# Rat mannerisms towards pet rabbit



## Lyubvi (Mar 19, 2012)

Hi all!

I'm a new rat owner, and I have a few questions about my pet rat.

I have a pet rabbit, who is still very young, and I recently got a rat. I've spent the past few days socializing the rat to me, she's been out of her cage and spending most of her time running around on my bed. 

She's not jumping into my arms or anything yet, but she has started grooming me.

I've had her and the rabbit out on the bed together before, but the rat spent all day on the bed today, and when I put the rabbit on the bed, my rat began to jump on her back, and it looked like she was nipping at the bunny.

Now, my rabbit didn't make any noises of pain or anything, but she did jump away a few times, and every time I put my rabbit on my lap, the rat would come over and get between us.

I'm worried because I don't know if the rat was trying to play with the bunny, or was attacking. How can I tell the difference between a rat playing and a rat being aggressive?


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## shawnalaufer (Aug 21, 2011)

In both aggression and play, rats usually go for the neck, LOL. In aggression, their fur is usually standing up, all puffed up, and they sometimes hiss. 

Here are some great links that help explain a bit more details.
http://www.ratbehavior.org/Glossary.htm
http://www.ratbehavior.org/Aggression.htm
http://www.ratbehavior.org/RatPlay.htm


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## ratjes (Mar 26, 2011)

It would be more fun for both your rat and bunny to have a friend of their own species.


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## Iheartroxyrat (Feb 22, 2012)

sounds like the rat was trying to play.. lol but they dont understand each others language so there might be some accidental bites or owies. :-/ do you think you will get a second bun bun and rattie?  having two rats is double the fun! i thought id be good with one but i got a second one and im way glad i did! my husband calls the new rat "his" and its so much fun watching them play games with each other and groom  sooo cute!!


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## Babs (Jan 26, 2012)

I adopted one of my rats from a live-in situation with a rabbit gone wrong. A girl had been keeping her rat and rabbit together, she walked in one day and her rat had drawn blood from the rabbit. I don't know if this is a constant, but it's my only experience of a rat and rabbit living together.


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## ratjes (Mar 26, 2011)

Rats are known to injure or kill other species. They are both prey and predatory animals. Never leave them alone with them.


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## Lyubvi (Mar 19, 2012)

Thanks for all the help guys!

I know that people have had both a rabbit and a rat and they've worked together fine, but I do take my precautions.

They both have different cages, and when they're both out they're ALWAYS supervised. 

As for getting two rats or two bunnies, I breed rabbits but I am not considering making another one a house bunny. Two rats is also iffy for me, I'm considering it, but not if this rat is going to get the other rat to attack the rabbit too.

I guess I will just keep trying to socialize them, hoping that my rat just doesn't understand what the rabbit is and will get used to her. It should help that they're both females.


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## A.ngelF.eathers (Jul 6, 2011)

Lyubvi said:


> As for getting two rats or two bunnies, I breed rabbits but I am not considering making another one a house bunny. Two rats is also iffy for me, I'm considering it, but not if this rat is going to get the other rat to attack the rabbit too.


That could easily be solved by not letting the rats interact with the bunny. I don't know about bunnies, but rats are highly social and really should not be kept alone.


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## 1a1a (May 6, 2011)

I had 2 rats and a rabbit once when I was younger, one rat had no interest in the rabbit, the other must have had some kind of inferiority complex cos every time she and the rabbit crossed paths, she'd nip the rabbit on nose. Not aggro, just dominating, but I wouldn't leave the 2 together in hindsite. And I would endorse getting your ratty a rat companion. http://scientopia.org/blogs/scicuri...nely-lady-rats-may-really-eat-their-feelings/


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## ratjes (Mar 26, 2011)

A.ngelF.eathers said:


> That could easily be solved by not letting the rats interact with the bunny. I don't know about bunnies, but rats are highly social and really should not be kept alone.


I have two bunnies and they are always together, doing things at the same time. Rabbits lve in colonies in the wild so they are social. Most bunnies live horrific lives on wire floors without any enrichment.


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## ratjes (Mar 26, 2011)

A.ngelF.eathers said:


> That could easily be solved by not letting the rats interact with the bunny. I don't know about bunnies, but rats are highly social and really should not be kept alone.


