# Considering getting 2 rats....



## DazzleKitty (Dec 11, 2011)

Hey guys,

I am wondering if you guys could help me with a few questions I have.

I am considering getting two female rats if my mom will let me. I still live with my parents and they are the type of people who think all rodents should be exterminated. :/ Basically, they are going to let me do a two-week trial with whatever I get (using Petco's two week return policy) to see if it works out. Thye KNOW I'll clean them and take care of them well (I'm 24....not 14), so I am not sure if they are using it as a bluff. But I am hoping to show them rodents aren't as bad as they perceive them.

My mom would PREFER me to get a hamster. Have any of you guys here owned hamsters? I hear they are pretty mean....always biting the hand that feeds them, not affectionate, very moody, etc. Has anyone had an affectionate hamster before? I'd really rather have something that's going to be nice to me and not bite me, you know?

I heard there are medium rats and large rats. The Petco dude said medium rats get to be six inches long, approximately. That's probably what I will be going with. What would be the minimum housing for two medium rats that I could get? My room is small so I don't want something too oversized. They'll have plenty out of the cage time anyways.

Thanks in advance.


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## Kiko (Sep 18, 2009)

Well that whole 'Medium rat, Large rat' is actually a lie. Those are the terms given to snake food rats so snake owners know what size rat to feed the snake, all rats grow to full sized which varies depending on the rat there is no medium or large.

The minimum housing for ALL rats is 2-2.5 cubic feet PER rat.

Please read our many stickies regarding rat housing, health care, ect...
Rats are expensive pets, despite what pet store employees would like us to believe, consider the one you spoke to clearly is not the know all on rats 
Rats, especially rats purchased from pet stores are very prone to URIs, and other serious illnesses that REQUIRE vet care which is anywhere from between 35-200 per visit with medication. A cage the right size for 2 rats is gonna be around 100 bucks minimum, and other supplies will run about 20 bucks a month.
Please do A LOT of research before getting these pets, they are not simple or cheap. And buying a rat from a store, and then returning is basically condemning it to snake food.

I have owned hamsters as well, they are not social, or friendly usually, (at least the ones I have had). They are pretty boring to me, but I am biased lol.

Also something to be wary of, is in pet stores and pretty much 100% of the petcos I have seen is they mix genders. Which means if you get a girl, there is a good chance she will be pregnant, and even if the employee SAYS it's a girl, ask a hundred different members here who have experienced this.....they are often wrong. And employees end up giving people a male and female rat, and when the person only wanted 2 they ended up with 15 so be very careful.

I am not trying to discourage you, but so many times have I seen people get off on the wrong foot and up with unhappy pets with unhappy owners.
And as I said, the best advice you will get from our many stickies which can be found at the top of the various sections.


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## Jaguar (Nov 15, 2009)

Don't go for a hamster. Once you've had rats you'll know why.

Avoid that Petco like the plague. Rat sizing refers to the stage of life/general size they are... it is strictly terms used for feeders (rats that get fed to snakes/reptiles). 

The employee was wrong. They will all get to be about roughly the same size, there are no "medium" or "large" rats. Genetics (and gender) can determine size, but feeder breeders and mills don't care about that stuff.

You are making a big big mistake in getting rats from a place like this, and you are pretty much asking for hardship, heartbreak, and potentially lots of vet bills in the future. Having an unsocialized rat that fear bites or gets sick and requires a lot of $$$ for the vet will not help in convincing your parents to let you keep them. 
Wait it out, look for a rescue or a breeder or IN THE VERY LEAST a pet store that cares better for their animals and at least handles them. Ask them to pick up a rat for you - if they grab it by the tail, turn around and walk away. Actually, don't walk, run. There is a small chance you could wind up with the perfect pets, but chances are slim from a place like this.

The right rats will come to you in time.

ETA: Haha Kiko ninja'd my post


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## DazzleKitty (Dec 11, 2011)

Thank you guys for the input! I'll avoid Petco in that case. There is a small family-run pet store in my area I may go to intstead.

I am thinking maybe I should just wait on the rats until I get my own place someday. It seems like they would take up more room than I am ready for. I already have a Chihuahua so I know what big vet bills are like, definitely. 

One thing forgot to mention was that I have had rats in the past. I loved them but my mom made me get rid of them, sadly. I was very young....still in elementary school. I also had a teddy bear hamster who was so mean and bit me a lot. 

However, whenever I was in Petco, I was able to hold a female teddy bear and she didn't bit me. Squirmy she was, yes. But she didn't bite. When I had my first hamster I didn't know jack about them. I was a child. I have read up on how to properly tame them now and that baby steps must be taken.

