# do you take your rats outside the house?



## noMoreFaith

my girl Sabbath always climbs on my shoulder and likes staying there while I go around the house...i thought why not take her out when she grows bigger? i've read that other people take their rats for a walk. has any of you tried such a thing? if so, is it better to use a harness and take it out like a dog, or just have it on your shoulder? some people have them in a bag or a hoodie, or just on their shoulder, but won't the rat jump off??


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## Capistrono

I think that really depends on the rat. My calmest and oldest boy, Gabe, will cooperate pretty well if I take him out as long as I'm wearing a hoodie, and I think he enjoys it. We have a table on our little patio area and it's too tall for him to jump it so I put him up there sometimes. Though I've never tried it, a lot of people use these: http://www.petco.com/product/5025/Four-Paws-Safety-Iguana-Leash-and-Harness.aspx
If your girls are small and squirmy it might be hard to use, but you could give it a shot. It's pretty cheap.


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## SRGaudio1

definitely shoulder rides outside. i go on walks with my girls on my shoulder all the time. Sometimes they even go to the gas station with me. Such a conversation piece!  on the other hand, I couldnt get my girls to wear a harness if their life depended on it.


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## hshelton

I take tilly out all the time and just let her run around so her nails don't get so sharp and she loves it. I just keep a VERY close eye on her. As for the other two, they move to quickly and don't listen to me so I don't trust them outside just yet.


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## noMoreFaith

SRGaudio1 said:


> definitely shoulder rides outside. i go on walks with my girls on my shoulder all the time. Sometimes they even go to the gas station with me. Such a conversation piece!  on the other hand, I couldnt get my girls to wear a harness if their life depended on it.


wow...and still, won't the rat jump off? this is the part that scares me the most :-\


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## ration1802

Not to unknown or dangerous places. The only places my rats go is into my front garden occasionally to sit on my lap or to the vets. Anywhere else they are generally in their cat carrier.

It's not that I don't trust them, because I am fairly sure that none of my rats will attempt to run away from me. But it only takes that one loud noise or one strange thing to startle them and cause them to panic. And if they disappear or, god forbid, get hurt or killed in the process ... there's only one person to blame (and that's not the rat). 

I don't want to risk it. As much as I'd love to .. I've seen how rats startle and there isn't a hope in ****'s chance of catching them if they do.


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## lilspaz68

I agree with Ration. Under complete supervision, not wandering around with a rat on my shoulder. Never in a park, I have heard of birds of prey swooping down and taking your rat away, etc.


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## noMoreFaith

i was thinking of taking them for a walk in the neighborhood around my house, it's a really quiet place, no cars, ocassionally a few people walk by, few cats and dogs. so i guess i should buy an adjustable harness, and carry a bag they like to hide into, and in case they try to climb down, i could grab the leash or allow them to hide if scared.


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## Overload

noMoreFaith said:


> SRGaudio1 said:
> 
> 
> 
> definitely shoulder rides outside. i go on walks with my girls on my shoulder all the time. Sometimes they even go to the gas station with me. Such a conversation piece!  on the other hand, I couldnt get my girls to wear a harness if their life depended on it.
> 
> 
> 
> wow...and still, won't the rat jump off? this is the part that scares me the most :-\
Click to expand...

Highly unlikely


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## Nekopan

I take my boys on short excursions on my shoulder and to the park to play in the grass. At the park, they mostly just hide in my coat or under my legs. I have had them jump/fall to the ground a couple times, but they don't try to run. Usually they just try to climb back up my pantleg.


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## ema-leigh

I think it depends more on the rat, and as lilspaz said... always keep them within arms reach as theres birds who will just swoop down and take them. 

I sometimes make an outdoor playarea for them on my deck, which is under a balcony, so safer from birds.


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## flox

ema-leigh said:


> as lilspaz said... always keep them within arms reach as theres birds who will just swoop down and take them.


Wow. I'm glad I live in the UK where we have slightly less insane wildlife.


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## Speedboat

I live in a city, and don't have to worry about birds of prey much.

