to me with time. I used to think he was insane or something but now I know he was just being driven insane by hormones. I'd talk to your vet about possibly neutering him and ask if your vet thinks he is healthy enough for one.

I've never heard a rat growl. I know they can hiss though and that is what it sounds like he did from your discription.


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## HeatherElle (Aug 16, 2012)

Thanks for your response! He's very healthy as far as I can tell. Our vet sees rats more of a courtesy than anything else so I'm not sure if they'd be able to do a neuter there but I'm going to ask about it. He is just a big, fluffy ball of angry right now and it's not fun for either of us. I know the growling thing sounds completely insane but I swear he growled at me lol! Maybe it was hissing, it seemed a lot lower and grumblier than what I'd imagine hissing to sound like though. Crazy, lol.


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## Jokerfest (Sep 25, 2012)

I would look for a exotic vet who has done rat neuters before to do surgery on your boy.
Having a inexperienced vet do it greatly increases the chance he wont live through it or have complications. 
I've read about vets not getting both testicals even, seriously find someone experianced even if it's a bit of a drive it's only for his neuter.


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## HeatherElle (Aug 16, 2012)

Yeah, that's why I just said I was going to ask about it. I definitely want someone who's experienced with a good track record. We just won't do the neuter if I can't find someone I'm comfortable with.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Check out my previous comments in immersion training. It could still work. If he doesn't respect you as his alpha, he won't get along with any other members of your pack. After three months even immersion is likely to get ugly, but at least it's over fast.

As to growling, I have a rat that growls just like a dog... its very rare though. Today when my daughter handed her off to me she snarled at my daughter and lept back, neither of us is sure why. But it was only for a second.

Actually the first time she did it was quite freaky, we were on hour 7 of training introductions and my daughter had passed out on the floor. Our new rat hopped up on my sleeping daughter's head and she stood up on her hind feet, her black eyes flashed stop light red and she growled at me... You could have directed an entire horror movie around that scene. Before we adopted Amelia, she lived in a home with several other animals including dogs and must have picked up that behavior there. She's actually a great friendly rat. And she's only growled a few times and never bit anyone. For some reason she still flashes her eyes at my daughter but I've only seen it twice and today I snuck up behind my daughter when she told me Amelia was flashing her and in fact she was. I don't know why but Amelia never flashes her eyes or growls at me. I guess it's an alpha thing.

Before we ever showed Amelia her cage we locked ourselves and our other rat into the hallway with her, and we stayed there and played and managed the rat introduction and after about 8 straight hours we put Amelia in her new cage with her new cagemate and they collapsed into a single heap. When everyone woke up the next day, I was the still the only alpha in the house and my pack had a new member and my tired old shoulder rat had a new BFF. Now granted Fuzzy Rat is too old to ever win a fair fight with Amelia, but she's smart enough to just roll over when Amelia gets mad about Fuzzy Rat stealing her food and Amelia instinctively grooms her... then Fuzzy Rat rolls back over and immediately steals the rest of Amelia's food. If they very rarely have a minor squabble, I just shout "girls stop fighting" from whatever room I'm in and they do. When you're the only alpha and all of your rats belong to your pack, you don't get bit and you don't have rat on rat aggression. It's as simple as that.


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## HeatherElle (Aug 16, 2012)

Thanks Rat Daddy, I'll check out your previous comments! And thank you for confirming I'm not losing it, lol! It was just like you said- lept back and growled, just for a second. No red eyes though haha. The guy we got him from did have a little Jack Russell...hmmm. I feel like we've got a good pack leader thing going on with our other 3 boys, we can just shout at them to stop fighting and they will, etc. None of them ever acted anything like this one though.


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## ratclaws (Nov 11, 2012)

The red eyes you're referring to isn't them "flashing" or whatever due to aggression or behaviour... It's more than likely your rat has the kind of eyes that appear black but then under certain lighting you can see the middle of the eye is actually a dark ruby colour. Usually it's a trait that Roan rats have. As for rats growling, I've only ever heard them make higher pitched noises! It is strange though sometimes the vocalisations they do come out with; my girlfriend's rat Milly makes some strange noises sometimes. She makes the kind of noises that make us think she has an impending URI but then we realise it's her vocal cords it's coming from and not her breathing!


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Amelia had a pretty broad vocabulary of strange sounds she made when we got her, different kinds of squeaks, a growl and something that sounded like a cat fighting. During her immersion she was actually pretty vocal, afterwards she's become normally quiet.

Yes, most likely Amelia's eyes are red under black, but in strong sunlight they actually appear green. She's a high white so we all know that often means strange eyes and Amelia is no exception. What I didn't realize until recently is she seems to be able to do the bright red flash when she wants to for effect and/or knows how to avoid it from happening at random. I hadn't seen it in months, but my daughter was getting flashed... I actually stood behind her and Amelia was crouching in the bottom of her cage flashing her eyes at my little girl. She stopped when she saw me. I don't believe that Amelia was mad at my daughter or that she knew she looked really intimidating doing it, but if it were random based on the lighting, I would see it more often because I handle her a few hours every day.


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## ratclaws (Nov 11, 2012)

Milly had just always been like that, she's otherwise quiet but makes the strangest noises when she wants attention from inside the cage, and also being held. My girl Rosie is also vocal but she only does one kind of squeak; it sounds like a high pitched dog toy kind of squeak. She does it when Storm is trying to groom her or she's being chased or stroked more than she likes haha. I know about high whites having strange eye colours, but I don't think it's scientifically possible for a rat's eyes to flash... It's not something that's ever been properly documented or seen before. It is most likely just the lighting angles, sometimes my girl Storm's redness will come out of her eyes but it's only when she's facing a certain way in relation to a light source. You have most likely just not noticed it as much before now.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

As to the eye flashing, I can't say how she does it, whether it's by dilating her pupils, or tilting her head to reflect the light in just the right way... but I've come to believe she can do it when she wants to and knows it gets an immediate reaction. Attached is a photo of her normally (no red despite the camera lights actually reflecting back in the photo)... when her eyes flash bright red, she really looks spooky and my 7 year old daughter usually jumps back, so I think she's figured out what she's dong to elicit that reaction when she wants it. Otherwise it would happen at random more often.


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## bbrats (Jan 21, 2013)

@Rat Daddy. AWWW shes the cutest most innocent rat i've ever seen! haha. Doesn't look like she could be a possessed demon looking rat at all haha. ...I imagine that would make it a lot creepier. haha


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

It's precisely her cuteness that makes the flashing stop light red eyes so spooky. And because her eyes are so black you don't expect it. If you look into her eyes in daylight they actually look green rather than red... It's like that red eye phenomenon you got with old flash pictures and blue eyed people.

It's like a scene right out of a horror movie... the foreshadowing scene when the pretty girls eyes glow and her fangs drop and you realize she's a vampire. One off of really pretty is actually scary. I mean we've all seen it work in movies but you just don't think about it until you look down at your furry pet and the demon spawn looks back.

Amelia has yet to flash our resident rat phobic, basically because they can't be on the same floor of the house unsupervised and she does it so rarely, but if it ever happens it will be the scream heard coast to coast. Warnings have been issued, but that won't help. I'm also pretty sure if she growls at that same time, it won't make things any better.


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## socal_sarah (Mar 5, 2013)

Bwahaha, I have to say that I LOVE the last paragraph you posted! I would KILL to see that happen! Btw, any chance you can get your daughter to record her doing the eye flashing? I'm curious what that looks like, especially since she definitely looks like Miss Innocent.


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