I'd definitely PREFER to have a rat. That I will say. They are much smarter, cuter, and just friendlier. But if I get a hamster, I think I'll love him/her just as much. I'll probably go with the hammy to tide me over until the day I get out on my own. Even if it's mean and doesn't like to be handled I'll likely still enjoy giving it treats and watching it play with its toys.

Hopefully someday I'll be joining ya'll here when I get some rats when I have my own place. Thank you for the input. Until then, ciao!


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## DazzleKitty (Dec 11, 2011)

Sorry to double-post. My mom had a strange change of heart....she is actually considering letting me get two rats. I saw some of the big cages that cost about $100 and I am considering giving it a go. I have to start somewhere. I remember when I had my rat a long time ago...her name was Rita....she was great. I adored her. I'd enjoy having another go.

Upon seeing the actual cage in the store, it will easily fit in my room I noticed.

I'll be honest, I am excited about it, but I am also a bit nervous. I noticed on youtube and from some posts that many people let their rats have some exercise around the house. I want them to get out of their cage often because it's cruel to never let them out. I've even seen some people let them chill next to them on the couch when letting them out. My mom never allowed this with Rita because she was scared of her. Now that we have an indoor dog, she is far more lenient.
When you let your rats run around in your home, they won't get into things and try to run away altogether, right? I know they get attached to their owners but I'd have to have one loose in the house that may even find its way outside and be gone forever. How do you prevent this and totally rat proof your house? Some of the ones at the pet store are squirmy. Do they become less squirmy the more you handle them? I'll likely find a person who has a bigger one....those look easier to keep a grip on. I'd love to find a breeder in the St. Louis, MO area but I haven't had any luck locating one. I am going to check for some local, family run pet stores. I already know of one but I am not sure I wanna get one from them....not real keen on the owners.

How often do YOU clean out your cage? Any tips on how to do it most effectively? Looking for some input and new ideas. I'm going to try litterbox training them too.

That's all I can think of for now. It's still not a for-sure thing. I'm contemplating it still.

Thanks in advance!


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

I clean weekly, mostly just change bedding and scrub things. Some people do it more often and many spot clean daily.

I don't suggest giving them freedom in the entire house. They will chew cords, probably also walls and carpet. Mine free range on my bed or on the couch and if my room has been cleaned we sometimes play hide and seek or chase on the floor. My bed is the rat domain, really.


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## DazzleKitty (Dec 11, 2011)

The bed is probably gonna be their main running spot. How often do you let them out each day? Do they tend to dive off? I'm scared of them jumping off my bed and getting hurt or hiding from me.

Another place that actually may be good for running around on the floor would be the bathroom. No cords at all and they could play with some toys of sorts.

Also, I have a little Chihuahua. How do they fare with dogs? Dixie is pretty easygoing and I am confident she won't attack, but I will still introduce them with caution.


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## mink (Jun 24, 2007)

I have a dog that I think is awesome, would never hurt a fly, but I would never chance introducing them. There are rare cases where people have been lucky. 
But - rats will naturally fear things bigger than them since they are prey animals - rats brought up correctly just love people since they've ruled people as not predators. 
My dad's psycho (ex) g/f once had a very laid-back scotty and one day she just ran up into my lap when my rat was there! I was shocked and afraid of her biting the rat (since Scotties were bred to exterminate rodents) but my rat lashed out and chomped the dog's nose! The dog went screaming, and I'm lucky it wasn't a serious bite or else its owner would have disemboweled me. 
Even if your chihuahua might not harm them, the rats could certainly draw blood. They can chew through concrete ^_^ unfortunately I have had quite a few bad gashes because I have a habit of taking in rats people don't treat properly and then everyone seems to know someone that knows WHO will take them in once they aren't wanted anymore. >_< They could be terrified to ever be comfortable in your home, the chihuahua might decide the rats are something to chase or try to play with which wouldn't be fun for the rats. 

I let my rats out onto my bed when I get home from work for an hour or so.. then take care of chores, errands, dinner, etc. then I let them out again before bed time for up to 3 hours and we mostly watch TV together (or they choose to goof off while I watch tv). I have never had a problem with rats leaping off the bed. Rats don't have the best eyesight and don't like to jump where they can't see bottom, ie. the edge of bed to the floor. The bathroom or bathtub, sounds like a good place -as long as there are no gaps or holes between cabinets, closets, pipes, or heating / cooling vents. 

