# What age should new rats be to introduce to older rats?



## hiddenjumprope (Nov 13, 2013)

I've looked around and I can't find a specific answer.

So I'm going to get one or two more rats for my current boys. The pet store said they are around 6mo. They might be older, Merry seems to be. 

I've read that for introducing new rats to older rats they should be young, and if they are babies they should be 5 weeks. But it doesn't say what the rage should be.

Should they be no older than 3 months? 1 month? 

I know someone who is selling their litter of 3 months old. Is that young enough? Or should I go to a (great) local petstore that is selling babies?


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## bazmonkey (Nov 8, 2013)

http://www.rattyrat.com/guidebook/newrats.html says that rats under 14 weeks are generally accepting of new rats. I don't think that is a hard limit or anything, and 6mo is still relatively young.


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## Snikida (Sep 28, 2013)

The best way is to judge by their size, they need to be big enough to hold their own in a fight. If you get them less than about two months it can have disaster outs results and will end up in a blood bath. I just saw that very scenario today. Hasty introductions and a very very stupid mistake on my part. In about two seconds after the mistake the pup was dead. The aggressor was not harmed at all. 

(For those who are wondering during my introductions today, All was going perfectly well, no warning signs. One of my older rats ran under my bathroom door into the bed room and I turned my back on the youngest two to go get her. In about two seconds I heard the pups screams and by time I got the older one off of her there was no chance of her being rescued.)

So PLEASE learn from my stupid mistake and make sure that the pups are at least two months if not more. 


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## Batman (Sep 11, 2013)

I introduced my ratties to pepper bottom at 8 weeks but my boys are big lol

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## hiddenjumprope (Nov 13, 2013)

Snikida said:


> The best way is to judge by their size, they need to be big enough to hold their own in a fight. If you get them less than about two months it can have disaster outs results and will end up in a blood bath. I just saw that very scenario today. Hasty introductions and a very very stupid mistake on my part. In about two seconds after the mistake the pup was dead. The aggressor was not harmed at all.
> 
> (For those who are wondering during my introductions today, All was going perfectly well, no warning signs. One of my older rats ran under my bathroom door into the bed room and I turned my back on the youngest two to go get her. In about two seconds I heard the pups screams and by time I got the older one off of her there was no chance of her being rescued.)
> 
> ...


Oh my god that's horrible! I'm so sorry. Thank you for the tip.



bazmonkey said:


> http://www.rattyrat.com/guidebook/newrats.html says that rats under 14 weeks are generally accepting of new rats. I don't think that is a hard limit or anything, and 6mo is still relatively young.


Oh it is? I thought 6 months was older. Well good to know!


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Hiddenjumprope,

It sounds like you were dealing with girls... Adult female rats kill pups from another mother... Fuzzy Rat, the very best rat I've ever trained actually was able to stop herself from killing a pup... she sat and ignored it for a few minutes staring directly at me as if controlling her rage, but as soon as the pup tried to nurse she lost her mind and started tossing it around like a rag doll and pounding on it. Thankfully she never bit the pup... Amelia snuck up on my desk when I was training Max as a pup and just like you, I turned away for a second and didn't see Amelia on my desk, and Amelia punched a nasty hole right into Max's side and tried to drag her off and kill her... Max is literally made out of super rubber over cast iron... She is indestructible and she survived. 

I might add that the rat pup Fuzzy Rat abused, eventually went anti-social and left us. And when we finally got to introductions between Max and Amelia we decided to do them outdoors at the safe site... Max is a true shoulder rat and Amelia is apprehensive outdoors so, as Max was still smaller and Amelia is huge for a female rat, we figured it would even the playing field... Max hung out in the pine tree and then leaped down on Amelia biting her fiercely in the back and tore back up the tree where poor old Amelia couldn't follow. Even though Amelia is way larger, she has a big tumor and Max has bitten her a few times since they have been living together... Rat pups do not forget or forgive abuse. In fact Max and Amelia have been together for a few months already and they are finally starting to clean each other's tails and chase each other around on the floor. They are friends, but Max will not be pushed around and will bite another rat without remorse. 

