# Permanent Free Range House



## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

Since one of my rats gets on so well with the other animals and seems to be potty trained, I'm thinking about letting her have the run of the house permanently. 

Has anyone else done this? How did you go about rat-proofing your entire home? Did you try it and then decide against it? Why or why not.

Thanks


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## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

Other than it being a bad idea to allow a rat unsupervised access to preditor animals it is hard to properly rat proof a space. Things to think about are;

1, Wires (especially live) – these need to all be out of reach or in solid plastic / metal tubing or fine mesh, bear in mind that rats are very able at getting behind / under and on top of things. Rats are particularly attracted to live wires.

2, High places – these need an easy route down or something to break falls, rats will climb, some girls can even scale curtains and grippy wallpaper / bricks

3, Exist routes / access into walls / floor boards – there are often gaps big enough for a rat to fit into under the floor / in the walls and outside. This includes leaving windows and doors open. You need to block off anything with more than a few cm’s gap. As a general rule of thumb if a rat head wil fit they can get through

4, Valuables out of reach / locked away – rats are destructive, they seem to be more interested in anything valuable and very much enjoy bulling remote control keys off, eating shoes, bags, emptying purses of money, knocking off your fave ornemant, eating and nesting in your fave posters.

I would suggest starting with one room and see how you get on. Give it a while before you allow her unsupervised access, as useually when you think you’ve finally got it they find another devious way around your rat proofing.


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## moonkissed (Dec 26, 2011)

I know there are some people out there that do it but I just could never imagine it.

I'd super worry about small dangerous spaces- getting behind/under the stove, getting into cleaning supplies, etc...
Isamurat is right about them being good climbers- I have had rats climb up straight/smooth lamp poles! I have also very recently lost a rat that climbed up a book shelf and fell. 

Rats are so destructive. I have personally had rats destroy clothing, purses, chewed off the buttons to a remote, wires, and my very expensive fitbit...

I have seen people with destroyed couches where they chewed their way in. 

And even with a good litter trained rat I would think you would need lots of litter trays around the house so they can easily reach one in need.

I also can not imagine them alone unsupervised with other pets. Even if everyone gets along perfectly just the size difference could be an accident waiting to happen. My step mom's shih tzu was playing with their huge lab and from purely a playful accident lost an eye. Even a small dog is alot less fragile than a tiny rat.


I just do not think for myself personally that I could ever rat proof my home well enough for that, where I would feel comfortable. 
Maybe rat proof a single room and let her have that as a free range haven?


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

moonkissed;2088249} ...from purely a playful accident lost an eye... [/QUOTE said:


> That's the thing I worry about most. I really don't think any of my other pets would intentionally hurt Anga. But she is _soooo_ small. The cats especially want to play with her tail. And since Anga gets up in their faces.........and power grooms them. Well, she tries to anyway!
> 
> Interestingly, I wouldn't worry about her playing with a pit bull at all. I had one who moved new born kittens to where ever mama cat was in the house. I've known MANY people with the same experience. They were actually bred to be nanny dogs.


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

Right now, I'm leaning hard against it.


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

Right now, I'm leaning hard against it.


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

I wouldn't do it for all the reasons stated above. Even if you rat proof to avoid accidents, chances are your rats will figure something out anyway. They will destroy your belongings, so unless you don't mind replacing your sofa, bed box spring/mattress...maybe don't do it. Also they will pee mark your floor, and belongings. Your house will smell bad pretty fast.


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

From personal experience, some rats are naturally pretty good with living free range while some aren't and perhaps most can learn.

When Max was about 4 weeks old she climbed off my bed one night while I was sleeping and moved into a metal cabinet in the kitchen where she pretty much lived her whole life. She didn't steal much and she didn't do any damage around the house, so we pretty much left her alone. Now one evening my wife accidently kicked her and didn't apologize, the next morning all of the wires up to my wife's desk were slashed.... phone, computer and electrical... One night one shot. Coincidence? Perhaps. 

Cloud nibbled a few wires as did Misty, but I pointed and scolded and they stopped pretty fast, then Misty got a fetish for digging the wood chips out of my orchids... that turned into a pretty big argument, but she leaves my plants alone now. 

Our part wild rat was invisible in the house, no damage except for small holes under each piece of furniture where she could evaporate into. Otherwise, you never knew she was there. She left no trace of her existence behind anywhere.

For some reason, most rats attack answering machine wires... 