<br><br>I have two bunnies and they are always together, doing things at the same time. Rabbits live in colonies in the wild so they are social. Most domestic bunnies live horrific lives on wire floors without any enrichment and alone.


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## 1a1a (May 6, 2011)

That's the rabbit at my local, appearingly supplies only, pet store (no other pets, just one full grown bunny). I feel for him, I am sure that is not the house-bunny's situation though.


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## A.ngelF.eathers (Jul 6, 2011)

ratjes said:


> I have two bunnies and they are always together, doing things at the same time. Rabbits lve in colonies in the wild so they are social.


See, I didn't know that. I thought rabbits were content to live alone. I've learned something today.


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## GhostMouse (Sep 6, 2011)

If you are not willing to get a second rat, you should find a different home for her. Rats are extremely social and need other members _of their own species_ to live with. Imagine if the only social interaction you had was with the rat and the bunny. You'd be horribly lonely for human companionship, for conversation, for human affection, and no amount of talking to or cuddling with the rat or the bunny could make up for that. The rat feels the same way. Apparently so does the bunny. It is not fair to keep these animals alone, since if they had a choice they would not live alone.


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## ratjes (Mar 26, 2011)

GhostMouse said:


> If you are not willing to get a second rat, you should find a different home for her. Rats are extremely social and need other members _of their own species_ to live with. Imagine if the only social interaction you had was with the rat and the bunny. You'd be horribly lonely for human companionship, for conversation, for human affection, and no amount of talking to or cuddling with the rat or the bunny could make up for that. The rat feels the same way. Apparently so does the bunny. It is not fair to keep these animals alone, since if they had a choice they would not live alone.


Very true. If we all could see the world from our pets' view, many more pets would have a better life.


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## PitterPatter (Feb 28, 2012)

Yes, but you people are telling her to get rid of her rat rather than work it out. How mean is that? If someone told me I should have gotten rid of my cockatiel because I wanted him to be alone after 10 years of being around other birds I would be angry. He has me. And they're a social, flocking bird. It so happened I adopted another cockatiel who desperately needed someone with my knowledge. 
I had a rat who lived on her own for 2 years before my ex had her for another. She was fine, and then when we tried to give her a friend she viciously attacked the other rat. Yhin spent at least an hour with me a day, and when she wasn't out I talked to her all the time and told her how my day was. She was happy and healthy with toys and a big cage.


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## PitterPatter (Feb 28, 2012)

I strongly suggest separate play times for both animals. I have 7 pets here and my girlfriend's cat at her house and they all get attention. When I have the rats out and on the bed I lead the dogs out so we can have private time. I go on separate walks with my dogs rather than going together so they have my full attention and I, theirs. I barely have time for the birds but I let Bungie out to fly around and say hello to my Mom's budgie in the livingroom. The other bird is still too fresh for me to touch, rather I ask how she is a lot and stick my hands in the cage often to get her used to me.
What I'm getting at is you can do one thing at a time, rather than stress the poor bunny out with your rat. If you choose, get a second rat of the same sex and introduce them slowly. I also suggest not breeding the bunny. There's too many unwanted animals in the world and it breaks my heart. Take it from an ex breeder.
A bunny usually fairs well on it's own, coming out a good portion of the day to play. A rat can be built a large play area, or be given a huge cage with many toys to keep him busy. Carry him around on your shoulders when you're doing things around the house or just pop your hand in the cage once an hour to say hi and give a pet.


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## GhostMouse (Sep 6, 2011)

If you'll reread my post, you will see that I said "*If you are not willing to get a second rat*, you should find a different home for her."

It's a conditional statement. I am not trying to be mean, rather, I'm trying to give advice concerning this rat's well-being. It's like saying, "_If you aren't willing to give this rat water_, you should find a different home for her." Obviously, I'm assuming that the OP will want to take the best care of her rat, and give her food and water and friends and so on. But if she isn't willing to, she should give the rat to a home that is.

