# VERY Aggressive Rat



## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

Hello! I work at PetSmart as a pet care associate. One day someone returned a rat saying he was aggressive to the other rats. I figured that was fair enough, but he couldn't be that bad right? So we put him in the back room to let him calm down. The other day I tried to hold my hand to his face to see if he would sniff, and he bit me. I guess I deserved it though; we call it the "Quiet Room" but there were birds squawking and guinea pigs squeaking, he must have been scared. But today I needed to change his food. All I did was reach my hand in to clear soiled food and he bit me really hard! I was gushing blood for a minute or two, no exaggeration. Maybe he thought I was invading his territory but he needed new food. Is there a reason for this behavior? Or is he just a bad rat? We can't sell him and I can't take an aggressive rat, but I want him to find a home.. If there was a way to train him to be good I would consider.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

This thread will teach you how to fix a screwed up rat... Most biting rats can be fixed...

http://www.ratforum.com/showthread.php?67442-Immersion-Training-The-Guide

Its no easy process and can entail you getting bit. But basically there are two options, immersion and neutering, both work better for different problems. But there's no easy fix. An extreme immersion session involves you locking yourself in a small room with a biting rat... this can get unpleasant before it gets playful. Most people who have done it successfully, don't buy a second biting rat. 

Otherwise you might want to contact a local rat rescue that might have trained people to take this rat off your hands. And you are right, you shouldn't sell him to some unsuspecting child for 10% off, like a certain other PetSmart does when they have a biting rat. I have a daughter and rats I actually like to think of, so I can't take on this kind of challenge, but if you post a location there might be someone skilled and crazy enough to be interested in this rat lurking about here, there's also an adoption section here.

I'm sure your manager isn't going to be excited about _giving_ this rat to someone, but anyone naive enough to pay for a biting rat isn't likely skilled enough to fix him....

I know it's ironic, that the people with the best skills are usually least likely to take on this kind of challenge. Trust me, there's a reason.

Best luck in finding the right forever home for this little guy.


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## etolou (Nov 11, 2013)

I'm sorry that I can't be of much help; I've only owned girls whose furthest expression of aggression is licking to death. I just wanted to say how wonderful it is to see that someone at a big chain pet store really cares about the animals, especially the rats. Kudos to you for being a good person! Best of luck!


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## Awaiting_Abyss (Jul 24, 2012)

Best option would be to cull him. There is no sense in further tainting the rat species.If Petsmart isn't able to cull him then they can give him away for free and label him as a very aggressive rat. My local Petsmart did this a while back.


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## Ergala (Jan 23, 2014)

If you were near me I'd take him. I like a challenge and to me the angriest little critters are the ones that need the most love. There is no hopeless case, just cases that require us to think more outside of the box.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

@Rat Daddy: Wow, that's a lot of information! I am a bit confused on the immersion training. >< Maybe I'm just tired. I know if I were to take on this challenge I'd need to do a lot more research. I couldn't get him neutered if I took him though, would that be a problem? I have no problem with being bitten, that wouldn't bother me. My manager is really cool. Sometimes we adopt out animals that are really sick and need attention from someone else, or animals that are cosmetically injured. He would be okay with giving him away because he is a pretty vicious rattie. But no the PetSmart I work at would never try to sell him without at least letting someone know he was very aggressive. @etolou: Thank you!  I really do care about the animals. Sometimes I complain about how we put business over the animals' needs, but for the most part my PetSmart is very good to the animals. @Awaiting_Abyss: Is culling neutering? >< @Ergala: I totally agree.


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## Awaiting_Abyss (Jul 24, 2012)

Culling, in the way I'm using it, means put to sleep. Sadly he has most certainly already been bred before he arrived at your store (Petsmart almost always gets adults because the mill breeds them and then ships them to stores), so he's already passed on his aggression. In my opinion, it would be better for rats to cull him. But hey, I'm just a person who cares about rats as a species rather than each rat. I'd rather see the species improve rather than save the ones that will continue to bring the species down.

Sorry to go on and on, I was just trying to explain myself.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Culling means to remove from the group... often it's a euphemism for putting an animal to sleep, I don't know which definition was intended...