Fuzzy Rat, got bored and destroyed stuff on purpose to get attention. She cut my phone wires when I was on the phone and headphones while I was listening to music and the speaker wires when I was playing the stereo too loud... Rats apparently get that wires make things work. Strangely enough with all the wires our rats have cut, they never seem to get electrocuted. Fuzzy Rat could chew the insulation off both sides of an extension cord without shocking herself.

So, yes.... I'm really good at soldering wires and most of the wires in my home are soldered and taped, and one of my doors has chew marks where the rats tried to go through and there are a couple of holes in the carpet where they tried to go under the door... mostly from Fuzzy Rat. But overall once rats learn the rules and how to live free range the destruction stops. 

My theory is that it's better to house proof your rats than the other way around, but you are going to lose a few wires and possibly some other stuff while your rats learn the house rules. But to be fair, when I was a kid and we had dogs, we lost a few pairs of slippers and got some furniture chewed with each new puppy.

Lastly make sure your rats have access to a litter box or they will find and create one for themselves.

Best luck.


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

I want to thank everyone for their input and advice. 

This post is a philosophical explanation for my dilemma on allowing my rats to interact with my dogs and cats, and free range in the entire house. It explains how I've come to my decision as well.


_“I'd rather have 30 minutes of wonderful than a lifetime of nothing special”_ 
-Julia Roberts in Steel Magnolias.


This statement had a profound, life changing impact on my life. This is the thing I have had to consider with all of my pets. It's also why I've never had a pet that had to live it's life in a cage. There are many things I've considered in coming to a decision on this subject. What it has come down to is the safety of everyone concerned.

My number one biggest concern are the live wires my rats will chew on. Last night, this tendency of rats hit me hard. 
I had Anga out on my bed last night. I _thought _I had secured all electrical cords. I was wrong. I didn't found out until this morning. The cord of my clip on light that was suspended vey high had been chewed on exposing the copper wire. She could have chewed on it on a previous night. I've been told that rats can get into places you would never think that they could go. So it could have happened last night. I can't say for sure. *Most importantly is the fact that I don't know*. 

Aside from the obvious potential threat to her life, everyone in my house and my neighbors are also at risk. Electrical fires _do happen_. I live in an old house, deep in the country where_ a lot_ of cedar trees grow.* Even green cedar will easily catch fire, even in wet conditions. *This could quickly, easily turn into a nightmare here in Texas especially with long, dry and hot summers. I can't say with confidence that I could rat proof this entire house.

And then I also have to consider this.............

Last night Anga got off of the bed. She was playing with the dog and I lost track of her. I found her about 30 minutes later in the kitchen. 
From now one, I can only bring her out in a secured play area. I have a fence constructed of large pieces of foam board, but after last night, I would feel much safer with something heavier and more durable. 

As important as it is to me that all of my pets have the happiest, most fulfilling life possible, I just can't put so many other lives at risk for the sake of one.


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

catty-ratty said:


> I want to thank everyone for their input and advice. This post is a philosophical explanation for my dilemma on allowing my rats to interact with my dogs and cats, and free range in the entire house. It explains how I've come to my decision as well. _“I'd rather have 30 minutes of wonderful than a lifetime of nothing special”_ -Julia Roberts in Steel Magnolias. This statement had a profound, life changing impact on my life. This is the thing I have had to consider with all of my pets. It's also why I've never had a pet that had to live it's life in a cage. There are many things I've considered in coming to a decision on this subject. What it has come down to is the safety of everyone concerned. My number one biggest concern are the live wires my rats will chew on. Last night, this tendency of rats hit me hard. I had Anga out on my bed last night. I _thought _I had secured all electrical cords. I was wrong. I didn't found out until this morning. The cord of my clip on light that was suspended vey high had been chewed on exposing the copper wire. She could have chewed on it on a previous night. I've been told that rats can get into places you would never think that they could go. So it could have happened last night. I can't say for sure. *Most importantly is the fact that I don't know*. Aside from the obvious potential threat to her life, everyone in my house and my neighbors are also at risk. Electrical fires _do happen_. I live in an old house, deep in the country where_ a lot_ of cedar trees grow.* Even green cedar will easily catch fire, even in wet conditions. *This could quickly, easily turn into a nightmare here in Texas especially with long, dry and hot summers. I can't say with confidence that I could rat proof this entire house. And then I also have to consider this............. Last night Anga got off of the bed. She was playing with the dog and I lost track of her. I found her about 30 minutes later in the kitchen. From now one, I can only bring her out in a secured play area. I have a fence constructed of large pieces of foam board, but after last night, I would feel much safer with something heavier and more durable. As important as it is to me that all of my pets have the happiest, most fulfilling life possible, I just can't put so many other lives at risk for the sake of one.