I have always went for walks with rats on my shoulders, hoodies, and hoods. They love it! They are normally my calm rats, *I don't recommend you do it with a jumpy rat.*

If they rat is jumpy and not use to the noise, and doesn't trust you, I DO think it would jump off. It is good to make them well socialized to both people and noises at a young age. That way if they hear a loud noise they won't freak, and if someone is interested and want to pet them they can...be sure to take hand sanitizer with you. People that want to pet the rat should use the sanitizer. 

I wouldn't use a harness on a sidewalk, do to the streets, and rats being fast. 

-Hilary


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## Simisama

Yes - be careful about birds. My mom's friend had her rat on her shoulder and a bird scooped down and just took the poor thing. Never saw her again.  It was so fast and unexpected.
So yeah, just be on the lookout.


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## noMoreFaith

^that sucks...i thought birds don't just attack when their prey is on a human...i feel relieved now i don't have any birds flying around here! only cats... anyway i took them for a walk yesterday, there is a small playground almost next to my house, where kids rarely show up...i let them climb around the benches and the swings...Sabbath was scared, but Salem loved it-i took her there 3 times and back home, she kept following me around, and climbing on my shoulder again!


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## Nienor

I would NEVER EVER take a rat outside just for fun. The only time my rats leave home if in a save transporter to go to the vet.
It is not only dangerous for they might jump away when in fear - don't ask why people "find" pet rats in subway stations or in parks .. They also get in contact with so many parasites and pathogens. There might be predators - I heard of a dog being next to two girl and in one second it turned jumped and got their rat and killed it. If a rat falls down, it will run away to get to cover and on its way it might be killed by a dog or a person - outside their are people that really hate rats, jump on them or strike them death with their umbrella or whatever they find.
Harnesses are no good for rats, their body is not build to be walked on a lead. Either it is too loose and the rats might lose it when running away or it might choke them.
But anyway, rats are to sensitiv animals, even a little wind can give them a cold. Outside their are so many people carrying bacteria causing cold and other diseases and rats are not vaccinated against anything. They get human diseases. And for most rats it is just stress. They are outside their save home, new noises, new smells - that is just too much for a neophobis animal.

I just recommend you not to take your rat outside on your shoulder. For the rats sake. It is no fun for it. If you have bad luck, it runs away and gets killed. If you are a bit luckier it just gets sick and if you have great luck it hides its stress and just freezes. 
Some shoulder rats tend to keep frozen when put into a normal cage - that was a rat found outside for its stupid owner had to carry her outside. Sorry, but that is my opion I want to keep my rats the best way possible taking them outside does not belong to that and is cruel and dangerous in my opinion. 
Just look at the rats found outside or scrared frozen or sick rats because of this stupidity and you know why I am thinking that way.


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## Capistrono

I have to say, Nienor, that you are being a bit too harsh on this subject. yes, you must be VERY careful when taking a rat outside but I think some do enjoy it and all aren't terrified of the outdoors as you say. You simply have to be careful which rats you take out and where you take them. I took all 3 of mine out once, 2 liked it, one did not so I won't make him go out again. But for the 2 that do like it, I think it's a great experience for them to be able to get fresh air and maybe play a little in the grass. Not all bad like you say.


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## Jaguar

I've taken Miles out many places with me - movie stores, department stores, etc. He likes to lay in my hood and poke his nose out and sniff around. The only place where I wouldn't take him is a food store, because even though we all know that rats aren't dirty and diseased, it's against the store policies anyway and I'd hate to get in trouble : He absolutely -loves- all the attention and exploring he gets. People are usually very surprised to see that I take him out places with me and how well behaved he is. Others say "Eww" and shuffle away from me haha. Nienor, rats can't catch colds, and catching colds from wind, etc. is a long disproven myth. There are actually -very- few illnesses, if any, that humans can transmit to rats, although I would be wary of taking them out somewhere that was populated with wild rats. If they're properly restrained or secured and they enjoy the outing, why not take them out for a bit? They'll love the extra scratches and attention and interaction with new people, and perhaps you can make some new friends and educate and inform some people along the way


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## ema-leigh

I take all my rats out and about, and whilst yes there are some very strict safety precautions I take... its defiantly not a life or death situation to take your rat outdoors. I do agree that you should only ever take one rat at a time though, and when you know the rat! 

And for the comment about the dog who was fine one second and snapped the next. Theres no such thing. All dogs display tense behaviour before escalating, obviously the humans didn't pick up on this...