But that is female rats... I believe that with boys older boys actually prefer to be introduced to younger rat pups as young as 5 weeks. They don't have the biological imperative to kill the pups of other female rats.

I have some experience with boys, but you would be best served by someone who has more experience than me and done multiple introductions with males to give you the very best age range.


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

This topic interests me too.. In about 2.5 weeks I'll be getting a couple male pups (probably 4-5 weeks old) that are up for adoption and will then need to decide when to introduce them to my boys... Whose ages I don't really know (I'm assuming quite young since I got them as "small / medium" rats from the petstore just 2 weeks ago). 

I hope you get some feedback from someone with male rat knowledge as well.


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## alexn (Sep 30, 2012)

Poppy was three months ish when I introduced her to my year old girls, and Blossom was 10 weeks or so when the other two were 18 months and 5 months. 

I had no problems at all. Obviously they weren't as young as you plan to do, but just thought I'd throw my experience out there.

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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

For males, you want to get pups under 3mo (12wks) but over 5-6wks. It ensures that they aren't kits (though my male took to his kits very well, and I've heard similar from other forum members) but they aren't competing for dominance. It's not precise, since all males differ. It just makes things easiest. 

Females are quite different and troublesome, however.


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## luvmy4rats (Nov 29, 2013)

When I introduced a younger female rat to my older four month old rat, I waited until the baby _grew big enough_. However, it turned out as time went by my 'baby' rat didn't grow very big but pinned down her bigger normal sized cagemate (my late Rexi) all of the time and started getting aggressive by biting Rexi's ears and later giving her a laceration on her back. Each of the wounds I compressed and put polysporin on and then the girls had to live separately.

I decided to put my girls in a neutral zone to see if territorial aggression was the culprit. Aggression happened in the bathroom as well as under my top, and my aggressor bit Rexi badly and made her bleed again. Rexi never fought back and always submitted which broke my heart. It was then it was decided to not let them spend time together anymore. 

Recently it advised not to allow a baby rat under 12 weeks old around an adult rat because they will attack them. I think when introducing babies to adults it's best to read about it first before a disaster happens as mentioned above. It is sad that a baby was put in a situation where it paid for it with its life. Poor baby.


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## nanashi7 (Jun 5, 2013)

luvmy4rats said:


> Recently it advised not to allow a baby rat under 12 weeks old around an adult rat because they will attack them. I think when introducing babies to adults it's best to read about it first before a disaster happens as mentioned above. It is sad that a baby was put in a situation where it paid for it with its life. Poor baby.


Females will attack and kill pups under 12. Males aren't the same.


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## hiddenjumprope (Nov 13, 2013)

Rat Daddy said:


> Hiddenjumprope,
> 
> It sounds like you were dealing with girls... Adult female rats kill pups from another mother... Fuzzy Rat, the very best rat I've ever trained actually was able to stop herself from killing a pup... she sat and ignored it for a few minutes staring directly at me as if controlling her rage, but as soon as the pup tried to nurse she lost her mind and started tossing it around like a rag doll and pounding on it. Thankfully she never bit the pup... Amelia snuck up on my desk when I was training Max as a pup and just like you, I turned away for a second and didn't see Amelia on my desk, and Amelia punched a nasty hole right into Max's side and tried to drag her off and kill her... Max is literally made out of super rubber over cast iron... She is indestructible and she survived.
> 
> ...


Wrong person, I havent had any females or dead rats on my hands....


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## Rat Daddy (Sep 25, 2011)

Sorry Hiddenjumprope... I meant to address the post to Snikida I think I must have been posting in my sleep again...


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## artgecko (Nov 26, 2013)

Interesting... In my situation, I guess I'll wait a couple weeks after getting them (good quarantine anyway) and then try introducing. I think mine are still under 6 months, so they should be OK.


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