I have witnessed firsthand a rat who was "fine" and who appeared quite happy, who had been kept alone for his whole year of life. I really thought he was happy to be on his own. Then I tried to introduce him to my pair of boys. It took hard work, and several frightening looking scuffles, but they are now inseparable. If Buster was happy before, he's exuberant now. I can hardly articulate the change that occurred in him when he was finally able to live with other rats. 

I'm sure your girl wasn't suffering horribly or anything. I don't mean to imply that she was. But once you've seen the change they go through when introduced to a friend, you will understand why I would never want to see a rat kept alone.

And yes, rats will fight new rats entering their territory, so introductions are a process that will take time. It might be days, it might be weeks, it might be months. It all depends on the rats involved. And yes, there are some combinations of rats that will never work. That does not mean you should not try.

I'm under the impression that social birds can be kept alone if given adequate interactions with humans. I don't know enough about birds to use them as a comparison for rats. I only really know rats and cats.

I agree that the rats and bunny should not play together. I also agree that she should probably not be breeding rabbits.


PitterPatter, I'm not trying to be rude, but I find the color and font choice you are using to be incredibly difficult to read. The orange on this pale background hurts my eyes, and your font choice only makes it smaller and harder to read. I don't know if I'm the only one having this problem.


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## PitterPatter (Feb 28, 2012)

GhostMouse said:


> If you'll reread my post, you will see that I said "*If you are not willing to get a second rat*, you should find a different home for her."
> 
> It's a conditional statement. I am not trying to be mean, rather, I'm trying to give advice concerning this rat's well-being. It's like saying, "_If you aren't willing to give this rat water_, you should find a different home for her." Obviously, I'm assuming that the OP will want to take the best care of her rat, and give her food and water and friends and so on. But if she isn't willing to, she should give the rat to a home that is.
> 
> ...



Sorry. I like both the font and colour. The only other colours I use are lime green and black, and there's too much plain text on this forum, lol.
I understand you're not being rude. I understand your point of view. I have two boys now and they're happy as can be but if she wants just one rat and loves that rat by no means would I ever tell someone to get rid of a loved pet because they don't have the time to bring in another rat, or simply because they want it to be their only rat. Yes, they are happier in 2+, but they still can achieve a happy life on their own; what bothered me was the fact you would say "you should get rid of her if you won't get another rat". It was as selfish as you feeling it would be selfish for someone to keep a rat solo. 
Also, about the birds. Bungie was a breeder. He's always been around other birds and was parent raised and had way less than a hand fed pet parrot. That's his difference. He's not human friendly. Though he still steps up and tolerates pets and me spreading his wings and touching his feet.


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## 1a1a (May 6, 2011)

Lol, slight derail, you're coming through much clearer in black Pitterpatter :-D


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## GhostMouse (Sep 6, 2011)

That is so much easier to read, thank you! They are both nice, just not together on this background, at least for me!

I feel like it is selfish to keep a pet if you cannot meet their most basic needs (food, water, companionship, shelter, vet care). I'm not sure how it is selfish to tell someone they need to find a solution, even if that includes rehoming. I'm not asking her to give me the rat. But I can see how my first sentence may have sounded rude and certainly could have been phrased better.


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## PitterPatter (Feb 28, 2012)

1a1a said:


> Lol, slight derail, you're coming through much clearer in black Pitterpatter :-D


;~; Oh but I love my orange~.


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## PitterPatter (Feb 28, 2012)

GhostMouse said:


> That is so much easier to read, thank you! They are both nice, just not together on this background, at least for me!
> 
> I feel like it is selfish to keep a pet if you cannot meet their most basic needs (food, water, companionship, shelter, vet care). I'm not sure how it is selfish to tell someone they need to find a solution, even if that includes rehoming. I'm not asking her to give me the rat. But I can see how my first sentence may have sounded rude and certainly could have been phrased better.


Yes. I just feel that she spends time with this rat. This is good enough companionship. I'm sure she applies everything else, as well. 
Just asking someone to re-home an animal who is loved and obviously cared for hits a soft spot in me.
If it were different and she couldn't provide vet care or if it were sick and she let it suffer - this would make my mindset match yours. ^ ^


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## ratjes (Mar 26, 2011)

Pitterpatter, thanks for changing to the black color. If you read the content of this forum you' ll find that the black color is not boring as it won't distract from the good information on here.


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