Theres safe ways to do things...


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## TamSmith

One of my girls loves to sit on the porch with me. She stays on me at all times though. Another one loves to go for car rides so she gets to go with me (in my snuggle scarf) if I'm ever going to pick up food at the drive through. Other than that, they don't really go outside. I don't think it's completely safe mostly because I don't trust them to stay with me if they get scared.


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## Nienor

I don't think I am to harsh on it. It is just nothing that belongs to good rat keeping. You propably never saw a rat that has fallen down and been picked up by rescuers in a subway station oder that had a pneumonia due to being outside. Rats can get human diseases, that is no myth. We are closely related enough.

I translated you an Infotext with google translator from this side : http://www.rattenforum.de/phpbb/faq/faq.php?display=faq&nr=65&catnr=2&prog=1&lang=de



> Should I take my rat to go outside?
> A: Clear answer: No!
> Why?
> Because of the dangers for animals and keepers!
> 
> - By other people, animals or other the rat can be frightened and flee.
> The argument you mentioned is * mine will not * is humbug no one can guarantee at any time for the conduct of his rat.
> 
> - By other people, animals or other the rat can be violated.
> A dog snaps, a bump elbows in the crowd or a loading door breaks the backbone of horny oh so protected sweatshirt, a quick blow to the shield by a shocked mother sweeps the Schnuffelnase from shoulder.
> This is a horror picture, but bloody reality.
> 
> - By other people, animals or other operator can be injured.
> There were already wobbly teeth by young people, who felt provoked. And a dog that wants to reach with the shoulder of the hunting instinct awakened rats holder is often not very considerate.
> 
> - The rat can be infected with various diseases.
> An article in the Rattgebers no fewer than 17 different parasites are enumerated, which may be transferred, including through contact with the feces of infected, wild animals. In addition, problems are threatening the airways by drafts, circulatory problems caused by extreme temperatures and injury to the retina by direct sunlight. Not for nothing rats are described as * * twilight.
> 
> A side note:
> Rats will not go outside!
> The apparent curiosity and activity she lay in unknown parts of the day is sheer survival instinct, and pure stress.
> Standing on the menu of a long series of predators, the rat instinctively tries to explore as soon as possible escape routes. (Cf. Oliver Schleifs Dissertation)
> Most satisfied is the rat, if present in a popular area known paths. And held to as little fluchtauslösende events.
> 
> "The constant fear of something new can shorten the life expectancy significantly. These so-called neophobia, at least in rats leads to increased levels of certain stress hormones. The American scientists in the journal PNAS (online advance publication, DOI report: 10.1073/pnas.2535721100).
> 
> In their study, the psychologists began twenty-eight brown rats (Rattus norvegicus) from a new environment. Analyzed by using the response of rodents to the unknown environment of several blood samples: At various times, they removed the rats from their new home and changed a property before they brought back the animals. Extremely anxious rats that had moved into a new environment not often, significantly higher levels of so-called glucocorticoid hormones as inquisitive rats, the researchers concluded. The same hormones are released from the nervous system in humans in emergency or stressful situations.
> 
> Whether the constant fear of health and aging effects of the animals, the researchers conducted a second study. In addition, they observed two p.m. communities, each with three rats, one suffered from neophobia, from childhood to old age. Rats with neophobia killed up to six months rather than their roommate. The disease can affect the whole life of those affected and cause physical damage due to the unnaturally high levels of hormones. This can lead to premature death, the researchers explain. "
> (Source: http://www.wissenschaft.de/wissen/news/233339.html)
> 
> For a necessary transport (for example, to the vet) to transport cages in a reasonably large pockets have proved very successful.
> The rat is being protected from view, draft and stress and the holder does not need any unpleasant questions from neighbors or others to be feared.


And yet another informational text :

Rats take outside?

Now and again you see, unfortunately, still rat owners that carry out their animals with them, which contradicts all the principles of humane attitude rats. Also runs in the garden - even fenced - or even complete keeping outside as is possible in rabbits and guinea pigs, is absolutely unsuitable for rats and downright negligent.