If you get your rats a DCN, lots of things to explore/play with, and spend time with them; they will be very happy rats. Good you realized the fire hazard, frankly it was my main concern too. I live in a condo, and that would put the whole building at risk.


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

I ordered the DCN a few days ago, thank god!


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

catty-ratty said:


> I ordered the DCN a few days ago, thank god!


Here you go. Happy ratties in the very near future


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

It will be here in two days! So excited! Even if I had decided to let Anga free roam, I still have two other rats who deserve happy lives, too. 

Yesterday, I went shopping for stuff for the new cage. I got a small laundry basket just for their things and little bitty trash can for when I clean up poo and litter boxes. And of course toys! Still trying to figure out what they want to play with. Some like one thing, while another likes something else. Anga loves to drag large pieces of paper around the cage. She's easy! 

Lot's of food dishes so I don't have wash and dry one before feeding them!


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## Isamurat (Jul 27, 2012)

Try getting some corrugated plastic sheets to block off areas or find a good space you can free range with your rats. Whiolst I've got a rat safe (well as far as practical) rat room in the past I've used hallways, bathrooms and even the surface of the guest bed (with a throw over it). I then have some free range toys which I try ad change weekly and spend a good hour or so with them in that space. I did use a fabric 1.5 m diameter puppy play pen once too, though you couldn't leve them in this unsupervised as they could chew out. Its ways of giving them the freedom safely for you and all involved.

I've also had sparking wires in the past from rat gnawing, its scary


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

How do rats strip a wire bare without getting a shock? How do they know which wires they can just snip and which ones they can only nibble on? And why go through all of the trouble to strip bare an extension cord without snipping it?

I'm thinking they strip the wire bare and then hide somewhere nearby and wait for you to accidentally touch the wire and get shocked... then they jump up and down and hi-5 each other and do ratty stomach bumps... and rotfl... shouting "Did you see that human jump!?" in their high pitched ultra-sonic voices. Oddly, I only got zapped once, mostly because I learned to look before I touch a wire... but the wire that got me was right outside the rat cage where the rats had a good view... Fuzzy Rat not only stripped it on both sides, she pulled it from the wall where I would step on it barefoot or reach down and move it... Would she really zap me on purpose? Max and Fuzzy Rat were divas, I know what I believe, but I'll let everyone make up their own mind if I'm being paranoid or not. Cloud and Misty are sweethearts they'd never zap or disconnect their old dad on purpose... 

Amazingly, with all of the stripped wire's I've soldered and taped, I can't say any of our rats actually created a legitimate fire hazard, it's like they got pretty close, but at best left behind a booby trap... But I have to suspect that yes, a rat can create a fire hazard if it wanted to or wasn't thinking about it. On the other hand, if they really snipped the wrong wire the wrong way they would fry themselves and pop the breaker, so the risk of fire may be lower than one might think... Still not good.

I can say once your rats have learned to be home safe, you can pretty much trust them. I let Cloud and Misty out of the cage this morning then I went out and just came home at around 9 PM, all is well, about the same as I left it... no wires cut, no plants molested, nothing stolen as far as I can tell. They are good girls and house safe. Until your rats learn to be house safe... I suppose bad things can happen. 

I would say if you let your rats free range the house, you are going to get some damage at some point or another, but if you own a dog or a cat, you are going to get certain stains on your carpet and a certain amount of damage to your house too... and by the way, if you have kids, you just might have to say good bye to your perfect orderly home too... Pets and kids breed disorder. My aunt always had an impeccably perfect home, it drove my mom crazy just to visit her... my mom would actually sneak around the house looking for dust or dull silverware or anything out of place which she never found... and my mom was a clean freak... but then my aunt never had kids and there were no pets in her house. If you want museum quality living don't let your rats free range in your house, If you can tolerate disorder... rats aren't too much worse then kids and better than some.


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

Today, I went to the fabric store to get more fabric for the DCN coming tomorrow. The lady cutting the fabric asked me what I was doing with so much fleece. I told her it was for my rats, expecting her to have one of those 'You have a rat?? Ewe!' reactions.