And no if you fix this rat in immersion you won't need to neuter him. Basically, it's a process where you literally show him who's boss and then become fast friends. You see you really can't make friends with a rat that's attacking you. Usually once a rat realizes that you are the big bad alpha human a light bulb goes on that says that he would be way better off being your friend. Some rats put up a brave fight for a few minutes then realize the error of their ways while others can engage in mortal combat for quite a while before they get that you are just bigger and badder than they are. Rats in the wild fight for status in this way too. Once a rat loses it's bid for alpha status, it usually backs down and joins in behind the stronger alpha rat or in your case becomes your pal. Rats are social creatures much like humans... after the Japanese Empire got nuked, they became our favorite trading partners and play nicely with us. It's perhaps not a very politically correct concept, but it works on a micro as well as a macro level.

Now don't get confused... you are never trying to actually hurt a rat during immersion... just communicate that you are no chew toy and get it's respect, then you can work on building trust and bonds of love. Thick clothes in layers and oven mitts can make things a lot less painful for you, but keep in mind rats are fast and agile and have very sharp teeth. Part one of extreme immersion is no joke. You are trying NOT to hurt your rat while he is really trying to hurt you so he has certain unfair advantages going in.

I might note that someone has already offered to take on this rat, you might want to see if you are close to each other or find someone else with the experience and determination to take on this challenge.

I've done extreme immersion with newbies, most told me it was worth every minute of what they went through and they were very happy with their reformed rat or rats... But there's a point during almost every one of those immersions where the person actually wrote that they were bleeding, in pain and crying... Extreme immersion is a procedure that works very well most of the time, but don't confuse success with easy.

If you understand what you are getting into, extreme immersion can very well save this rat, in fact it most likely will... and it might go much better than you expect, some rats turn around in a matter of minutes... but it's a commitment you should make with your eyes open before you close the door and let a vicious rat out of its cage.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

@Awaiting_Abyss: Oh I see. PetSmart usually gets their rats a bit younger than adulthood. He is just a special case becasue he was returned and is therefore a bit older. 

@Rat Daddy: Okay, that makes a lot more sense... How exactly do I show him I'm boss? Since I'm not trying to hurt him not even gentle but firm pats on the head or side would work? 

I live in Maryland, I don't think that is close to Vermont or I totally would. :/ I will feel around and see if anyone would want to take him, though. 

That is a big commitment. I will definitely do some thinking on that. I have thought that I would train him until he was more docile and then return him to the store for sale, would that be okay? Or would he already be bonded to me? I have a bit of an addiction to animals and unless I can eventually pair him with my other adult rat (which is pretty hard right?) I do not have the resources to take care of him... I currently have 11 pets. >< But I really don't want to see him suffer...


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I'm not sure, I go along with culling to avoid a rat from accidentally breeding... Fuzzy Rat was amazing by just about any and every standard, she died of mammary tumors at under 2 1/2 years old... Of course her defective genes shouldn't have been passed on, but if she were culled at a young age, I would never have had a best rat friend, hundreds of people would never have met a true shoulder rat and there would be no immersion. 

There's a point where I agree that certain rats should be culled out of the gene pool, but another where they can't be good pets. 

As to immersing the aggressive rat goes, yes... you are bonding him to you and into your family and you are becoming his alpha. He will most likely always be prone to aggression, if someone lets him get away with it. So, if you do fix him, you would want to find him a good home with an experienced rat owner. Fixing him and then tossing him back into a display cage is likely to undo all of the work you have done. Imagine adopting a kid for a couple of weeks and the day he calls you and your spouse mom and dad you bounce him back to the orphanage... I can't count the ways that would go wrong.

Maybe someone knows a rat rescue group or will respond to a post under the adoption section here... or maybe you might find someone you know who wants him once you fix him, where you can do a managed hand off.

The problem is that rats aren't like pocket pets... think of them like dogs or puppies. Their intelligence and emotional level is pretty much on par. (dogs can learn more human words, but rats have much better spacial abilities) So pretend you are dealing with a dog that someone screwed up and everything I've written will start to make sense to you. I know rats are comparatively small, but their brains evolved for millions of years before canines or humans. And an I-Pad has more processing power than an old IBM mainframe. Don't let size mislead you, rats are very complex animals.