Respiratory diseases and parasites

Basically, rats very sensitive animals that are prone to respiratory diseases. These are often not really harmless, there can develop rapidly from a seemingly innocuous respiratory infection, pneumonia, in which - if untreated - rats can also die. An immediate veterinary care, and treatment with antibiotics is absolutely necessary.
It is already at home that you have to look for this - take rats out, it is unnecessary here from a much higher risk.

From dogs and cats, we know that they can get themselves out fleas, ticks, mites or other parasites. Often with them proactively worked with spot ons, so the infestation is contained. Rats are treated do not precautionary measure and it can not be recommended too, for effective antiparasitic are always neurotoxins that burden even the animals treated accordingly, so that must be used in small animal antiparasitics only curative, no preventive.

Predators and other people

Outside the door a lot of enemies waiting for a rat: dogs, cats, birds of prey, not least other people. If a rat whatever reason, terrified, or you are bumped and the rat flees or falls down, she is exposed to all enemies in the area virtually unprotected. A frightened rat into a totally unknown environment you trying to hide, it is no longer practicable to capture them in such a situation, and it is for dogs or other predators an easy target. Even if they meet somewhere and hides to other rats, this is not a fluke: rats do not tolerate intruders in their area, the rat is killed, and possibly bitten. To escape the rat can easily become victims of road traffic, as well as any other animal. Not least are rats for many other people still "disgusting" animals that must be killed immediately.

Small animal lines, as they will unfortunately still be offered in the trade are against these risks, not the solution: it a rat falls slightly, so to free a leash, be it that they get out (to avoid this, one would need line so tightly laced that they strangled the rat), or gnaw through the straps. Danger by wind and weather, or other people can not reduce a line as well. Reasons of animal welfare lines are generally dangerous small animals, especially for rats to reject completely.

Rats do not need any exciting trips

We humans find variety and interesting excursions - but the human interest may not be transferred to rats: Rats are pack animals and stuck to their territory : in their area and the only place where they feel safe. In unfamiliar surroundings they are under stress and trying to hide. Although rats - particularly in the safe territory - very curious and like to explore their environment, they are - especially alone and in unfamiliar surroundings - neophobic. For a rat, it is not a "fun", from the familiar environment to be ripped out and have no opportunity to retreat to their familiar, safe spot on, it means fear and stress, not welcome change.
Rats look comparatively bad, they do not enjoy "beautiful view". Rats are crepuscular, i.e. their active phases are reinforced in the evening and early morning hours, "tours" with them oppose not only their need to stay in their herd and their area, but also impairs their biorhythms.

Outside, lurking for our rats dangers, anxiety and stress, and trying to take them outside, Fancy rat brings unnecessarily in situations that can risk be up to the danger, therefore, both short trips or to open air as well be classified as cruel treatment such as complete keeping outside.
Should it be necessary to leave the apartment with a rat - eg for vet visits - so the rats be housed in appropriate transport boxes in which they are properly protected.




Maybe some of you may think about what they do to their rats while taking out and don't do it again for the rats sake.


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## ema-leigh

I still have to say that I consider taking my rats outside safe. I know my rats, and the LOVE going outside. I only take one rat at a time and they are within arms reach or on my shoulder. I do use leashes while getting the rats used to being outside, as a precaution. I occasionally give presentations, and I take my most outgoing rats for everyone to hold and pet (don't worry quarantine procedures are in place)

Alternatively, I make a small playpen outside with toys and hideouts (under a roof, IE balcony) and let small groups play at a time. 

Theres considerations as to where you take your pet. Obviously busy places, or those teaming with animals wouldn't be safe. Also we are not going to take them out when its really hot or cold. 

Like I said before, dogs don't just suddenly snap at a rat on your shoulder. And I wouldn't allow my rats close to dogs I didn't know anyway. The likely hood of someone bumping into me, or hitting my rat is very unlikely. And one could argue the same thing could happen indoors. I think if you know your rat, and take precautions, its safe and stimulating for them.