It would be cool if you got them a old box (from popcorn or tissues, etc.) that they have as a "safe spot" so when they are startled or frightened they will just run into the box and not somewhere you'll lose them. You can coax them out of the box with treats, usually. You could then choose a comforting noise (clicking your tongue, etc.) that you only make when they get a treat.. so one day -when you want them to come to you, if you make that noise they should come running looking for a treat! (like shaking the box of biscuits or food bag for a dog)


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## DazzleKitty (Dec 11, 2011)

Thanks for the tips, mink.  I'll avoid introducing them to Dixie. If I do bring the rats into the living room (which is part of Dixie's kingdom, LOL), I will have to have Dixie kejep her distance. She likely WILL keep her distance anyways because she'll be uneasy or afraid of the rats. I'm honestly a little afraid she'll feel sad or jealous. I know I am probably giving her far too much personification, but that's one of my fears, believe it or not. She's a pushover sometimes and I don't want her to feel that way.
I'll let them on the bed when Dixie isn't on it....that's her "throne", lol. The dog is so pampered I have to make fun of the situation, haha!

I'd like to give them lots of time on the bed or other areas. If they are afraid of jumping, then that's to my benefit. I heard hamsters don't mind doing a kamikaze dive so I am assuming the rats have more sense, which is great.

Were any of you a little intimidated by the idea of getting two rats at first? I really am excited about it but I am also afraid of me being a bad owner. I try to follow steps well and do things right. I'm a pessimist at times, I am. I really am wanting to get a couple of them. Would letting them out for a about two hours each day be enough time for them? I don't want them to feel neglected if that's not enough. I work nights and ten hour days. Additionally, my commute to work takes up another two hours (hour there, hour home). On my days off I will have plenty of time to spend with them, but my work days they may have less time out of the cage.

I have read up on how you can teach them to come when called and litterbox train them. That sounds like a fun little challenge. 

Sorry for all the crazy questions. I want to be prepared.


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## Kinsey (Jun 14, 2009)

Two hours is plenty.

I actually started with just one rat, then found out he needed a buddy. It ended up being months before I could get him a friend.

Now I have five, and it's a bit of work but since 4 live in a group it's not so bad. The other one is just a baby.


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## Korra (Dec 11, 2011)

Mine are with my Jack Russell/chihuahua mix every single night when they come out to play. She gently nibbles on them and lets them run all over her. She begs me to take the rats out  (Maybe cuz she knows I will be giving treats to everyone though! She will steal treats right out of the rats mouth!) 
However, my Lab/Rott mix will be sweet to them but he licks his lips often and reacts if they make a sudden jerky movement. So I tend to have him out of them room when ever the rats are out. 
It kind of all depends on your dog. The Jack was exposed to small animals since she was young and doesn't have a prey drive for them. She enjoys hanging out with them instead!

I doubt you will be a bad owner  You will want to play with them so much! I often take mine out for just a moment when I running by to kiss them then continue on about my business.

Mine have never jumped off the bed. The bed is where they run around at night, the couch, and often times I will go run and get something or make something to eat upstairs. Once when I came back, I found Yue but Korra was gone; she was underneath one of my dressers, she has learned how to climb down the bed skirt


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## Ressal (Oct 18, 2011)

DazzleKitty said:


> Were any of you a little intimidated by the idea of getting two rats at first? I really am excited about it but I am also afraid of me being a bad owner. I try to follow steps well and do things right. I'm a pessimist at times, I am. I really am wanting to get a couple of them. Would letting them out for a about two hours each day be enough time for them? I don't want them to feel neglected if that's not enough. I work nights and ten hour days. Additionally, my commute to work takes up another two hours (hour there, hour home). On my days off I will have plenty of time to spend with them, but my work days they may have less time out of the cage.
> 
> I have read up on how you can teach them to come when called and litterbox train them. That sounds like a fun little challenge.
> 
> Sorry for all the crazy questions. I want to be prepared.


Don't worry, I was in an identical situation to you back in March when I first got my girls. Definitely get two rats. Imagine being stuck in a room alone for hours at a time and then when somebody _finally_ comes in to see you, they don't even speak english. Rats need to be kept with their own species. It would be cruel to deprive them of company unless it's under exceptional circumstances. Two hours of time out their cage will be enough if kept in a pair. You'll quickly look forward to coming home and spending time with your ratty friends. Have you read about the differences in gender i.e females more active/males more chilled out? If not, it's worth having a quick read to make absolute sure you want females. I skipped over the gender differences whilst reading about pet rats and if I were to get rats now, I'd have got males (not that I'd give my girls up for anything) but it's just something to think about.


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## GhostMouse (Sep 6, 2011)

Korra said:


> Mine are with my Jack Russell/chihuahua mix every single night when they come out to play.


Nothing to contribute, but I read this as Jack Russell/chinchilla mix, and I was super confused.


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## Korra (Dec 11, 2011)

Yes That is the new species that I have bred. They are quite beautiful


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