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## Ergala (Jan 23, 2014)

Sadly Maryland is quite a hike  I agree with Rat Daddy on so many levels. People see a rat and assume their thoughts go something like this "food food food BITE!". If you just watch them for a bit you can see they are working things out, they are figuring US out. Absolutely fascinating little critters and I respect them so much. Whenever Pacha is scared of something she doesn't run away, she runs to me for safety. She knows I will protect her, now that screams of trust and intelligence. I hope your little guy gets some help and someone to show him love and discipline. Maybe on your lunch breaks you could take him on as a project, ask your manager if you could work with him. I honestly believe that if he is healthy and the biting is due to a traumatic event or a learned behavior he can absolutely be reformed and taught to not do it. He sounds like he is full of potential, I wish I could witness the day he gave a kiss instead of a nip.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

I guess the culling thing is confusing to me... Why cull a rat, like Freak (what I named the biter) or Fuzzy Rat for example if they never breed in their life? It's already too late to prevent that gene from speading because it already spread to Freak and Fuzzy Rat. Sorry, maybe I'm just being stupid. I just don't really understand. :/ 

That is really cool though, so you would just take Fuzzy Rat with you and she would just chill on your shoulder?

That is what I guessed... The only way I could take him is if I could eventually pair him with Ratty. But he will always be prone to agressive tendencies, right? I don't want Ratty to get hurt, it isn't worth jeapordising his health. But I've already gotten attached to him, go figure. ><

I will go post on the adoption section right now. I don't really know anyone who would take him as far as an adoption group besides an animal shelter and that wouldn't work. Also, I went to get some things for my animals today at PetSmart and they put him out on the floor... I was like what the f**k? But maybe someone will buy him. I will warn people about his tendencies but I don't know if everyone will. 

That's true. I know they're smart but I guess I underestimate how smart they really are. 

Thanks.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

@Ergala: That's what I'm beginning to love about rats too. What I was seeking in hamsters and mice I've finally found in rats. They are really loving and are always communicating. I just wish I could communicate back a little better. >< I will definitely ask to work with him, I'd love to do that.

I feel the same way. I really connect with him as crazy as it sounds. He's been neglected and probably is bitter, he just bites for attention. If I had been mistreated I'd be bitter too. I'd reach out for someone to love me. I really hope so too.


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

Biting can be fixed through immersion. Iris, my rat, came to me a biter. I have that thread where I'm tired of bleeding, crying, sweating as I battle it out with a rat who is well equipped to hurt me while I'm trying to not hurt her. 

And guess what? Right now she lives with ten other rats. Met them as kits when everyone said she'd kill them.
View attachment 117322
shes the brown rat on the bottom
View attachment 117330
she loves building nests for the mischief and everyone crams in there. There's actually five rats in this tiny hut, you can see three. 

She hasn't bitten me in earnest since immersion. She's blind and bossy so she does nip but never hard - usually things she can't be sure what they are, like my feet and socks. She is a lovely girl and a member of the family -- aunty Iris!


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## Gannyaan (Dec 7, 2012)

I've never had a biting rat, but I've had rescue ray with weird behaviour and strange pasts.... They can change. Give it a go if you are up for it...


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

@nanashi7: That is very reassuring! And adorable. How long was your immersion session?

I did read all of Rat Daddy's posts on immersion in depth and wow... It was a lot. But It was really informative and I think I can do it. First I have to re-immerse Ratty because I did it wrong. >< Rats really are intelligent and complex in the way they socialize. But I had no idea that they don't need to acclimate (to their cage). I've had hamsters and all I hear is give them time to acclimate. But rats are different on so many levels which is why I love rats. Once I rid Ratty of mites I think I will definitely get Freak and work with him. I'm not worried about being bitten, but I do want Freak to find a good home. He was already returned by a family that didn't know how to deal with aggressive rats... But I think in the end he just needs love. I'd die if Ratty and Freak could cuddle together eventually... my rescue rats.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

I think I will Gannyaan. :3


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

Also Fuzzy Rat on the beach... I think that is one of the coolest things I've ever seen!


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

I was dealing with a messed up rescue who was blind and deaf so my playing field was by no means level. It took a week. But more than that, it is an ongoing relationship. I'll come back to that point hopefully. 

The first goal is to find why he bites. Is he afraid? Is he aggressive? Is he just a brat? An afraid rat will bite as a reaction. An aggressive rat can bite without any seeming approach. A brat rat bites because they think they're in control. Each has a different response - should you be tough-handed swatting and pinning? Soft and pliable with treats and murmurs of love? Or do you focus on doing the opposite of what he is demanding? Usually brat rats want you gone, simply put. Don't touch ne, get out my cage, go away their bites say. Iris was a brat who was messed up and thus in part aggressive. She'd bite because she was walking by or I tried to pet her. About sixteen hours later, i realized she had no clue what love was. She didn't know why I was bothering her or what was happening. She didn't know how to be handled or pet. She was over a year and knew nothing of humans! This is also the important time to realize if you are dealing with a rat who suffers an affliction causing biting behavior -- so much time would've been saved if I realized my rat was blind and deaf, as some nips didn't need to be investigated or punished as she just was feeling her way around a strange new world. 