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## clarry

I must agree with the majority here, I personally haven't taken my rats out, but thats because we live in a flat so dont have a graden, if we did I would most definitley have taken my boy Moscow out when he was alive, I knew him inside out and I would KNOW if he wasnt enjoying it. I think if I were going to take mie out I would start there first and see how they got on in the garden.
I know its not the same but I had a house rabbit some years back, who very rarely went out but when the weather was nice we would bundle him into the car and take him over to my nans garden and he LOVED it. I see this as a similar principle, the outside is their natural habbitat and if you know your animal well enough, you will know if they are enjoying it. 
As far as pneumonia goes, well that will only happen if you taken them out in the cold, and dont take precautions to make sure they are wrapped up. I cant see that people would be that irresponsible as to walk their rats on a day that wasnt completely warm. I personally would treat them as though I had a baby; take them out into the garden on hot days and then sit in the shade with them and watch them. 
The person whos dog snapped at their rat obviosuly didnt know their dog very well, and that kind of thing could happen inside or outside the house. A lot of people let their rats and dogs play together supervised, so the same thing could be applied to this. 
I would echo what everyone else has said, you just have to be VERY cautious


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## noMoreFaith

well, the smallest of my girls was a little scared. and if she doesn't like it, i won't make her go out with me again. but the other one (i've taken her for 5 or 6 walks by now) likes it. When we get home, she climbs again on my shoulder, and waits to take her out again. And it's not that she just likes to sit there. She has understood that each time she is there, i am taking her somewhere outside. She was a little careful at first, but now she doesn't mind sitting around. She is not frozen with fear or anything. Of course I agree that the owner must be careful, but some rats apparently like it. 

EDIT: I forgot to mention, I take her out at night. In my neighborhood, it is dark and quiet. I took her once during the day and she didn't like it. More noise, more people, and 1 annoying dog running around frantically and barking at everyone. But when it's dark, she is far more calm. She doesn't jump around. She climbs down when I go next to surfaces she can get at and be safe. I prefer letting her on tall surfaces, since she feels better and has a better view of her enviromment. In an earlier post, I asked why she had fear pooped when I let her in my garden. I believe now that it was the cats and dogs' markings. I've noticed she doesn't mind being outside, when there are no similar smells. That playground I mentioned, is one example. But I do take into consideration some things of what Nienor said. She is right in some parts. But, as long as the owner is careful and the rat in a safe place, I can't see no harm. 

And I understand that we must be wary of the diseases, but in that logic, we shouldn't walk our dogs or cats or any animal. They would be inside our house all day in fear of exposion. ???


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## TamSmith

noMoreFaith said:


> well, the smallest of my girls was a little scared. and if she doesn't like it, i won't make her go out with me again. but the other one (i've taken her for 5 or 6 walks by now) likes it. When we get home, she climbs again on my shoulder, and waits to take her out again. And it's not that she just likes to sit there. She has understood that each time she is there, i am taking her somewhere outside. She was a little careful at first, but now she doesn't mind sitting around. She is not frozen with fear or anything. Of course I agree that the owner must be careful, but some rats apparently like it.
> 
> EDIT: I forgot to mention, I take her out at night. In my neighborhood, it is dark and quiet. I took her once during the day and she didn't like it. More noise, more people, and 1 annoying dog running around frantically and barking at everyone. But when it's dark, she is far more calm. She doesn't jump around. She climbs down when I go next to surfaces she can get at and be safe. I prefer letting her on tall surfaces, since she feels better and has a better view of her enviromment. In an earlier post, I asked why she had fear pooped when I let her in my garden. I believe now that it was the cats and dogs' markings. I've noticed she doesn't mind being outside, when there are no similar smells. That playground I mentioned, is one example. But I do take into consideration some things of what Nienor said. She is right in some parts. But, as long as the owner is careful and the rat in a safe place, I can't see no harm.
> 
> And I understand that we must be wary of the diseases, but in that logic, we shouldn't walk our dogs or cats or any animal. They would be inside our house all day in fear of exposion. ???


While I agree with your post and I think it would be cute to take my rats on my walks with me (if I trusted them haha)

I just wanted to point out that you're not supposed to take your dog on walks because of diseases until they have certain shots. Rats don't get shots for all the diseases they can catch and that's why it can be more dangerous for your rat rather than your dog.


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## oscar betta

I'll mine on my shoulder sometimes when I go out in the yard, but never let him down. Don't want to lose him.


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## bentfish

I've been wanting to take my rats outside with me for walks. Maybe!


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