Turned out she has rats, too. She has had them as pets all of her life and has always let them free range the entire house. I asked her about my concerns. She said she'd never had any problems like that. She also has cats and dogs. She has some rats that prefer to play with the bigger fur babies. Nothing has ever happened to her ratties. She said, like RD says, the biggest challenge is not stepping on them. 

Hmm. 

I still want to let her roam free. My *second* biggest concern is that wild rats might get in and I will have a lot more rats! I stupidly left a huge box of un-hulled pecans in my closet last year. I found half eaten pecans stored in every conceivable place in my closet, including my shoes. And, lot's of mouse droppings. A lot of work to clean, but no, I didn't not kill any of them. Curiously, neither did my cats. If a mouse can find a way in, I'm certain a rat would have no problem either. 

Going to have to call the vet about getting her spayed, unless RD wants a few wild-domestic mixes!  The only vet I've found that will see a rat here is an hour away. I've gone further than that for my pets, so an hour is really no big deal.

As far as damage to my house...........LOL

I'm practically a rescue for whatever animal happens to show up at my house. I'm a total sucker and willing to put up with an awful lot! I just work around my pets, so to speak. When I buy a couch or chair or whatever, I buy one with fabric that I know either my cats won't want to scratch, or that will hold up well to a little scratching. My couch is also surrounded by cat trees! I pick out bed sheets made of a fiber blend that won't hold onto cat and dog fur. I have replaced molding around the doors, I don't even bother with window screens and I'm VERY good at cleaning up 'accidents'. Zero smell when I'm done. It's the raccoon's that moved in who did the most damage. There must have been 30 or so every night. Many of them came inside my house to hang out, get a free dinner and play with the cats for a bit. I came home one day to find tiny chocolate powder hand prints all over the front end of my house! That took a long time to clean up, but they were still welcome. I made sure not to leave coco powder sitting on the kitchen counter again. 

When I met my husband, I made sure he understood that my pets, and the many that would show up in the future, are part of the package before even agreeing to give him my number. My cats tested him BIG TIME! He passed the test so I married him. 

My animals generally know what things are REALLY important to me and just leave it alone, like the cedar chest that my great grandmother used when moving down to Texas in covered wagon. I've had it for 30 years. Of all the animals I've ever had, and believe me, there have been a lot, no one has ever done permanent damage to it. Everything else can be replaced.

Although, I would like to have my shoe back that the neighbors dog took a few years back. I really liked that pair!


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## Gribouilli (Dec 25, 2015)

Whatever you do guys I wouldn't say to anyone who you don't trust 100% that you have free-ranging rats in your home/apartment. You know how people are when it comes to rats, right? I would hate if they were to call animal control or social services to your home. Better be cautious, just my opinion.


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## Zanie (Dec 30, 2015)

Where I live now, I wouldn't. This house is simply too big to even moderatly rat proof, and I don't live here alone.

However I could certainly see the option in the apartment I had before. It was small and ''clean'' or open.. I had a free range ferret who loved cords/wires, and I've had free range bunnies. I find it pretty easy to block off ways into kitchen cabinets or behind the stove by using wood and wire. I kept all cords neatly locked up (had my computer on a re-modeled old shelf with the cords and electrical outputs inside a locker, made a box for the wires at the TV etc).. I'm not a fan of having a bunch of connected wires anyway. Sure, it would be possible for them to chew into the cabinets, but... And if they snipped a wire, safety stuff would disconnect the power (did so at riddiculosly 6a..I had to chose between vacuuming or having the lightbulb on, I couldn't have both  )

It was a small appartment, and fairly easy to proof. Granted, I'd have to think more about a rat than a ferret or bunny, when it comes to size or climbing.. but I think it could be done. However if I found that they ruined the appartment itself, started chewing the walls or wooden...you know the small boards that line the wall at the floor?..or chose a really bad spot to pee without accepting a litterbox, I might lock them up. I can do tiny repairs (like replacing those wall-boards I mentionen), and some wear and tear are generally accepted.. but I wouldn't put up with a completely ruined home.






Current home (well open part of it)







Old appartment


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## catty-ratty (Feb 21, 2016)

Gribouilli,

I don't have any neighbors close by to worry about. The closest ones already know I'm an animal lover and a freak of nature! 

If anyone calls animal control.........

It just happens that until 3 weeks ago, I worked hand-in-hand with animal control in 3 counties, including the one I live in. They also know I'm a total sucker.


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