Then you react to it. This is when you either gear up to try and save yourself some wounds or take another approach. For Iris, it started by showing her I was intelligent and static. I wasn't going anywhere and I was flooding her with love. I kept her cage near me as much as possible so I could reach ins Nd treat her or just talk to her throughout the day. Once she got that I was smart, she stopped attacking indiscriminately and started investigating me. But if I stopped doing what she wanted, she'd bite telling me where the lines were. So I would push there incessantly until she stopped biting -- either ignore her trying to gnaw my hand while I pick her up or swat her and pin her. Now, I'm not saying beat your rats or hurt them or anything. The swatting is mostly a reaction to this pain that is clamped onto your flesh and getting it away. But it does well enough to shock the rat. The pin is like a dominance maneuver but is overall useful as a human for restraining your rat and communicating. A vet will do a pin of sorts in examination so it's nice to have them used to it. 


Once you level that playing field, you get to start out as if with a new rat and socialize. Okay, you were mean and told your kid no candy at the store. Now be a little nice and loving and enjoy your time together. 
The only difference is this rat will require special attention. It should be seen a victim of abuse that screwed it up. Just because you put the patient on meds on one consultation, doesn't mean he can leave the psych ward. He may need extra bonding time where you cuddle and reaffirm positive interaction. He may need re-immersion as you remind him he isn't in charge of anything. 


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## Crezzard (Jul 20, 2013)

Hi just wanted to share my biting rat story to give you hope!y rat Gary was extremely aggressive and would puff her fur and lunge at me everytime I went in the cage. It hurts so bad when they bite I was covered in plasters. One day I had enough and decided immersion was my only option. Being short on time due to work and other animal commitments I decided the best way for me to bond with her is carry her around in a bonding pouch. I took her everywhere. If I tried to stroke her she would bite me lol. Then gradually she started getting more interested in me and by day 2 she wouldn't go in the bag she just stayed on my shoulder, she let me stroke her, pick her up, kiss her face..... Sadly she passed away but she did develop a lovely personality and loving nature xxx good luck xxxxx



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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I'd love to take credit for training Fuzzy Rat, but in all reality she taught me more than I ever taught her. Mainly, I just stepped back and let her evolve and tried to keep her from getting killed, she really was too fearless for an animal her size. She was both smart and lucky, good traits for a shoulder rat.

My daughter was swimming with other children that day at the beach and she jumped right into the lake on her own and swam from kid to kid, actually winding up sitting on a heavy fellows bald head while he was floating around on an inner tube. He was a very good sport about it. It was hysterical and as always, she was amazing... I just found a video of Fuzzy Rat swimming with my daughter, it was taken at sunset but it has her actually climbing up the ladder of the floating dock.. it was great fun to see again...

I've been accused of promoting extreme immersion. Actually, I posted it with a warning label, not a sales job. If you understand the risks and the rewards, ask any other questions you have before you start, because once you close the door and open the cage things can get exciting very quickly.

Best luck.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

@nanashi7: Thank you! That clears up a lot of my confusion on immersion training. I think Freak is just a brat rat. I'm not sure though. But I will give him lots of love.  The other day my coworker petted him on the head with no problem, but as soon as i put my hand in the enclosure he bit me even harder than the first two times. >< I think the hardest part for me will be asserting that dominant alpha rat vibe. Also wow, how did you figure out your rat was blind?

@Crezzard: Thanks! That's actually a great idea to just carry your rat around. :3

@Rat Daddy: Wow.  That is truly amazing. Okay, I do have one question: How should I introduce Freak to Ratty? After I immerse Freak, of course, and he isn't being bitey and understands I'm the master he has to go into a cage. What do I do as far as introductions? I don't want Ratty to get hurt and if Freak doesn't accept Ratty I'll have to take him back. Maybe it will be easy if he is properly immersed? Also would adding two young boys to the mix (much later of course) be a good idea or would the two be happy with each others' companionship? Thanks!


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

Also wow, how did you figure out your rat was blind?
I took the idiots route of getting bit up a bunch. She had the head sway of a visually impaired rat, but she has black eyes not the lighter red or pink ones that mark near blindness. I hit this breaking point a couple days in and posted how I was getting bit to pieces and how I couldn't tell when she would bite -- animals don't bite without reason, and usually it's easy to say X caused Y. But I wasn't "x"ing and she was biting. Someone asked if she was blind so I ran her to the vet and they confirmed and added she wouldn't react to sound and was likely deaf - she can hear loud stuff sometimes though. 

What do I do as far as introductions?
It should be simple enough. How old would you put both boys? You really just take them to a neutral zone and have them meet. Prior to, I would put them near each other with cage bars separating them to watch for hostile behavior (lunging biting hissing puffing up). While meeting in the neutral zone (somewhere neither have played) your job is to watch for aggression, monitor interactions and intervene. It's normal for the rats to wrestle and squeak and chase and sound and look like they're fighting but you stop them before and especially after any blood is drawn. Usually it's a quick matter of dominance assertion and your role is mostly to referee and remind them you are their loving but alpha parent. 

Also would adding two young boys to the mix (much later of course) be a good idea or would the two be happy with each others' companionship? Plenty of people do this; bonded rats won't be disturbed by the adding of others. I have 11 rats but my original two still sleep with each other, groom and play and share treats (!). They do the same with others (their sons and daughters and Iris), but you can really see how bonded they are to each other. Sometimes adding others helps even - my original two, Remus and Caius, obviously love each other. But, Remus is hyper and Caius is subdued. Remus thus would bully her by accident. With the others, he can frolic and wrestle the others and she can rest. When he's done, he'll go cuddle her. 


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

First, you will be more of a parent and less of a master, unlike dogs, rats don't obey you, they more or less take suggestions from you rather than orders. Being metacognative they process your requests rather than accept your orders.

And yes, once both rats are bonded to you, you bring them both together around you and build them into your pack by managing the introductions hands on. In the wild, the alpha manages the introductions and decides who can join the pack and then makes the introductions. The pack usually follows the alpha's lead and accepts the rats he approves of. If there is discord among the pack about new members the alpha usually settles it by intervening appropriately before fights get out of hand.

Basically, rat alphas really can't control their pack, they lead it. But they do have some authority which they use judiciously. Good alphas survive as pack leaders long after they aren't the strongest or fastest rats anymore. Unlike primate packs, rats respect qualities like experience, fairness and good judgment as much as raw strength.

Remember, think human parent blending a family together, not wolf alpha beating everyone into submission.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

@nanashi7: That's crazy that she still did the head sway... muscle memory maybe?

Hmm, Ratty is ten months... I have no idea about Freak. Slightly less older? Oh ok, so it is very similar to introducing mice... I'm just afraid that Freak will try to be all dominant (to the point of bloodshed). I don't know. 

Aww that's adorable! 

@Rat Daddy: Oh okay. That is fascinating and amazing... Rats are really intelligent on a different level. Especially respecting qualities like experience even after they're not the strongest. 

Sorry it has taken me awhile to respond. I am not sure about getting Freak. I was really excited about the opportunity and getting to save him, but currently I don't have the energy or strength. I have depression and have been trying to get my meds worked out for a year. I'm currently going through a rough patch. If he does stay on the floor for a long time my heart will probably melt and take him home anyway... But I need to get over this depressed spell. 

I don't know if I mentioned him biting me a third time... I don't know if I am just not confident enough, but my coworker petted him on the head. So, silly me decided to try again. I got bit so hard that I was gushing blood everywhere and my finger was numb for a day. I don't go near him anymore because my manager is starting to get upset with me (even though it isn't my fault totally). But I always look at him and feel bad for the fella... 

Also, I did get a second rat. I did not plan on it at all, but when a local store brought out this tiny albino guy covered in poop and scared to death, I couldn't say no. He snuggled into me and I just could not let him be snake food. I haven't introduced Lucky to Ratty yet but I will when Ratty's mites are gone (almost there!). I bet that puts a kink in the introductions maybe... ><

I cannot thank you all enough for your help, your wisdom and experience has already taught me so much!


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Treat all of your small animals with revolution. Mites make the rounds on your hands and clothes. You pretty much never get rid of them unless you do a clean sweep.

Revolution makes your rats toxic bait for mites... Your rats attract any stray mites and kill them for you.

And you may have done the right thing... For every rat you save another becomes snake food. I try to save the best of the best... the nicest and friendliest ones rather than the screwed up ones. Life really isn't fair for rats, we are all tempted to save the semi-lost cause, but while your doing that, the perfectly friendly sweet and lovable rat gets tossed in with a python... I suppose that's unfair too.

I applaud those folks that give a damaged animal a second chance... but I don't always recommend it to everyone, nor do it myself.

Congrats on your new rat and best luck on whatever you do.


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

I guess I better do that just to be safe. If I would've known how awful mites were... -_- Should I order a three pack? And I only need to put a drop on their backs right? >< Maybe I should've done this in the first place instead of spending like $200 on Ivermectin treatments and check ups... It really is unfair...  I just want to save them all even though I know I can't... I don't even think that Freak is a "brat rat" actually. I think he's just learned that fast moving things are a threat and need to be bitten. :/ Thanks. ^^


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

I think I buy the vile for cats, it did two rats and about half a dozen mice and I had some left over. It's pretty cheap, but once you open the tube the stuff evaporates.

Ivermectin was a good treatment for it's time... And before that there were cedar chips. 

I recently read an article by someone that still uses cedar chips, and I'm sure some vets still do ivermectin. There are also some folks that use flea powder like my pet shop. The sprays just don't work from personal experience.

But I tried revolution some time ago and it just wiped the mites out in a week and they never came back. It cost me about $17.00 and was worth every penny. And yes, it's one drop on the back of the neck directly on the skin. Overdoses, unless massive, aren't toxic so I usually use a little more than a drop because the rat's fur soaks some up.

Revolution is used prophetically to prevent mites and fleas, you shouldn't need to see a vet for a diagnosis, but you need to buy it through a vet. I get mine through a vet that doesn't see rats.

And, yes, it would be nice to save all rats....


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## JoshDeMott2010 (Aug 25, 2007)

I adopted a biter once he was a black and white hooded rat i named him buddy (Which was the 3rd buddy i had i liked that name as a child...) He was a fat vicious unsocialized rat that my friend had and didn't care for properly... He bought the rat and kept it in the cage and just fed/watered it he never took him out never let him see other rats. When i got him he was very... Unsavory. I had no clue what to do but through my experience working with new/wild horses i just dealt with him and allowed him every opportunity i could to attack me. After awhile he realized his attacks weren't going to make me go away and a few bandages later he was very very cooperative and never challenged me or the other rats i had again. Once he found his place in my home he was a great friend/pet... Rats, like dogs, become more comfortable when they aren't the alpha they are comfortable knowing someone else will protect them and they let their guard down. Best thing you can do it get him out of the tiny cage and get him into a large space that you can share with him. Then patiently spend time with him... Provide games, treats, a ball with a bell inside will be good for him overtime, If he attacks or bites ignore it the best you can don't let him see it have any effect at all... Once he realizes you aren't going to be deterred he will find other ways to cope with your presence... Be careful wear thick layers and gloves...


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

Ok. ^^ I have... nine furry critters including Ratty. Well I'm rescuing a hamster tomorrow so ten. >< How does the cedar chips thing work? Isn't that bad for their respiratory system? Yeah... I bought a spray and my vet told me to put it back. I only used it once. 

Ok great, I will have to get my hands on some of it. Apparently Ratty was treated with Revolution once but they put him back in mite infested bedding...  So I still need to get a vet prescription to get it off of a pet medication website? I don't even know if my vets have that... Otherwise they probably would've used it. 


Thanks, that gives me a little hope... 


So, guess what happened? They put Freak in mite infested bedding. He has red sores and blood all over him... :'( I'm starting to get EXTREMELY upset with how we don't take care of our animals well. I do everything I can but it isn't much. 

Here's some pictures if you all are interested: http://www.ratforum.com/album.php?albumid=2329 (It's just an album on my profile)


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

I totally posted something but I guess the mods didn't put it up yet... Anyway if you wanna see pics of Freak I have an album on my profile. Although some of them may be rather traumatizing... I explained in my post that never got posted that he actually has mites now. But after work I cried my eyes out after seeing how horrible he looks... That along with a mouse that has nothing but a giant scab and blood all over his back made me feel so sad I just couldn't take it... 

Anyway, hopefully that post comes up so you guys can get a proper response... Because I forget what I wrote in it... ><


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## Ergala (Jan 23, 2014)

Did you end up bringing him home???


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## RedResilience (Feb 4, 2014)

Not yet, but I plan to as soon as I can get Lucky and Ratty in the same cage... That might take awhile considering I have to buy Revolution to treat all my animals, chicken wire the big cage because Lucky can slip through... Also I don't have a good quarantine place. I've never followed it before because I didn't know but he has such severe mites... It's a big mess and a hard decision but I won't let him suffer like that... We have bonded.


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